Quote from legoflamb :

With all this talk about pre-ordering, Why not just toss in 12 euros into your account and not use it for anything? .

Because 12 Euros is only 10 GBP, and 10 GBP < 12 GBP.

Toss in 12 GBP so that you don't have to worry about the exchange rates.

I mistook the GBP symbol for the euro symbol. They both look like E's

Quote from legoflamb :

With all this talk about pre-ordering, Why not just toss in 12 euros into your account and not use it for anything? It would be the same as pre-ordering. All you have to do is wait for S3 to come out and get a voucher. As simple as pie. Ive already done it. I could buy S3 twice.

We don't know the price of S3 yet, so there's no point in putting [probably the wrong amount of] money in your account just yet, unless you plan on using the other benefits like high-res skin downloads and such.

Quote from Bob Smith :

Potentially. I would have thought that both devs and users would prefer real content over fictional.


I suppose this entirely depends on how easy and expensive it is to get real tracks scanned. I can't see the devs making a real track without scanning it, tbh. I could see Eric getting some inspiration for a fictional track of his own creation again, if he did a few real ones in a row. It's got to be more creative to start from scratch, and more of an achivement to see hundreds of people racing around your design.

It's possible that Eric has been working on a fictional track or two since the release of S2 way back when. Then he put it/them on hold when this Rockingham thing came up. So we still could see a fictional track or two eventually in S3. Of course nobody knows for sure.

Quote from 5haz :

Vaguely relevant, I remember watching this live.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3r6-ELiSy0

It's always great to see a race from meters of the track, I do it every time I can...

But here's a question: if CART World Series didn't fill that 52,000 grandstand seats... what would fill them?

Quote from PedraumF :

It's always great to see a race from meters of the track, I do it every time I can...

But here's a question: if CART World Series didn't fill that 52,000 grandstand seats... what would fill them?

CART is not that big over here. 40.000 people came for BTCC in 2008 and that is their record.

Maybe Formula 1 would fill them, but I don't think they will ever have a F1 race.

Quote from shiny_red_cobra :

We don't know the price of S3 yet, so there's no point in putting [probably the wrong amount of] money in your account just yet, unless you plan on using the other benefits like high-res skin downloads and such.

Pre-ordering has no point in a download-able game. It's not like it will be sold out when you get the chance to buy it. So he has a point, you could put 12 pound on your account and it will be the same as pre-ordering.

Quote from shiny_red_cobra :

We don't know the price of S3 yet, so there's no point in putting [probably the wrong amount of] money in your account just yet, unless you plan on using the other benefits like high-res skin downloads and such.

The point of Pre-ordering anything is to give the creators confirmation that you will purchase it. Also, it gives them money early to make up for some loses of development expense. I see no other purpose of pre-ordering.

If you want to pre-order it, but dont want to over pay, then just underpay by a good amount and pay the rest when it comes out.

Quote from marzman :

It has no point, but pre-ordering has no point in a download-able game. It's not like it will be sold out when you get the chance to buy it. So he has a point, you could put 12 pound on your account and it will be the same as pre-ordering.

Like marzman said, there is no point for pre-ordering a game such as LFS. Therefor, the only point of pre-ordering LFS is to give financial support.

LFS DEV's, "Sorry we are sold out. Please wait till we make more S3 EXE.'s. BTW: You sould have pre-ordered" LOL at the idea of running out of copies of LFS

Quote from lefty :

I fail to be offended by words with no meaning.

Owned! Lefty still alive!!!

Quote from legoflamb :

The point of Pre-ordering anything is to give the creators confirmation that you will purchase it. Also, it gives them money early to make up for some loses of development expense. I see no other purpose of pre-ordering.

If you want to pre-order it, but dont want to over pay, then just underpay by a good amount and pay the rest when it comes out.



Like marzman said, there is no point for pre-ordering a game such as LFS. Therefor, the only point of pre-ordering LFS is to give financial support.

