Quote from GT4_PL :

Need 4096 for 4K resolution xD

Not really. The pixels in the skin are mapped to a 3D model that you see on the screen. Skin resolution is probably more related to screen size than screen resolution. A 4096px skin could be low res even in a smartphone screen, you just need to zoom enough

Unless you want to get that close to your competitors' cars, the only car you need in 4096 is your own, and even then, pretty much only in single-seaters as you're closer to visible bodywork - and you don't need to upload that particular file. So, no - unnecessary imo.

People could still share 4096 versions of their skins for people to download and install themselves if they want to, so same effect in any eventuality.

Sorry for the bump, I only just found out about this

I voted for 4096. But not because it is really useful in actual racing, but maybe for making LFS videos instead. Though I do not have really clue will there be a difference visible between 2048 and 4096 then. So maybe as optional thing for doubled price or something ( hehe hehe )


EDIT: Also, have to remember that everything is getting developed further and further

Let's remember here that any increase in any texture size has the ability to affect performance, especially on ancient rigs.

Quote from edge3147 :

Let's remember here that any increase in any texture size has the ability to affect performance, especially on ancient rigs.

That's why everyone has a settings menu in-game to adapt to its own machine

Quote from Whiskey :

Quote from edge3147 :

Let's remember here that any increase in any texture size has the ability to affect performance, especially on ancient rigs.

That's why everyone has a settings menu in-game to adapt to its own machine

Pointless because we are still catering to Windows XP.

Quote from edge3147 :

Quote from Whiskey :

Quote from edge3147 :

Let's remember here that any increase in any texture size has the ability to affect performance, especially on ancient rigs.

That's why everyone has a settings menu in-game to adapt to its own machine

Pointless because we are still catering to Windows XP.

Oh, better call Scawen, maybe he should remove Oculus Rift Support so you can keep whinning about nonsense...

It is more related to internet bandwidth then that it has something to do with in-game performance but well.... Minor detail.

I guess it's a little late in the day... but oh well didn't see it til now...
I don't know much about computers, even though working with them pays my bills, I'm still pretty clueless about all the workings. One of the things I have to worry about with graphics programs isn't so much CPU or Graphics card Ram. No. My issue is with swap space How big of a performance hit would the 4K skins have on refresh rates, swap space and memory usage in general? And ...packets(?) from using servers?
Those are kind of concerns. But on the other hand, 4k can get in a lot of detail. I know when I made skins a big problem I had was the distortion from cramming too much crap onto a car skin. Little decals looked blurry.
LOL could you work on making Matte textures for like primer? Or is that a big pain? I don't know. Is it possible to code in the ability to make gloss, semi-gloss and matte finishes on a skin at the same time?

There currently is a discussion about RGBA file format yes. This makes it possible to be more creative with gloss, semi-gloss and matte. 4K skins have no impact on performance. It eats a bit more GPU memory, takes longer to load, but loss of frame rate is not to be expected. Yes, it eats more disk space. Eight times the size of the current skins directory.

I think I am lost, but, got curious, about what will be the state of this? 2048 or even 4096?

I think we'll go with 2048px when it's time. Though I don't know when that will be. It's the usual thing of setting priorities (for Scawen in this case).

Victor: Do you have any news/infos when 2048px are used by LFS?

Sorry for the late reply.
I don't have any new information at this time. The next step towards 2048px skins is for Scawen to take and he's busy with some other topics. Perhaps after those are done? Nothing short term at least.

No problem - OK, that makes sense

Then I will still be a "bit" more patience.

JPEG compression is crappy, DXT is better, and I suppose now that LFS upgraded to Direct3D 11, it could use the even better BC compression.

The main advantage is more efficient memory use = improved performance and the ability for the GPU to potentially handle more textures (useful in a game like LFS).

I don't understand why 1024x1024 skin res download is still a paid feature. You don't want your game to look bad/low quality. People are basically creating free content for your game by creating skins. Free higher quality skin downloads will make the game look much better in every platform. When a car passes by and the text on the skin is pixelated, the guy who's watching the game doesn't know it's a limitation. He just thinks "Ehh, ugly game." You create graphical reflection for cars which make them look much better, but you keep the resolution low, I don't see the point.

I think that limitation was put in place like 15 years ago. Nowadays data is much cheaper, faster, and screens are much bigger. 4k could be paid content as of this moment, but I don't think it's wise to have players download low res skins which makes the game look ugly.

Edit: I know it's just 1€ for 1000 downloads, but most people won't bother doing that and will just let low res skins be.

For me as a graphic designer it will be good to can upload skins with 4096 resolution bcs more resolution means more details. For example all my skins are 4096px.. This is one of my best skins who i create with max resolution. (5120x4096 - real size of XRT)

I think so, it should be fine and I think it shouldn't make any difference who gets the skins.
I think it would be good for 2048px to be accepted

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

i use DXT5 BC7. that should work for DX 11 right?

BC7 and DXT5 are two separate compression method, you only use one or the other. DXT is compatible with both DX9 and DX11, while BC7 is only available to DX11 hardware.

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

i suppose if mip maps applied its better ?

For 3D objects, always use mip mapping, but in the case of LFS, see below.

For DDS files, LFS re-save them with

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

i also noticed its not possible to use jasonjason´s sunroof´s ( https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/954963#post954963 ) experimental uf1 dds skin (made it glass see through) and other experiments like chameleon skin (changes colors when hit by sun or shade). those skins were made in dds (with a test). is that then the DXT from (i think they were saved in DXT1 or DXT3) that makes it impossible to use in todays game? (oh he answers it too in post 49): https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/957656#post957656

After a discovery of DANIEL-CRO on the forum, he found out that texture loading when loading a new track could be greatly reduced by saving textures in the proper format, and made a tool to convert every textures to the proper format automatically. After that, Scawen implemented a simlar system into LFS for all DDS textures, that will automatically change the texture format to DXT1 for opaque objects, DXT5 for ALP objects, and generate mipmaps. So yeah, whatever the format you export it to, if you enable mips or not, LFS will change it if it doesn't match its needs (so mips always ON, alpha depending on "ALP" tag (for alpha blend or alpha test materials, which replaced "ATEST" and "ALPHA" on older textures) on the name).

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

i was also thinking. how does DDS compare to example TGA ?

TGA is uncompressed, so it's nice for the "source" files, but not really for use in the production game, while BC compression operate on a 4x4 pixels basis and can do 1/8th of the TGA size, for a similar resolution.

EDIT: Here's some documentation if you're interested in more detail: http://www.reedbeta.com/blog/understanding-bcn-texture-compression-formats/

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

thats not power of 4 ? why would devs make them square then? i dont get your point.

UV textures for some cars are squished, like the XRT, and the resolution to "unsquish" them it is 5120x4096 in the case of the XRT for a 4k resolution. Ideally this resolution should only be used for the creation of the texture, while the final export in DDS is resized to a power of two (so 4096x4096) to have proper compression.

Quote from THE WIZARD DK :

about the squished skin. i think i read something maybe on master skinnerz about that, or maybe here in forums.

https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/64975-The-Stretching-of-Skins

To avoid this, people use non-square resolutions (1280x1024, 2560x2048, 5120x4096, 10240x8192 and so on). UF1 and UFR are the only cars (that I noticed) that still have some vertical stretching regardless of resolution.

That seems right.

2048x2048 is 16 times as large as 512*512. 170KB * 16 = 2720 KB which is ~ 2.66MB