Quote from Fordman :

Wow, see the Ugly Boost Bug has reared again. Oh well, live with it guys, it will be gone soon enough. This is not the first time its come about, and won't be the last time either.

He talks sense people...

Quote from Crazy Harry :

He is. 29.74 is world record.

29.74?

btw. i can see a new Clan comming: NCNF: No Cheat No Fun. Maybe the biggest clan ever one day? illepall

Quote from 510N3D :

29.74?

btw. i can see a new Clan comming: NCNF: No Cheat No Fun. Maybe the biggest clan ever one day? illepall

Argh. Was still at .74 /.76.

It´s 29.68...

I dunno I still think they need to have better cheats than just the "go real fast one" I really like the oil spray from the rear end one

The more I think about it, ppl that use that "cheat" aren't being cheaters. They're being cowards. Kinda like steroids in pro sports...
now if the athletes were to contaminate the PP of their competitiors...
then that act would be worthy of being called cheating.

LOL make a cheat that makes the OTHER drivers go faster.....
I guess I ought to be quiet.. seeing how whoever digs the pit usually is the first to fall in. But oh well......

Seriously, I repeat again, maybe there ought to be a "cheats only server"
something where stats wouldn't be recorded (unless they made a "cheats" set of stats)
A lot of people and I mean A LOT of people play games using nothing but cheats. I don't really know why, but they do. Also, alot of these same people eventually get tired of using cheats and try to play... pure(?)

I dunno we have CnR servers... Banger servers... Drift servers.... Why can't there be servers with stupid crap allowed? Plus, it would keep em out of our hair on the "normal" servers.

no no no.
we dont need that.
like i already said, we have lfs tweak, mecanik.
with these u can tune up the cars on a "fair" way and its possible to use online too if the host and client has the app running and the same settings.
so...we do have "allowed cheats" every1 can set up a server and play with them (i know they r old versions but im sure when the test patch phase will be over there will be an update) and no1 get "hurt"

I just watched this with my girlfriend looking over my shoulder. She has played a bit before, and I'm getting her into it, but she's quick to learn what cars can do what. Her first words were: "Wait... the FOX doesn't do 300 km/h... is that guy f**kin' cheating?" I laughed that even SHE could see that so soon.

Quote from Racer Y :

A lot of people and I mean A LOT of people play games using nothing but cheats. I don't really know why, but they do. Also, alot of these same people eventually get tired of using cheats and try to play... pure(?)

This is NOT a game. I repeat myself. LFS is NOT a game. Lfs is a simulator !

This is not yet the ultimative simulator, but it`s close

Quote from wheel4hummer :

I have an idea, punkbuster for LFS!

No, pb is the biggest peace of crud out there. I used cedega to play online games from time to time (Cedega is a linux program that makes a windows environment with DX9 so that you can play games.). And you simply can't use cedega with PunkBuster. Don't blaim cedega, most of it is simply not it's fault. Live For Speed's detection system is fine, they just need to make sure that the client does not know when the server is asking for the clients fingerprint.

The real dumb part, I think that LFS needs a VAC style system, whereas Valves games need a LFS style anti-cheat. LFS needs a more hidden cheat detection, where its not "OH THIS BYPASSES! WE CAN CHEAT!!", it needs a more gradual system and after a week or so, the person gets for example a 1 month ban for cheating or something. Whereas CSS and stuff needs the instant "ZOMG, SOMEONE IS CHEATING, KICK" style anti-cheat.

Maybe the devs have to consider the ability for people to report others cheating, gather usernames, then at xx date, just do some mass 1 month bannage for cheating. But obviously there would have to be a group of people to watch the replays becuase for the devs it may be a bit challenging.

Sort of on a tangent, but a VAC style anti-cheat (with secure/in-secure servers where cheaters would be after cheating) might work better for LFS?

No, you can't tolerate cheating on any server, it would undermind LFS.

Well, I don't mean tolerating it on the un-secure servers, I just mean that people who have been banned from secure (cheat checked) servers, can only join insecure servers until their ban expires. Which means that there would become in theory 2 communitys, The Majority of us, in the Secure servers (with options of insecure) then the lowerlife scum, who are restricted to the 1 or 2 insecure servers, probably with jerkoff admins, and bunch of morons speedhacking eachother.

I'm sure after people getting exposed to 1 month of only racing morons who speedhack would teach them never to cheat again.

Cheating, like wrecking, seems rightly to be regarded as "socially unacceptable", in the LFS community, and since most of (if not all) the top servers joined the barricade I think wrecking on S2 has definitely dropped off to a shadow of its former self.

Cheating will go the same way as wrecking, I reckon. The benefits of it are miniscule - one or two victories - but the consequences are too severe to consider, if they get caught. Anyone can save a replay, and report a cheat to the barricade.. their actions are as good as set in stone

Sam, what do you think of a global ban file generated from the Barricade? Would it be possible/easy? I would help if I knew anything about PHP.