LFS DEV's, "Sorry we are sold out. Please wait till we make more S3 EXE.'s. BTW: You sould have pre-ordered" LOL at the idea of running out of copies of LFS

Nice post,what's more,as you said,it gives them money NOW
I think i will do it tonight

As soon as I have the ability to preorder S3 via liveforspeed.net, I'll do.

Quote from PedraumF :

It's always great to see a race from meters of the track, I do it every time I can...

But here's a question: if CART World Series didn't fill that 52,000 grandstand seats... what would fill them?

I remember when Rockingham was first announced back in the late 90s, and there was excited talk about it being a new F1 venue (this was before the wave of ultramodern Tilkedromes), so perhaps they were built for that purpose.

I was there the day after it opened though, and I remember the stands being full.

Quote from marzman :

Pre-ordering has no point in a download-able game. It's not like it will be sold out when you get the chance to buy it. So he has a point, you could put 12 pound on your account and it will be the same as pre-ordering.

There is a benefit to pre-ordering and pre-downloading though.
It would spread the bandwidth hit rather than have everyone trying to leech it at once.

Obviously no-one would be able to unlock S3 until the switch was flicked on the master server though.

Quote from Bean0 :

There is a benefit to pre-ordering and pre-downloading though.
It would spread the bandwidth hit rather than have everyone trying to leech it at once.

Obviously no-one would be able to unlock S3 until the switch was flicked on the master server though.

There are enough download mirrors and a torrent is available also.
BTW, anyone who plans on buying S3, will do that "pre-order/pre-download" and servers would be in the same mess anyway .

Oh, and devs are gonna release it as soon as it's ready, right?
How can then they upload it to "pre-download" if it's not finished? lol
Or they should finish it and let us go mad with it on hard disk and not being able to unlock it?

Anyway, great news by devs. I like this "taking opportunities as they come".
There might be more real tracks and real cars (like that guy who made a little beast, AWD car, can't rember his username or thread about it . He also had a V8 Atom and some tuned Mini).

Oh, the joy .

First of all I would like to say that I'm impressed with the pics of the new circuit. Great news!

But I would like to make some little point.
Few years ago, LFS-Forum was not only a place for LFSers to comment things about the game or have a nice time knowing each others, it actually was a perfect way of communication between us, the community, and the developers.

One of the main features of LFS is its develop way. Lots of us really like having direct information of what's going on with the simulator and what we could expect in the "near" future.
Sadly this communication broke down some time ago due to part of the community starting complaining about the develop process (when it actually is one of the most impressive features of LFS ).

Now they announce a new track, a real track, laser scanned, and people complain anyway . It's just a nonsense.

So what I mean is: Devs, some people would always complain, but some other don't, so... why don't go back to the nice times when you share with the community what things are you working on, what were false steps, why some things are really difficult to implement, etc...

Until know we (more or less) knew what to expect, as the road to S2 final was stated. But know we just would have no tips about what we can expect for 0.7A (or whatever yo want to name it ). That's really a step back in the filosophy of LFS development as we (the happy part of the community) liked to think of. A small development team who want to create the best simulator they can, with direct communication with a little (not so llitle nowadays) community of enthusiasts.

And I'm sure most people that is moaning, would not do it if they had more information about why some things are not ready yet (or they are, but not released)

Quote from Scawen :

And finally to the point I am making, when Rockingham is released, S2 licensed racers will only be excluded from the Rockingham hosts or those which allow the new car. This will not have a very damaging effect on the S2 action.

As a result, there is not much pressure to upgrade your license. We are just saying, here is something we have done and this is the price if you'd like to use it. It doesn't really harm anyone, it's just something you can pay for if you think it's worth it. Of course, if you don't think it's worth it, and want to wait and see if there is more content added in the future, that is fine.

Why don't you go the iRacing way? Where users have to pay for each track/car. Imho LFS is way too cheap for what it offers.

