Quote from Viperakecske :

Somewhat same applies to Flotch and others...havent played lfs in 10years time but still praising Scavier,no hate

lol, not playing online does not mean I do not play at all. I am even planning to buy a VR headset for my 40s coming in few days : and the goal is mainly only to use LFS with it ... no time to play frenzy, that's life, but I remain a fan of what LFS is bringing to me when I do few laps even against some AI

This thread started as a useful (or at least interesting) conversation but is going downhill, as it starts to become a discussion on the pros and cons of LFS and an outlet of anger for the usual frustrated people.

I'm tempted to move the OT posts out but instead I'll just point out what's happening before it all goes to hell.

Almost certainly later we'll have the usual posts, filled with anger, then get reported posts and I'll have to close the thread.

But small possibility we could stay on topic?

Quote from Flotch :

lol, not playing online does not mean I do not play at all. I am even planning to buy a VR headset for my 40s coming in few days : and the goal is mainly only to use LFS with it ... no time to play frenzy, that's life, but I remain a fan of what LFS is bringing to me when I do few laps even against some AI

Alrighty,online more fun

Quote from Scawen :

This thread started as a useful (or at least interesting) conversation but is going downhill, as it starts to become a discussion on the pros and cons of LFS and an outlet of anger for the usual frustrated people.

I'm tempted to move the OT posts out but instead I'll just point out what's happening before it all goes to hell.

Almost certainly later we'll have the usual posts, filled with anger, then get reported posts and I'll have to close the thread.

But small possibility we could stay on topic?

Don't worry Scawen. There are no problems here (at least I think ).

It's hard to talk about anything here without the usual catchphrases returning. It is deplorable, of course, but inevitable. This should not prevent dialogue. And I would like to answer that. If you allow it .

Quote from Avraham Vandezwin :

Don't worry Scawen. There are no problems here (at least I think ).

It's hard to talk about anything here without the usual catchphrases returning. It is deplorable, of course, but inevitable. This should not prevent dialogue. And I would like to answer that. If you allow it .

Yes your opinion is worth it, especially considering you have driven 0km online.

I wouldnt let anyone speak in forum under 50k km travelled distance

Quote from MousemanLV :

God you sound like an old man who is experiencing your 2nd mid life crisis. Get over it, the statistics speak otherwise about this game. It's a fun game but the golden times were already over in 2014. While the industry moves forward and offers more and more stuff for the simracing titles, LFS is just stuck. Not that it's a bad thing (just because a lot of you praise it and are stuck in some 2009 mindset).

At what age does the 2nd mid life crisis ? I am interested.

Seriously, people aren't right or wrong, either because they're too new to know or because they're too old to understand. It is intellectually very comfortable, but it is false.

Whether or not you play online is also irrelevant from the point of view of what we are talking about. A lot of people who buy the game are playing offline and that's understandable (and economically desirable).

To be serious, the (undeniable) fact that the industry is progressing doesn't mean there isn't room for anything other than big productions. Besides, you are the proof. You have the choice. And you are there. Don't other games allow you to have fun with friends? Why precisely on LFS?

Quote from Flotch :

lol, not playing online does not mean I do not play at all. I am even planning to buy a VR headset for my 40s coming in few days : and the goal is mainly only to use LFS with it ... no time to play frenzy, that's life, but I remain a fan of what LFS is bringing to me when I do few laps even against some AI

Since you are in the area, would it be possible to know why you no longer play online? It is not unrelated to the subject.

Is it just a matter of time and availability? Tired of online races ? Has the mod system revolutionized your offline experience with the bots ?

as a student it was more convenient to play online from time to time ... now, it would require a bit too much time to achieve any capability to drive properly a given combo .
Taking a car with a kind of default setup and doing few laps anywhere is plenty of fun, but usually I have to end quickly for "family life" or so on => short cruise sessions are satisfying (even if I agree regarding the multiplayer aspect : doing short races of GTi in the time around Blackwood was insane )

Quote from Flotch :

as a student it was more convenient to play online from time to time ... now, it would require a bit too much time to achieve any capability to drive properly a given combo .
Taking a car with a kind of default setup and doing few laps anywhere is plenty of fun, but usually I have to end quickly for "family life" or so on => short cruise sessions are satisfying (even if I agree regarding the multiplayer aspect : doing short races of GTi in the time around Blackwood was insane )

Honestly this is basically why iRacing "works" for me. I pick a car for a season to practice and run and only run that series. Then I can practice when I can and run a few races whenever and be guaranteed to get a race.

I agree thats good stuff in iracing.

