learn to read.

actually learn to read back a few post up........

Wooo! It is coming out this year.... maybe. Tbh, you can't trust Turn 10 and Polyphony digital. Remember what happened to Fm1 and Gt4?

But still, I can't wait for the best console sim to finally come out!

Quote from Boris Lozac :

Oh snap!



http://www.gtplanet.net/gran-t ... 9-release-date-confirmed/

Its worth pointing out something that even the GTPlanet site hasnt highlighted and people may not realise (and later moan about delays) ... them saying Q4 2009 doesnt mean its between Sept - Dec 2009, ie a date within 2009, its most likely around Dec 09 - March 10, because its done to the business calendar rather than a regular one when your refering to yearly quarters.
Hopefully it will be inside 2009, but the ballpark date provided can be misleading, not to mention delayed no matter how complete it is considered right now (LBP was delayed 1wk before launch!).

Just something worth considering when these sort of expected released dates get mentioned.

Agreed.

> > As a sony/PC/360 fanboy, I have to say this..

GT5 is more realistic in physics, track detail, and such like that. But certain aspects are left out or underdone.

For instance, people will agree that collision physics and damage models are more realistic in Forza. But Forza is not called a simulator. It IS indeed an Arcade game. Anyone who wishes to argue can, but it is an Arcade game, no matter how much "betterer" (yes betterer) you think the physics are.

GT5 strives to be the most realistic it can be, while still allowing people to control it using a 20 degree thumbstick. One thing i have noticed is that the "driver" tends to not turn as much as you do. This could be due to turning ability at higher speeds, which might be the cause for "slow turning". They also try to anticipate that you will most likely be using a thumbstick, though hopefully by GT5, they will allow direct access to steering, and the steering for a steering wheel might be more responsive.
Again, they adjust for the 20 degree thumbstick to allow for a little be more precision while driving.

Another problem is that most people driving with a controller thing that they can just go full throttle, and complain that they're always spinning the tires and blah blah blah. With recent additions to "pressure senstive" buttons, switching the control scheme over to use the R2 and L2 buttons will make driving a bit easier.

Lastly, the only problem i've had with the in cockpit views of GT5 is how stiff you feel. If they didn't feel so stiff and added movement of the "drivers view" then it wouldn't feel like crap.

Also, every PS3 fanboy has a big ego, like someone driving a hybrid car. And every 360 fanboy apparenly lacks proper education and should be smacked in the face repeatedly.

They also tend to look like this

(at least at my high school they did..... )

Now i'm not saying that all people who play 360 are like that.
Just... a really... big... majority of you....... > > and the 12 year olds will grow up to be like above.

o.O 360 gaming to begin with is not the way we should be.
Yeah, sure, it's cool, but wasn't that the original point to being a gamer?

We wern't the cool kids. We were the nerdy kids. The geeks, the freaks. The people who were like "I game, and i'm proud. Get over it."
Now it's like vampires and the goth culture, spiraling downwards because more and more idiots are joining in because now we're marketable. Sure, we were before, but now there's merchandise to our merchandise. It's ridicoulous what you can buy for gamers now. We didn't have those products. The only people that used to really target us as consumers were the game companies themselves. Soon they'll all be under one company, and it will be harder for smaller companies to start. Then eventually we'll lack games with creativity because they'll be too much of a 'risk'.

=/ Gaming was founded on invention and imagination, but now be stifled by "what the fans want" instead of "what sounds really cool and if we did it the fans would want"

Sure we still have a few games (little big planet) that are a surprise, but in general, the gaming world has changed forever. Some things for the better, but ultimately it will be us that suffers, not the companies.

I know i went way off topic, but my point is, the 360 is a threat to the gaming community. Sony takes their to the limit. Sure they're business people, but they do care about us. Microsoft is there entirely for business. Sure you have a few random people there that care, but if they truly did care they would be less of a giant company that owns everything, and worried more about a few things.

They arn't monopolizing, technically but soon microsoft will rule the world. You can count on it. (Really, the only person in that entire company i would trust is Bill Gates. He is awesome, but only him. Everyone else in microsoft (in general of course) can be related to the picture above.)

Hey, geek chic is in, baby. The ladies know where the future leaders of the world are. In their parent's basement

Like the saying goes - be nice to geeks, someday you'll end up working for one.

