I think you can expect Fubar Racing to sign up for season 2. Glad to have you guys on board

Please also define rule no MoE/IGTC drivers.

If someone starts in GT Amateur League 2010,and have no MoE/IGTC races,and in the middle of the GT Amateur League 2010 season,driver have debut in MoE/IGTC,can he continue GT Amateur League 2010 season or not.

Quote :

Will teams who raced in season 1 be given priority in the sign up?

I would like this,and would also like that teams who raced in season one have numbers from season one general standings (example,SCP finished first season on 6th place,in season 2010 they would be #6 Serbian Chromed Pistons).

We're not really commenting on what will/won't be in the series at the present time as we're still discussing it internally, but I thought I'd say some words on the subject of the following:

Quote from HVS5b :

I liked the no MoE/IGTC drivers rule. Gives the rest of us half a chance.

Personally, [and I would think I speak on behalf of NDR here] I want to see big grids full of the sort of people this series was intended for. The problem isn't [we hope :P] the big grids, but who is this series intended for - does the fact that a driver competed in an IGTC Race mean that he can't race in this?

Consider the following:
In the IGTC there is a good mix of big, well established teams aswell as some smaller, maybe national teams. Take an example of a smaller team with 5 members, and a much bigger team such as Sonicrealms. [sorry to single you out here guys!] Say you needed 4 members for one of the races in the IGTC, and one of the guys from the smaller team was ill or whatever. This means that the other person in that team, even if they were fairly new to LFS/never done a major league race before would be drafted in. However, in a team like SR, that wouldn't matter as they have dozens of superb drivers. Thus, we have a situation where a person from the smaller team, who we'd love to have in the GTAL, now cannot race as they've participated in an IGTC race. Furthermore, it might be that Sonicrealms have a new, up-and-coming driver who they want to give some Endurance Race Experience to, so they put him in an IGTC team. This is the kind of person we'd like to have, but again that person now cannot participate in this series.

Where do we draw the line?

We'd love to be able to trust people to make up their own minds about whether or not they are suitable, but with such a pretigious championship and certain people's attitudes, that's sadly not going to happen.

We may end up doing it on a case-by-case basis, but of course then we'll get the children complaining "OMG HE WAZ LET IN WAI CANNOT I RACE PL0X!111?!1!?!1!?1!?!/1" and so forth.



It's a difficult choice on this particular rule, I think all of us will have our own ideas within NDR itself, but any other "differentiating" rules from you would be good.

EDIT: But of course, I agree with the quoted about "giving the rest a chance". This series isn't meant for the aliens of this world

I agree with you J@tko. The rules was not perfect in my opinion, but it wasnt a bad solution to start with. I will say that the best opinion is doing it "case by case".

Quote :

If someone starts in GT Amateur League 2010,and have no MoE/IGTC races,and in the middle of the GT Amateur League 2010 season,driver have debut in MoE/IGTC,can he continue GT Amateur League 2010 season or not.

I didnt see the answer for this case

Maybe have a maximum number of IGTC/MOE starts a driver can have. I believe this is how CART used to define a driver eligible for Rookie of the Year.

I just came with an idea. What about this?:

If a team has never driven in IGTC before (That a drive is in a team that havent been in IGTC/MoE), everyone in that team should be allowed to drive GTAL, but the teams that have teams in IGTC/MoE, we can have a maximum number of starts in IGTC/MoE or something (or that you review the drivers, one by one for example). Thats at least my opinion.

As there isnt easy for a team to "show what they got", to get up to MoE/IGTC, when they arent allowed to use a driver, because he has done 3-4 races for another team before. Endurance Racing is a team-sport, where every driver counts. And since this is a feeder series to IGTC/MoE, which is a team-based championship (and so is GTAL), I would like that most of the members can take part, as long as they havent done TOO many IGTC/MoE races/is way too fast, of course

Just an idea.

Quote from Tomhah :

I just came with an idea. What about this?:

If a team has never driven in IGTC before (That a drive is in a team that havent been in IGTC/MoE), everyone in that team should be allowed to drive GTAL, but the teams that have teams in IGTC/MoE, we can have a maximum number of starts in IGTC/MoE or something (or that you review the drivers, one by one for example). Thats at least my opinion.

