For me I want so see LFS give up on people with historic computers, I dont mean to be snobish but if you cant run DX9 well, its time to move on.

iRacing and nkPro have DX9 and use it in their game and it shows in the graphics department, for me that is an added enjoyment I get from those games vs LFS. not sure but I think its called Dynamic Lighting and DX9 is needed?

[OT] DX11 is coming and sooner or later people will leave for more polished game with cooler graphics and I would hate to see that as I do love LFS. Becase multiplayer is keeping LFS ahead of the rest for now.

The track surface textures is something needed, LFS seems to be a Perfect world, no bumps not much road camber, no signes of track work ever being done. South City has the best road on the face of the planet! Some aphault Concrete, other mixes and texture differances would be greatly appreciated.

I totally agree that FFB in iRacing & nkPro > LFS, but that doesn't mean LFS is bad, Porsches are nice Ferrari's are better.

And more polygons in every area.

I find there are plenty of bumps in the LFS world, maybe cause my FFB is set so high, idk. I have no complaints about the road surfaces in LFS.

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

I find there are plenty of bumps in the LFS world, maybe cause my FFB is set so high, idk. I have no complaints about the road surfaces in LFS.

South City is ok, they have made nice bumps into that but most other tracks are flat.

Aston has some bumps.. you just haev to notice them.

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

I have no complaints about the road surfaces in LFS.

Then you obviously haven't driven nKPro or iRacing.

The track surfaces in LFS (except South City) are billiard table smooth in comparison.

That coupled with the FFB (which im not saying is bad...but its nowhere near as good as iR/nK) makes for a very dull driving experience in comparison to the other two.

LFS is still very good in comparison to most sims, but the world has moved on and LFS is starting to lag behind now. I'd say not that long ago it was the best driving experience available in terms of feel. That unfortunately isn't the case now. Far from it in fact.

Hmmmmm from what i know lfs still using the same game engine from 2002/2003 and rFactor/iRacing have much updated game/gfx engine so no wonder lfs looks like a shoebox compared to other sims.

The ffb in lfs is fine for me, i do agree on the steering being light subject.

EDIT: i lie i don't use ffb but just go of sense of feel, touch and movement.

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

Aston has some bumps.. you just haev to notice them.

Westhill too. And while I can't subscribe to the glass-smooth myth, but tracks in iRacing are certainly more detailed.

Yup, westhill definatly has some bumps - Just done an hours or so solid graft there on Race 2!

But people are quick forgetting the iRacing has fancy LAZARR scanned tracks and the like. And it's a much newer project, as rc10 said.

Before we can truely judge LFS to iRacing and NKP and the like, I'd say it's only fair to wait till S3 is out, or at least S2 has gone FINAL, considering iRacing isn't (I think!) an Alpha project!

I never tried iRacing, but LFS sure doesnt need to "borrow" anything from it.
It's fine how it is, and it feels and looks like a finished game, even though its still in developemnet, so we still can expect alot from it.

I have tried iRacing alot and I have to saay bump mapping in LFS is realy poor

I mean lets take blackwood that like hilly but surface bump wise flat as block of cheese.
Then there are the rally cross courses those need bums and those are flat as level floor with sand on it.
Play Richard burns rally and you know what i'm on about

So LFS is nice but il could be way nicer in terms of slight phisycs changes and better bump mapping.
And for the love of god more tracks

haven't tried I-Racing, but one thing i do find in LFS is the FFB on FF cars is not as complete as i'd like. Where's the torque steer? 220bhp FWD would be tugging on the wheel like a bitch IRL. But hey, thats just IMHO

Quote from senn :

haven't tried I-Racing, but one thing i do find in LFS is the FFB on FF cars is not as complete as i'd like. Where's the torque steer? 220bhp FWD would be tugging on the wheel like a bitch IRL. But hey, thats just IMHO

Whel my dad has engine saw[ed and tuned swift it produses 212 bhp and no tourge steer.
Accelarate form dead stil to 100 kp/h and it remeans in the center possition somehow ,
but It has no power steering so Suposing the Roadcars In LFS have power steering therefore its light .

I mean who of you have tried acar without? belive me its tough
So my theorie road cars in LFS have power steering

I think many people in here forget that what we feel in LfS is huegly dependant on your setup, and can range from being light and almost not noticable to very strong simply by editing some values (and I don't meed force feedback strength). Concerning fidelity of the FFB, I don't think it's behind iRacing, it's rather a problem of too smooth tracks.
I for one still feel more connected to the car and the road in LfS than in iRacing (which I stopped playing after my 1 month subscription ran out... and I haven't had the urge to nplay it ever since)

And I too think that there isn't much to borrow from iRacing that isn't utopian (laser scanned tracks) or mere eye candy (realtime shadows with self shadowing, modern pixel shaders).

Quote from senn :

haven't tried I-Racing, but one thing i do find in LFS is the FFB on FF cars is not as complete as i'd like. Where's the torque steer? 220bhp FWD would be tugging on the wheel like a bitch IRL. But hey, thats just IMHO

LFS does have torque-steer. I notice it alot.

Quote from ColeusRattus :

And I too think that there isn't much to borrow from iRacing that isn't utopian (laser scanned tracks) or mere eye candy (realtime shadows with self shadowing, modern pixel shaders).