I'm not sure where the massive rant about gaming in general came from though. Each console, just like each game, has something going for it. I prefer the driving model of Forza 2, but the feeling of speed is better in GT5:P. They're both good, just different. There's no right or wrong here, no bad or good.
Nothing is threatening anything, because it's sales and not attitudes that drive companies and both have sold enough to make it worth keeping doing it - otherwise they'd stop.

Quote from Dajmin :

The ladies know where the future leaders of the world are. In their parent's basement

Incest - Creating the worlds future leaders

It does explain G.W.Bush though!

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

Agreed.
For instance, people will agree that collision physics and damage models are more realistic in Forza. But Forza is not called a simulator. It IS indeed an Arcade game. Anyone who wishes to argue can, but it is an Arcade game, no matter how much "betterer" (yes betterer) you think the physics are.

sorry that make no sense to me.

What makes GT5 a sim and Forza a arcade game?

They have similiar physics, similiar game structure, similiar content, similiar features.

To me it's like PES and FIFA, Guitar Hero and Rockband........head to head competiting products that are actually very close to each other.

Well, actually, we don't know how GT5's physics are. The games not done, so how are we actually comparing 2 games together when one hasn't even been released?

Sure we have GT:P, which is like a girl showing her self off a little bit, but still keeping it PG-13 (at least.. to the very extent of PG-13, without breaking that barrier). But it's nothing like seeing the real deal. =/ GT:P was just a look at whats to come, therefore, both our arguements are null, void, and to be honest, make no sense.

We can't compare a game that is out to a game that isn't even finished or even been released, let alone make the statement that "their physics are the same". If you actually think about it from a broad view, most physics done in racing games are around the same, it's really all a matter of who can put it all together properly and realistically.

=/ So.. really, we've been arguing about nothing.

EDIT: And forza is more about car modification. GT5 is more about being a car/racing enthusiast. =/

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

EDIT: And forza is more about car modification. GT5 is more about being a car/racing enthusiast. =/

Wrong. Forza and GT5 are about the racing. Forza just has more customisation options. (remember GT used to have the racing modification as well)

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

Well, actually, we don't know how GT5's physics are. The games not done, so how are we actually comparing 2 games together when one hasn't even been released?

Sure we have GT:P, which is like a girl showing her self off a little bit, but still keeping it PG-13 (at least.. to the very extent of PG-13, without breaking that barrier). But it's nothing like seeing the real deal. =/ GT:P was just a look at whats to come, therefore, both our arguements are null, void, and to be honest, make no sense.

We can't compare a game that is out to a game that isn't even finished or even been released, let alone make the statement that "their physics are the same". If you actually think about it from a broad view, most physics done in racing games are around the same, it's really all a matter of who can put it all together properly and realistically.

=/ So.. really, we've been arguing about nothing.

EDIT: And forza is more about car modification. GT5 is more about being a car/racing enthusiast. =/

That post and your one above is just a load of waffle. You sound more like you're trying to convince yourself rather than making a coherent argument.

Quote from sinbad :

That post and your one above is just a load of waffle. You sound more like you're trying to convince yourself rather than making a coherent argument.

Heh, I'm glad someone said it

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

Well, actually, we don't know how GT5's physics are. The games not done, so how are we actually comparing 2 games together when one hasn't even been released?

Sure we have GT:P, which is like a girl showing her self off a little bit, but still keeping it PG-13 (at least.. to the very extent of PG-13, without breaking that barrier). But it's nothing like seeing the real deal. =/ GT:P was just a look at whats to come, therefore, both our arguements are null, void, and to be honest, make no sense.

We can't compare a game that is out to a game that isn't even finished or even been released, let alone make the statement that "their physics are the same". If you actually think about it from a broad view, most physics done in racing games are around the same, it's really all a matter of who can put it all together properly and realistically.

=/ So.. really, we've been arguing about nothing.

EDIT: And forza is more about car modification. GT5 is more about being a car/racing enthusiast. =/

just wait till forza 3 comes out in stores, try the demo(if you can) and turn all assists off and tell me if its a arcade game.

*throws in some forks and knives*

:munching_

Quote from mutt107 :

just wait till forza 3 comes out in stores, try the demo(if you can) and turn all assists off and tell me if its a arcade game.

Don't try arguing, please, it's futile. Besides, this whole debate about which is more "sim" and which more "arcade" is stupid. They're both really great games, some prefer one over the other, other people like 'em both.