I'm sure no one is interested, but I've started uploading my videos from Rockingham from last year. My upload speed isn't very high, so I'll probably only get one done today (wet practice), and then I'll start with the others next week. Off to Croft tomorrow for a race meeting, so won't get any up over the weekend. Maybe Eric will watch them and see something in them he hasn't spotted before, thus making the track even better in LFS - I'm still concerned that the end result won't be very much like Rockingham in reality.

Quote from tristancliffe :

I'm sure no one is interested

Don't be so sure

I hope you'll make a little review when the circuit is released about the real experience vs the LFS experience. And if you buy a Caterham then it would be much better

Quote from tristancliffe :

I'm sure no one is interested

I am

Quote from tristancliffe :

I'm still concerned that the end result won't be very much like Rockingham in reality.

And why is that?

So where do I get my new under crackers? Because I've just creamed all over the ones I have on.

I am really excited to know what the new car is (I am hoping it is something from the BTCC) and new tracks, oh my gee. The dev team have out done them selves.

Well i'm not interested... But where are the linkies?

he has a signature

Quote from BurnOut69 :

And why is that?

I just replied to a PM from tinvek about this.

I believe that the devil is in the detail. The laser scanning will ensure we get a track that looks a lot like Rockingham, and maybe that is enough for 99% of players. They want immersion, but perhaps don't care about realism.

But what separates a track that looks like Rockingham from a track that DRIVES like Rockingham is the detail - the dips behind a kerb that mean you can't cut it at all, the drain covers in a kerb that try to spit you around, the sudden changes in camber that might be missed by the laser scanner, or smoothed by the post-processing (look at the first corner of the infield - a double apex hairpin (where you usually miss the first apex by a car's width). As you come off the oval onto the infield there is a nasty, sudden change of camber. Without that the corner would be dull. With it, you never quite know what the car will do. How accurately they model that will define whether sector 1 of the infield tracks is good or a bit crap).

It's all well and good modelling the grandstands and pitlane in amazing detail (and it does look amazing to me), or even modelling the kerb shapes in detail, but it's the details even finer than that that make a track. Drivers don't walk a track to look at the big picture - you can do that in a car or from onboard videos - they do it to look at the details.

Will LFS have these details? Will Eric have gone that extra mile and talked to drivers (more experienced, better ones than me I mean) to find out what makes a track a track, and what defines the lines through a corner. Will he have bought/read the UK Circuit Guides handbook thingy? Will he have looked at Datalogging (and not just of a perfect lap) to see what is happening to the cars as they circulate.

I'd much rather have that surface fidelity than any fancy modelling grandstands, because the surface fidelity is what makes a real track real. With a fictional track you can avoid a lot of it, because the fictional track isn't trying to recreate something that actually exists. Therefore the fictional track IS the track - just a track that doesn't have dips in the kerbs at an apex drain!

Quote from Calvinaquino :

Well i'm not interested... But where are the linkies?

I have a few on my website(s), but I'm uploading some Rockingham videos to Vimeo. http://vimeo.com/tristancliffe/videos

The first one (and the last one of this week) is the wet practice session. All from 2008. I ended up on pole, by quite a margin!!!
http://vimeo.com/6733690 - it has actually finished uploading, but there is a conversion process that occurs. I don't know how long that will take...

Edit - just looked at the instance of Firefox that is doing the uploading - conversion is due to finish in 45 minutes. No, 31 minutes. No, 37 minutes. You get the idea. Check in an hour. I'll upload more next week. Wish me luck at Croft!!!!

Quote from tristancliffe :

I just replied to a PM from tinvek about this.

I believe that the devil is in the detail. The laser scanning will ensure we get a track that looks a lot like Rockingham, and maybe that is enough for 99% of players. They want immersion, but perhaps don't care about realism.

While it would be impressive to have Rockingham to the nth degree as a showcase of technical prowess if the physics/grip model of the car isn't up to the same high levels of detail (which is hugely more difficult) then the extra effort surely wouldn't be worth it? Also their is soil moisture levels that affect grip levels from day to day etc....