Honestly sooner or later that eye-candy will be a distant comparison, like Excite Bike vs MotoGP

Quote from tristancliffe :

iRacing merely has passable FFB compared to real cars.

Which car and which build of iRacing did you test? I've tried out all the cars on the newest build and somewhat unfortunately the feel has ruined me for every other sim out there (except nKpro, haven't tried that yet). The rookie cars have the worst FFB in the sim. The rookie legends has weird fixed caster so the ffb stinks and the solstice has power steering which numbs the feedback. A properly set up advanced legends, skip barber, late model, and radical SR8 have the best FFB.

Quote from The Moose :

Then you obviously haven't driven nKPro or iRacing.

The track surfaces in LFS (except South City) are billiard table smooth in comparison.

That coupled with the FFB (which im not saying is bad...but its nowhere near as good as iR/nK) makes for a very dull driving experience in comparison to the other two.

LFS is still very good in comparison to most sims, but the world has moved on and LFS is starting to lag behind now. I'd say not that long ago it was the best driving experience available in terms of feel. That unfortunately isn't the case now. Far from it in fact.

Would have to agree with you Stu. LFS to me is still the best overall package out there when you look at all the parts such as cost, community, immersion, tracks, cars feel, graphics, playability etc. However, it's all dependant on what you want from computer based driving software. If it's more the multiplay arcade like quality then that's fine but to me the first and king feature is the feel of the car. When I say feel I mean not only how the FFB works and feels but also how a car handles. There is nothing out there that I have tried that can rival Netkar Pro. There is nothing out there that can rival iRacing's road feel. An amalgamation of the two would be knockout!

For the cash though, you can't beat LFS as a kick arse arcade sim!

Quote from fizzer :

except nKpro, haven't tried that yet).

you're in for a treat then!!!!!!

When you do, you can download all the custom tracks from our site HERE

Quote from StableX :

you're in for a treat then!!!!!!

When you do, you can download all the custom tracks from our site HERE

I will definitely give it a go now that I have some free time waiting for the Daytona Prototype to be released

If I compare my car feeling in reallife to my car feeling in LFS I notice some points wich are partly given by the fact that it is a racing sim, but also partly of the software...

to the lattest point I would say that stearing is to light and sometimes the cars feel too easy to drive... I have the feeling in reallife cars at lower speed are moving more and also working more then cars in LFS. But ok... I've never been sitting in a perfectly matched-to-track setupped race car. Another thing was also mentioned before: The tracks need bumps... But I think that South City is an exeption: When I drive over some bigger much used roads with 70kph or over the motorways with 80-140kph I feel much more bumps within a few seconds then in south city in a whole lap. Maybe it is just the local quality of roads but that's what I felt. Additional I'd wish some sound for changed ground, as the roads are mostly not made out of one ground but out of several... sometimes there are bumps where i think my back's broken, so heavy they are wich is caused by very hard suspension. On cars with better suspension you feel them but they are not that bad.

All in all in all in all I have to say that LFS is fun... but don't forget comparing it to reallife is a bit more difficult then to iRacing... and comparing it to the reality and finding solutions wich are more real are the way to make it better, not the comparison to another "game".

I don't have any experience with iRacing or with nKPro, but except the lightness of stearing or the easiness of stearing and the missing bumps around the tracks

Quote from TFalke55 :

When I drive over some bigger much used roads with 70kph or over the motorways with 80-140kph I feel much more bumps within a few seconds then in south city in a whole lap.

Well, most bumps you feel IRL are not really feelable in FFB, because they don't apply rotational forces to the steering. They are noticable visually though, which is as good as we get until FFB seats will become standard

Quote from The Moose :

Then you obviously haven't driven nKPro or iRacing.

The track surfaces in LFS (except South City) are billiard table smooth in comparison.

That coupled with the FFB (which im not saying is bad...but its nowhere near as good as iR/nK) makes for a very dull driving experience in comparison to the other two.

LFS is still very good in comparison to most sims, but the world has moved on and LFS is starting to lag behind now. I'd say not that long ago it was the best driving experience available in terms of feel. That unfortunately isn't the case now. Far from it in fact.

Blah! Stu you took the words right out of my mouth

I think that a very good idea to borrow SR (Safety Rating) from iRacing. If you do not drive clear you will not be allowed to serious racing.

Sorry for my english.

Except that the SR in iRacing has little to do with how safe you actually are.

The good: The feeling you get from the suspension of the car is really great, I love driving the MRT5 because when power sliding it around a high speed corner, you can distinctly feel what tires are under load and correct accordingly.

The bad: The lack of road surface bumps is, as you have all said, seriously lacking. South City is one of the better tracks, but even still it is way too smooth for a temporary road circuit, any single seater should have the shit shaken out of it, but even in the little MRT5, just inches above the surface, its silky smooth. The only areas you really feel the road are when going over curbs, or in an area of surface elevation change, improving this without destroying the existing feel of the suspension and physics could really improve the game.

Potential problems: The games I have played that have good bump mappings seem to usually over-do it. I want to feel the road surface and its bumps, but I don't want to feel detached from the movement of the car. One of the most highly acclaimed rFactor mods, CDTP 2006, has done too much IMO. Yes I can feel the road, yes I can feel every shift, but thats about all I feel, it completely drowns out the feeling of grip. Though IRacing and NetKar Pro are better, I still think a better job could be done somewhere in between.

No I am not a professional race driver, yes I have driven cars