To each his own. Man, this "console war" is really really really really getting old.



Really.

GT5 is a sim and Forza 2 is arcade?, thats one of the oddest statements I have read in a while.

Sorry, but Arse fox, you are a mentalist.

Niether are full blown sims, both are (IMO) about the same on physics, GT5p is better because it has decent wheel support (G25), but Forza does a better job of "doing physics" through a pad.

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

Sure we have GT:P, which is like a girl showing her self off a little bit, but still keeping it PG-13 (at least.. to the very extent of PG-13, without breaking that barrier). But it's nothing like seeing the real deal. =/ GT:P was just a look at whats to come, therefore, both our arguements are null, void, and to be honest, make no sense.

But you can sort of know the level of realism that could get from the Prolouge no? An educated guess made from it would be a rather good foundation to judge.

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

If you actually think about it from a broad view, most physics done in racing games are around the same, it's really all a matter of who can put it all together properly and realistically.

Good physics are alike, but the difference is in the details. They will be close but there will be still some differences, pros and cons.

Quote from Arsenic_Fox :

EDIT: And forza is more about car modification. GT5 is more about being a car/racing enthusiast. =/

So in Forza you are restricted to race less, until you spend a certain amount of time on modifying? And don't you upgrade cars often in GT as well?

I don't really know how'd you classify FM2 as an arcade game. It may be one of the real-est (word?) racing sims for 360. Again, I wouldn't know the 360 game line up.

Anyways... Chances are that GT5 will have amazing physics, given that developers at polyphony harness the power of the Cell, but who am I to talk about? But at this point, with the amazing processing powers of both consoles (you see, I am using the word 'both', not all... ), the physics won't be too way off, ofc unless these sims were designed to run on the *hemwiihem*, then I'd jump right back onto my PS2, running GT4.

No offense to Nintendo Fanboys; I like how they took a totally different approached, but priced at like $250... c'mon. A 7 year old Gamecube, with CPU / GPUs built on smaller fab. processes, a new looking chassis, wLan capable, and bluetooth, or whatever those weird looking remotes are running off...
I gotta get myself some fire extinguishers - Haha, I'm ready for the flames =D

Please don't take personally guys, my personal views for the Wii...

Anyways, we'll know how good the two will be. Hmmm... Maybe I should get a PSThree (LOL), and GT5. Attach my DFGT, and away I go!

Do it, then you won't haffto spend another 100$ for WiFi, and 60-120$/year for Online, and if you get the "Arcade" model (that's 200$), that's another 60-100$ for a hard drive. Bringing the total well over a new PS3.

BUY A PS3. YOUR WALLET WILL THANK YOU!

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

Do it, then you won't haffto spend another 100$ for WiFi, and 60-120$/year for Online, and if you get the "Arcade" model (that's 200$), that's another 60-100$ for a hard drive. Bringing the total well over a new PS3.

BUY A PS3. YOUR WALLET WILL THANK YOU!

50$ a year.

Quote from mutt107 :

50$ a year.

USD. Canada gets raped (as usual).

BTW, it's still a ripoff. 50$ a year when the comparison is free. What do you get out of Xbox live that you don't on PSN?

Oh right, 13 year olds (as parents are too cheap for PS3) and the ability to have a voice chat in game. Big whoop, there's these things called phones/Skype/MSN Voice Chat/Teamspeak. Also it's more likely than not that stuff like that will be added in a soon update.

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

USD. Canada gets raped (as usual).

BTW, it's still a ripoff. 50$ a year when the comparison is free. What do you get out of Xbox live that you don't on PSN?

Oh right, 13 year olds (as parents are too cheap for PS3) and the ability to have a voice chat in game. Big whoop, there's these things called phones/Skype/MSN Voice Chat/Teamspeak. Also it's more likely than not that stuff like that will be added in a soon update.

Lag free gaming.

Any money which is recieved via subscription services is spent on maintaining and upgrading the WorldWide servers. Sure, it seemed attractive that PSN was free, but after owning a PS3 (plus playing on my brothers and freinds PS3's), i can confidently say that Xbox live is a much more Lag-Free gaming experience then PSN.

