xrrs just pulling away on straights

Yes those restrictions were pretty bad to be honest...


Why don't the admins get the teams they intend to invite to do some testing and try and ensure we strike up a decent balance? Although I expect we will find there is no way of combating the gulf that exists between XRR and FZR without making one utterly rubbish.

Why not just give a car model success ballast? So if FZR's do better than XRRs + FXRs, FZRs either get ballast, or the other two get some taken off.

It has worked nicely in DTM. Otherwise you'll just end up with either a one make series or a season long biggering about the unfair balancing.

I think the 20kg ballast used in IGTC results in a fair balance. Only South City Long of the regular MoE tracks is likely to be noticably unbalanced, with the XRR being competitive on most tracks - especially when taking into account the ~5 seconds saved per stint on shorter refills and the possibility of making less pitstops especially in the 12h and 24h races.

I also think it's correct not to consider the FXR since it would require crippling handicaps of the FZ and XR in order to be competitive, and it is obviously an easier car to drive consistently when close to the limit.

Quote from joshdifabio :

I think the 20kg ballast used in IGTC results in a fair balance. Only South City Long of the regular MoE tracks is likely to be noticably unbalanced, with the XRR being competitive on most tracks - especially when taking into account the ~5 seconds saved per stint on shorter refills and the possibility of making less pitstops especially in the 12h and 24h races.

I also think it's correct not to consider the FXR since it would require crippling handicaps of the FZ and XR in order to be competitive, and it is obviously an easier car to drive consistently when close to the limit.

Yay, sense

Find a way to make it a Masters of Endurance series rather then a Masters of Hotlapping contest.
Hire the IGTC Safety Car. Success ballast - Yes, why not.

Plus: Maybe leave the team car choice open from race to race. With at least one month in between the races there should be enough race preparation time for any team and no balancing at all would be needed. In case of a possible midseason patch it might save you admins some work as well.

All I wanted to say: Give the XRR/FZR 50 kg´s both and close the case.

There will not be safety cars or success ballast in MoE this season.

Quote from joshdifabio :

I think the 20kg ballast used in IGTC results in a fair balance.

MoFZR - Season 2

Quote from R.Kolz :

Find a way to make it a Masters of Endurance series rather then a Masters of Hotlapping contest.

That's an LFS problem. LFS is so forgiving with its no bumps and curb jumping that all you are going to see is hotlapping.

Quote from PMD9409 :

MoFZR - Season 2

I see some XRRs in IGTC :/

I did some S/F speed trap testing during the race:

GT1:
R.De Jong [XRR] 166mph
S.Fischer [FXR] 164mph
E.Liibeon [FZR] 165mph

So yes, in GT1 the FZR is slower on a straight.

GT2:
P.Diaz/K.O'Keefe [XRR] 153mph
L.De Jong [FZR] 151mph
G.Alamaras [FXR] 151mph

Again, FZR slower than the XRR on a straight.

Of course these are all variable by set/lap/driver or whatever, although they were fairly consistent lap by lap to +/-1 mph

Quote from R.Kolz :

Find a way to make it a Masters of Endurance series rather then a Masters of Hotlapping contest.[/COLOR]

I've to say the 24h race was interesting until the end.

But I think that it is a general problem of all sorts of Endurance race... I remember several Endurance races that were just "overlapping and overlapping lower class cars" That LFS's enviroments ar so "perfect" increases this feeling...

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Are you saying now that the GTRs are balanced with the 20kg for FZR? I think 3% intake restriction for GT1 FZR without any weight penaltys would be a fair balancing. Weight penaltys just seem to have no effect on the cars performance.

It does affect it, but 20 kg only is not enough.

I'd say 1% + 20kg would be good?

As for GT2, probably -1% for FZR and +10kg for FXR or something

3% is too much

+1. 3% smashes the FZR's straight line speed. It was bad enough with 2%

Quote from Deutschland2007 :

Yeah that´s what I meant. 20kg is just not enough and you can´t just go crazy high with those weight penaltys. What do you think about the 3% restriction?

what the hell do you base your suggestions on? have you even tested anything?

Yesterday's race proved that on KY2 exclusively, the 2%+20kg combo is too much.

Then again, it would be something new and refreshing to see XRR actually being better at some track, instead of being "competitive" (aka up to a second slower than the FZR)

Either cripple the FZR to make it somewhat similar in performance to the XRR, or retest & calculate the restrictions between races.

Quote from j@tko :

+1. 3% smashes the fzr's straight line speed. It was bad enough with 2%

+2

LOL 3%... That must be consequence of weed...

With 2% intake the top speeds were only seperated by 1mph? I don't see that as that big of a difference tbh.

I say put a couple of MoE FZR drivers into a FZR with the 2% intake (no ballast), and I bet they still run XRR WR times in stint.

Thanks for that "competitive" definition Fuse, at least someone sees something similar to me.

Quote from TexasLTU :

LOL 3%... That must be consequence of weed...

I don´t take any drugs. 3% were a result of the test I did for myself. Maybe I´m not good at trying to balance cars out, so I´ll leave it to everyone else from now on.

Quote from PMD9409 :

With 2% intake the top speeds were only seperated by 1mph? I don't see that as that big of a difference tbh.

I say put a couple of MoE FZR drivers into a FZR with the 2% intake (no ballast), and I bet they still run XRR WR times in stint.

Thanks for that "competitive" definition Fuse, at least someone sees something similar to me.

That was at the S/F line Phil, so probably +1/2mph at the very top end

Quote from J@tko :

That was at the S/F line Phil, so probably +1/2mph at the very top end

FZR keeps more speed off the corner though due to XRR's turbo, and it just plain handles better in some corners, so a faster top end by the XRR would just equal it out.

hows about ppl stop moaning n shit n pick the fastest car if u wanna win. jeez...

Quote from BenjiMC :

hows about ppl stop moaning n shit n pick the fastest car if u wanna win. jeez...

Why not discuss it and try to make the cars as similar as possible?

whats the point? your always gonna get moaning.