here are the examples of how custom view doesnt, but forces view does destroy the game;
now how exactly is the force mode an advantage over this custom view?
True, it destroys the immersion, the realism of racing. Instead of cars, all you can see are just wheels and lots of long colourful triangles. But a sensible person who plays LFS can tell that too and therefore prefers one of the "normal" views to force mode.
if you meant cockpit mode, you can see the width of the front tyres easily. and you drive the regular cockpit view which is the best view but you are able to see the front tyres.
if you meant the tyres only/no car body mode, its not changing the looks of other cars and its harder with that mode because virtual steering gauge doesnt help as much as a cockpit view does. seeing both the wheel of the car and tyres clearly is much better than seeing only the tyres. still, i think the hotlaps should be done with cockpit view only, not custom view or forces view. in races there could be custom views for me its okay. but hotlap is a serious competition and should stay like that.
and i dont want any user to see my car strange and odd like that. i have skins to present.
As for the skins, I can easily turn off car skin downloads, so I won't see your skin anyway. Does it mean the automatic skin download feature should be mandatory?
i'll use the default skins so its np
still its not a problem. i'd rather have my car look like a white fbm car than a strange driver sitting on air and has 4 tyres without suspensions and engine and has more than 4 sticks to play with.
As much as he has dug himself a hole to climb from with some ranting and opining as though it's fact, I think s.e.t.h has a point. I don't agree 100% but there is some truth to it imo.
Seth, this thread is going nowhere because you refuse to listen to anyone else's opinion as you are sure that you are correct and everyone else is wrong.
That view may help you but once you have driven a certain combo so many times you really don't need to see the front wheels to know exactly where you are on the track.
Take your hot lap combo, fbm @ bl1 the current world record holder has done 14951 online laps, that doesn't include all the attempts they have done offline in hot lap mode or single player. Do you really think that after that many laps he needs to see his front wheel to make sure he is on the perfect line?
That view may help you but once you have driven a certain combo so many times you really don't need to see the front wheels to know exactly where you are on the track.
Take your hot lap combo, fbm @ bl1 the current world record holder has done 14951 online laps, that doesn't include all the attempts they have done offline in hot lap mode or single player. Do you really think that after that many laps he needs to see his front wheel to make sure he is on the perfect line?
Remember me young Sith? Do you have the multiplayer replay of us from last year where i tired to explain why it is suboptimal way of driving with forces view?
I know what bothers you, i know how it feels not getting a straight answer, often insults instead, and i think i might provide an answer again.
I can start by answering immediately that the F-view will remain for some time if not forever. It's just that it is soooo convenient 'debug setup' feature for players that it would be a downgrade to remove it completely. There is the possibility of limiting its use for practice sessions or replays for example, removing it from competition sessions altogether. But to achieve that would require near consensus of the community that it is a bullshit method of driving in addition to it being potentially advantageous. I say potentially because there is one way i can think of it being advantageous but can't actually confirm because it would be extremely time consuming to test is and get accurate results from it. That is to simply drive both ways: lots laps in cabin, lots laps in F-mode, under most similar conditions. With many different people testing it, etc...
I know how advantageous it might look if you want to think it that way. Clear vision of the track, distance from the tire edge to the grass, etc. Taking advantage of every single pixel on the fly and what not. Pandering to such a way of driving to gain same advantage, to achieve level ground, is of course out of the question because it is bullshit. The need to 'set it right' arises.
But it takes some more experience and most of all thought to come to terms that it's not the case. The 'why' part is what i tried to explain back then. I hope to god you still have the fukin replay
In the end, explanations don't mean shit if they fail in practice. If that test could prove my logic wrong, that it is indeed an advantage, I would agree with you Sith. Toilet Paper
@ good intention Gav: opinions don't matter, arguments matter (in good intention m8
). Which he did not receive, as far as i noted tho
I know what bothers you, i know how it feels not getting a straight answer, often insults instead, and i think i might provide an answer again.
I can start by answering immediately that the F-view will remain for some time if not forever. It's just that it is soooo convenient 'debug setup' feature for players that it would be a downgrade to remove it completely. There is the possibility of limiting its use for practice sessions or replays for example, removing it from competition sessions altogether. But to achieve that would require near consensus of the community that it is a bullshit method of driving in addition to it being potentially advantageous. I say potentially because there is one way i can think of it being advantageous but can't actually confirm because it would be extremely time consuming to test is and get accurate results from it. That is to simply drive both ways: lots laps in cabin, lots laps in F-mode, under most similar conditions. With many different people testing it, etc...
I know how advantageous it might look if you want to think it that way. Clear vision of the track, distance from the tire edge to the grass, etc. Taking advantage of every single pixel on the fly and what not. Pandering to such a way of driving to gain same advantage, to achieve level ground, is of course out of the question because it is bullshit. The need to 'set it right' arises.
But it takes some more experience and most of all thought to come to terms that it's not the case. The 'why' part is what i tried to explain back then. I hope to god you still have the fukin replay
In the end, explanations don't mean shit if they fail in practice. If that test could prove my logic wrong, that it is indeed an advantage, I would agree with you Sith. Toilet Paper
@ good intention Gav: opinions don't matter, arguments matter (in good intention m8
). Which he did not receive, as far as i noted thoits impossible to go on without some ranting
there are kids capable of making anyone angry 
but promise i'll not lose time with them anymore 
i do remember you. and i do remember exactly what you told me. it was not enough back then and its not enough now. sadly i dont have the replay because i hadnt saved it back then. you should try the forces view first in blackwood+fbm combo, do some laptimes. and try to do again the same laps with just cockpit view. i tried the style you had told me but it doesnt work. in games it doesnt, maybe in reality it works. so you should try this forces view.
http://uppit.com/8p86v3vjzoeo/proof_2.mpr
Online statistics for: exzibit FBM/Blackwood: 79760 laps
"i like to see my front tyres, i use forces view"
some of fastest people on XFG/XRG@BL1 are also using view where you can see you front tyres (mostly custum). Personaly I hate any view other than cockpit, although sometimes I find myself using it (F-mode) when messing around sky ramp layouts, like when I want to park my car on the edge and so... I don't see much problem about people using other unrealistic views, I use what I enjoy. You can be just as fast in every view its all about habit.
Good memory
I prefer cabin view (or corvette uf1)! And I'm too old to test, my consistency varies, not a suitable test subject
I remember i did some laps with F-view before i invited you on the server last time, to ensure myself it supports my logic. Damn, I was so confident it would work. Oh well Good luck in your quest pal, i hope we meet online sometimes, but not in fbm, fuk that car
I prefer cabin view (or corvette uf1)! And I'm too old to test, my consistency varies, not a suitable test subject
I remember i did some laps with F-view before i invited you on the server last time, to ensure myself it supports my logic. Damn, I was so confident it would work. Oh well
Good luck in your quest pal, i hope we meet online sometimes, but not in fbm, fuk that car SETH, I know exactly what you mean, but your problem already is fixed. You have cockpit only option when you set up a server for the guys who want realism. Just go to these servers (if there are any since you are the only one whining about it) and your problem is solved
will forces view still be available after the updates?
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