Also (and i dont know whether you have experienced this since the "New Xbox Experience" update) but the way that it invites freinds to games your in, and the way partys and private chat works is very very clever, and anyone who use's Xbox Live on a regular occasion will agree with me. We've now also got movie rentals which we dont have to download. They stream straight from independent "ZUNE" servers in 1080i HD, so we dont have to wait for them to download no more. Facebook and Twitter are also coming to Xbox Live, although admittingly, i probably wont use this much.

And one more thing, do you really have to NitPick the Xbox 360 so much that you have to see spending $50 or so a year as a negative? That equals less than $5 a MONTH! You probably spend more then that on Acne Cream and Poptarts every week!

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

Do it, then you won't haffto spend another 100$ for WiFi, and 60-120$/year for Online, and if you get the "Arcade" model (that's 200$), that's another 60-100$ for a hard drive. Bringing the total well over a new PS3.

BUY A PS3. YOUR WALLET WILL THANK YOU!

Seriously, enough with that crap!

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

Lag free gaming.

Any money which is recieved via subscription services is spent on maintaining and upgrading the WorldWide servers. Sure, it seemed attractive that PSN was free, but after owning a PS3 (plus playing on my brothers and freinds PS3's), i can confidently say that Xbox live is a much more Lag-Free gaming experience then PSN.

Also (and i dont know whether you have experienced this since the "New Xbox Experience" update) but the way that it invites freinds to games your in, and the way partys and private chat works is very very clever, and anyone who use's Xbox Live on a regular occasion will agree with me. We've now also got movie rentals which we dont have to download. They stream straight from independent "ZUNE" servers in 1080i HD, so we dont have to wait for them to download no more. Facebook and Twitter are also coming to Xbox Live, although admittingly, i probably wont use this much.

And one more thing, do you really have to NitPick the Xbox 360 so much that you have to see spending $50 or so a year as a negative? That equals less than $5 a MONTH! You probably spend more then that on Acne Cream and Poptarts every week!

... but that adds up... =/

Also, Xbox live isn't a central server. It's a check system. If it was a dedicated server, then they'd have a hell of a lot of severs doing a lot of overtime. No, this is how it works.

You log into Xbox Live's central server, it checks to see if you're account is a Gold, silver, or doesn't exist. If it's a gold, then you can play online. You join a game, and it's "hosted" by one of other players who seems to have the best connection to Xbox Live at that moment. You are then routed through the Xbox Live server to a connected 360, and the server is actually another gamer that you are playing with. Really, the only thing the Xbox LIVE servers do is play "matchmaker", they just assign you to play with certain people. =/

That's how most console "servers" work. =/ You're paying for them to upkeep the central server where all the gamertags and such are held, and for a premium service, not to maintain game servers.

The reason why most PS3 servers might be laggy is that since the PS3 has built in Wi-Fi, most people use it. So what's happening is someone is connecting with a super fast connection, but they end up losing a lot of packets being sent when the game is going, thus causing lag. So really, it's not the "free membership" that's a problem, but rather how people are connecting their PS3's to PSN.

=/ Try playing a game of Halo 3, and when the host disconnects, it'll stop the game and assign a new host. =/ I've had it happen before.

Also, we can play video while downloading them on the ps3. I know, i just did it. In 1080p HD (haha.. 1080i is for losers)
We can also BUY movies to OWN.

Seriously, for everything you say about the 360 being better, I can say something back.
I will say that the PSN could be better itself. Easier ways to add friends and stuff would be nice, but for the most part, you are paying 50 bucks to get the exact same god damn service. Actually, i've checked the 360 video store, you don't have half the movies or TV shows the PS3 has. =/ I know, I've checked. Kinda sucked when i couldn't rent half the movies i wanted. =/

I do like the buying feature a lot too. And if i go over to a friends and i buy a game, i can share it with him

Right now i have 3 friends who can play my one copy of BF1943. It's a really nice feature. Up to 5 friends playing the same game. =)

Quote from Boris Lozac :

Seriously, enough with that crap!

It's true though. It's a basic math exercise to see that the PS3 is cheaper. Why should I shut up when I'm right and can provide evidence.

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

It's true though. It's a basic math exercise to see that the PS3 is cheaper. Why should I shut up when I'm right and can provide evidence.

PS3 may be cheaper, but xbox is much better, if you ps3 breaks, your out of luck.
if you xbox breaks(which don't happen much anymore) you get it fixed for free.