As there isnt easy for a team to "show what they got", to get up to MoE/IGTC, when they arent allowed to use a driver, because he has done 3-4 races for another team before. Endurance Racing is a team-sport, where every driver counts. And since this is a feeder series to IGTC/MoE, which is a team-based championship (and so is GTAL), I would like that most of the members can take part, as long as they havent done TOO many IGTC/MoE races/is way too fast, of course

Just an idea.

This makes sence

Quote from count.bazley :

Maybe have a maximum number of IGTC/MOE starts a driver can have. I believe this is how CART used to define a driver eligible for Rookie of the Year.

Could be, could be....

It would have to a pretty low number though.

Personally I see the IGTC as a feeder to MoE. How about maintain the absolutely no MoE experience rule and allow maybe 2 IGTC races over the last two seasons?

Remember we're not talking about excluding racers forever, they would maybe just have to sit out maybe one season until their IGTC starts became anulled.

Tis a tricky one for sure, but I'd differentiate between MoE and IGTC drives.

To make decisions on a "case by case" basis would lead to complete mayhem imo.

i still dont see solution for this.

Quote :

If someone starts in GT Amateur League 2010,and have no MoE/IGTC races,and in the middle of the GT Amateur League 2010 season,driver have debut in MoE/IGTC,can he continue GT Amateur League 2010 season or not.

So i am not talking about whole team,i am talking about one driver(maybe some sort of rent-A-driver)
This stuff must be clearly xplained in rules,to avoid some special rules during season and other things.

I wont say that MoE drivers are faster than IGTC drivers, as they are almost the same

Im for that a driver/team can continue in GTAL the current season if they have got a space/started an IGTC race after the GTAL season has started. Thats a good experience for both the team/driver and in my opinion, they shouldnt loose the championship/the possibility to win it, because they got a chance in a good league. Its good experience for the team/driver.

I also quite like my idea:

Quote :

I just came with an idea. What about this?:

If a team has never driven in IGTC before (That a drive is in a team that havent been in IGTC/MoE), everyone in that team should be allowed to drive GTAL, but the teams that have teams in IGTC/MoE, we can have a maximum number of starts in IGTC/MoE or something (or that you review the drivers, one by one for example). Thats at least my opinion.

As there isnt easy for a team to "show what they got", to get up to MoE/IGTC, when they arent allowed to use a driver, because he has done 3-4 races for another team before. Endurance Racing is a team-sport, where every driver counts. And since this is a feeder series to IGTC/MoE, which is a team-based championship (and so is GTAL), I would like that most of the members can take part, as long as they havent done TOO many IGTC/MoE races/is way too fast, of course

Just an idea.

that's why is it classified as MoE/IGTC drivers
Almost the same

Quote from J@tko :

Consider the following:
In the IGTC there is a good mix of big, well established teams aswell as some smaller, maybe national teams. Take an example of a smaller team with 5 members, and a much bigger team such as Sonicrealms. [sorry to single you out here guys!] Say you needed 4 members for one of the races in the IGTC, and one of the guys from the smaller team was ill or whatever. This means that the other person in that team, even if they were fairly new to LFS/never done a major league race before would be drafted in. However, in a team like SR, that wouldn't matter as they have dozens of superb drivers. Thus, we have a situation where a person from the smaller team, who we'd love to have in the GTAL, now cannot race as they've participated in an IGTC race. Furthermore, it might be that Sonicrealms have a new, up-and-coming driver who they want to give some Endurance Race Experience to, so they put him in an IGTC team. This is the kind of person we'd like to have, but again that person now cannot participate in this series.

Er... well if you look at what we did this season with GTAL, we had a pretty settled line up. We used GTAL to see how Howie would do in his first endurance type event, he did well so he stepped up to IGTC and we brought in another driver who will probably continue in GTAL next season to gain experience. We don't just stick people into IGTC, we plan to let them get experience in GTAL, just like we did this season... so yes, despite your "Don't mean to pick on you guys" if you are taking over admining this series, be aware of what teams who participate use GTAL to do, and don't talk tosh.