Quote from duke_toaster :

Sam, what do you think of a global ban file generated from the Barricade? Would it be possible/easy? I would help if I knew anything about PHP.

Should be very easy to do and I do know alot about PHP, but I don't know anything about how Barricade works. I would wait for lurLFSD to come out as that is going to have a master ban list plugin comming with it. Barricade could simply set up there own web server with the plugin send updates out. It's quite a good plugin .

A global ban file wasn't ever the intention with the barricade, but it's become feasible with the new planned version. Mikey (mkserve) is developing the new API, and one of the net effects of that will be the option to ban any/all verified names showing on the barricade database.

If we get stuck, we know where to come

Quote from Dygear :

I don't know anything about how Barricade works.

It's the simplest thing.. a central repository of reports of wreckers, including MPRs to support the report. There's also a rating system of sorts, where barricaders who have watched the MPR can add their comments, which range from "he's never coming on our server again" to "I don't see anything worthy of a kick, let alone a ban".

When someone is reported to the barricade, an email is sent to all the admins of barricaded servers to alert them to the problem, and with a link to an MPR so they can see for themselves. On a good day, a new wrecker probably gets to wreck on one or two barricaded servers before he starts getting "connection refused" messages. Sometimes he's reported and banned from servers before he ever even reaches one of the barricaded ones.

The thing I do want to stress is that the barricade is an information service. If servers want to use its facilities to ban globally, that's not our shout and we'll facilitate them. Most barricaders though, I think, want to review the offence before they act on it, and then they can act without that action being potentially disproportionate to the offence.

Back firmly on topic, I'm not sure what the UKCT admins will do long-term about people who use exploits. The initial reaction seems to be "burn him, he's a witch!" and I don't see that changing yet. There's an extra-devious side to a cheat that isn't often present in a wrecker. Wreckers are usually blatant about what they're about, but cheats probably aren't. "Sneaky"?

But thats the biggest stupidity with cheaters, they use it so blatantly, now if they used it wisely, they could pick those tenths up, and not arise suspicion.

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

But thats the biggest stupidity with cheaters, they use it so blatantly, now if they used it wisely, they could pick those tenths up, and not arise suspicion.

No need to give them silly ideas, thank you very much

Quote from Quint999 :

well if you cheat on secured servers on Source Games (Day of Defeat , CounterStrike etc ) then its permanent ban and you can only play on unsecured servers of which there are very few. Only choice , buy a new account.

if you cheat on punkbuster secured servers, Call of Duty2, Battlefield2 etc then you get Hardware banned .. punkbuster not only bans you from that specific game via cd key etc, it also generates an algorithm of your hardware and bans you from using all punkbuster managed games not just the one youve cheated on. Only way around that, buy a new system , pretty extreme yes, but tough i say thats the risk you take.

So permanent ban them to be honest, theyll cause more issues coming back to secure servers with ppl accusing them of cheating, constantly speccing them etc. Plus a months ban is not much to fear for some less regular players. Once a cheat always a cheat. If they want to play again , buy a new account.

+1 for a PunkBuster type system in LFS. But instead of just licence banning them, hardware ban them.

Quote from duke_toaster :

+1 for a PunkBuster type system in LFS. But instead of just licence banning them, hardware ban them.

You came up with the idea.

The good thing in lfs: Ban via user name. If someone see a cheater, contact the server admin and he will use the famous /ban X 9999 cheatfixer.

I am assuming there is a clause in the purchase agreement that states that if you are found to be cheating then all online accounts appertaining to your user name will be deleted. A further purchase would be required to activate a new account. Thus only offline play is achievable through the data already purchased . . . .

If there isn't a clause such as that one, there should be. Surely if it's part of the user purchase agreement then there is nothing that a 'cheater' can do about having the online account terminated. I think that is fair enough.

Appologise if this actually is the case, I'm useless at checking my facts. Actually, I'm not useless. I just can't be bothered half the time.

Why would anyone cheat in LFS? I never got to understand that. Nothing that needs to be unlocked, and nothing good comes out of it.

Quote from Funnybear :

I am assuming there is a clause in the purchase agreement that states that if you are found to be cheating then all online accounts appertaining to your user name will be deleted. A further purchase would be required to activate a new account. Thus only offline play is achievable through the data already purchased . . . .

If there isn't a clause such as that one, there should be. Surely if it's part of the user purchase agreement then there is nothing that a 'cheater' can do about having the online account terminated. I think that is fair enough.

Appologise if this actually is the case, I'm useless at checking my facts. Actually, I'm not useless. I just can't be bothered half the time.

I agree. Licence bans (one strike and you're out) for wrecking and cheating. Sort all of the problems.