A common misconception people seem to have is that we can just pull drivers out of thin air who are able to drive endurance races. Utter tosh, our MoE/IGTC team is pretty settled and only about 9 drivers big. Using GTAL as we have done, we can get other drivers who might be useful to us in the future, and give them GTR Endurance experience, as well as giving them essential race experience, so they don't end up having a debut like I did at SO4 MoE that took me months to recover from.

Slap for Jack.


For what it's worth I think that it should still be no IGTC/MoE experience, unless there is exceptional circumstances, like a last minute stand in and they were rubbish. I could have done with doing GTAL when GTAL first started, but because we literarly had no drivers in MoE I had to drive and fail just to keep the team in MoE, and that cost me the chance to get experience on my own terms, and not worrying whether I was letting down the other two drivers. Things do happen...

Quote from CSF :

For what it's worth I think that it should still be no IGTC/MoE experience, unless there is exceptional circumstances, like a last minute stand in and they were rubbish. I could have done with doing GTAL when GTAL first started, but because we literarly had no drivers in MoE I had to drive and fail just to keep the team in MoE, and that cost me the chance to get experience on my own terms, and not worrying whether I was letting down the other two drivers. Things do happen...

And that is why the rule in my opinion suck.

Except for the fact that modern day Chris would completely own most of the GTAL field

Quote from Gil07 :

Except for the fact that modern day Chris would completely own most of the GTAL field

I'm sure when he laps Passo it would change!

I'll hit up some of the points here of my own view. See them below in RED.

Quote from HVS5b :

Good to see you guys getting involved

I've raced in a couple of your events and always found them well managed.

Thank you for these compliments, we try to make them as smooth as possible.

Changes/alterations/comments:

1. It would be good to see fuller grids.
+1
2. We need more 6hr races, not just one at end of season. Maybe a 12hr finale?
We're definitely going to have a couple longer races, probably a 5h and a 10h race. The other races will probably stay 3 hours long.
3. I liked the no MoE/IGTC drivers rule. Gives the rest of us half a chance.
Yes, we will be working on that rule quite heavily to ensure a fair balance for all.
4. Would you consider the introduction of a push car/safety car?
Already mentioned above. We will be introducing those.
5. Can the season be longer than 5 races pls? Although one a month was good spacing.
Rounds will stay a month apart, and we will visit each track environment once. And possibly one gets a second visit.
6. The restrictions should be the same as MoE GT2.
We will see what those are and how those are, but yes, we will go with a GT2 level restriction.
7. Will teams who raced in season 1 be given priority in the sign up? I can see this being MUCH more popular this time around.
Yes, those teams and teams who we have seen already will of course have a bit more priority because, well, we've seen them race before. We don't discriminate, but we will judge them off of past experiences. We will do applications similar to MoE....teams apply, but the organizers issue official invites to certain teams.
8. Glad you're moving it to winter, far too many nice summer evenings spent in front of my PC....
I need a life all year round, and LFS is it !
9. The race end procedure should be followed or scrapped from the rules.
If we can figure out a way to make the bloody tracker ignore everything after the finish, then yes, we will have a better end-race procedure. It's annoying to have everyone stop before split 1.

Looks fun E-Team will be in the house for GTAL 2010 !!

Cheers for the reply deko, like what I'm hearing

Good luck guys

I hope it would be a Amateur Leauge and not a waiting list for MoE/IGTC drivers they didn`t find a place to drive in this leauges.
I know`you work together with this leauges but pleas lat this leauge a Amateur leaug like the name say.

greatings
Broe

Hope so aswell as SCCC is seriously thinking about entering this league.

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Hope so aswell as SCCC is seriously thinking about entering this league.

:chairs:

Try not contradicting his post given you are on the bloody IGTC waiting list!

Quote from CSF :

:chairs:

Try not contradicting his post given you are on the bloody IGTC waiting list!

I thought only racing in IGTC would ban you from driving in GTAL?

Read Broe's post again.

Quote from CSF :

Read Broe's post again.

So this means we had it right?