But what i like in current lfs racing sohere of only organized events is that you know when a race is, what combo is gonna be raced..so for people with "family life" its kinda easier to get prepared for a race and to organize free time at the time race that youd want to participate in is happening.

Quote from YouTube :

You can also get this game for free

Maybe better to say "A free demo is available" to avoid disappointment?

Quote from Flotch :

as a student it was more convenient to play online from time to time ... now, it would require a bit too much time to achieve any capability to drive properly a given combo .
Taking a car with a kind of default setup and doing few laps anywhere is plenty of fun, but usually I have to end quickly for "family life" or so on => short cruise sessions are satisfying (even if I agree regarding the multiplayer aspect : doing short races of GTi in the time around Blackwood was insane )

I always risk being called an old man, but it was easier when it was enough to get behind the wheel under the desk at the first opportunity. We played on square 17-inch screens (with scary input lag). But we found the interior view super immersive at the time. As a result, we were often ridiculed by children playing mouse in an outside view.

Since that time, my technique has really improved on one point. Press "P" at a place where I can return at race without crashing. This is a bit of a tricky skill to exploit online . (me neither, I don't live alone in a cave)

The bots are waiting for me. Bots race without qualms. Bots don't complain if I touch them a little. Bots don't stop on the trail to chat. Bots don't try to explain to me the art of taking a curve in a language that even God doesn't know.
We're not going to have a beer together every night, but it's not going too badly. Especially since bots take vitamins with modding.

This is also what I find great in LFS. It's a game that brings together generations with different practices, and to which we remain attached even when we have become gentrified and/or withdrawn from competition (for which I have never had any ambition)

Quote from NumberTwo :

I agree thats good stuff in iracing.

But what i like in current lfs racing sohere of only organized events is that you know when a race is, what combo is gonna be raced..so for people with "family life" its kinda easier to get prepared for a race and to organize free time at the time race that youd want to participate in is happening.

People who have a family life often have a "regular" life punctuated by children. It's easier for them to predict when they will be available.
It's more complicated to register for an event without being sure to be really available on a specific date. It's also very frustrating to do qualifying and pass the race in the pits because of a big call.
LFS is a great online game. I have very good memories with it. I may come back online in a few years if the concept of retirement still exists.

For now, I would consider playing online again if I was sure I wouldn't disturb anyone, because I'm not there or not prepared enough.
I dream of something very simple. Cars with few adjustment possibilities. A competitive AI to complete the grid. Races without qualifying, with random allocation at the start. No discussions during the race. Penalizing damage in the event of a collision.

I recognize that it is not very user-friendly idea...

Quote from Avraham Vandezwin :

The bots are waiting for me. Bots race without qualms. Bots don't complain if I touch them a little. Bots don't stop on the trail to chat. Bots don't try to explain to me the art of taking a curve in a language that even

Fair enough if it's what you enjoy, but to be honest, you can hardly call what LFS AI is doing racing.

Putting aside the question of some YouTubers not doing enough research. On the subject of the perception of LFS as an old game:

Recently I did a little research and made some notes on the subject of changing LFS to 64-bit. That's not the subject of my point and it would barely affect LFS at first. There are some reasons to move to 64-bit at some point but one part of the process would be rebuilding all connected libraries as 64-bit, one of which might be the music player. But I don't even know where the source code for that is, probably available online but no doubt changed since the one we got a couple of decades ago.

It got me thinking, do we need the music player at all? Well... no, we don't really need an intro video, setupscreenloop.ogg and in-game radio system.

Today that thought came back to me, I wondered if the whole idea of an intro video is outdated. Some time over 20 years ago, that was the expected thing, an intro video when you started the game (probably rendered) and in-game music. But obviously people use other ways to play music now and I assume it's pretty rare to use the 'radio' in LFS.

On-point, I wondered if even the existence of the (not very good) intro replay made the game look outdated and it might be best to simply display the logo when loading and go straight in (to Welcome or Entry screen).

I admit that I never listened to the radio in LFS and always evacuated the intro video.

Quote from johneysvk :

Fair enough if it's what you enjoy, but to be honest, you can hardly call what LFS AI is doing racing.

It's not what I like. It's for lack of anything better.

LFS AI is not fantastic. I don't know of any game with fantastic AI. And you ?

But the LFS AI is not catastrophic. It does the job. The bots behave quite believable (for bots ). And the Mod system can now significantly improve AI lap times, which are way too slow.

Certainly, it is not a magic improvement. And the AI tends to mow the lawn a lot and have psychotic behavior. But it's more intense and entertaining than being first in 3 laps.

Quote from Scawen :

It got me thinking, do we need the music player at all? Well... no, we don't really need an intro video, setupscreenloop.ogg and in-game radio system. :

This reminded me of a recent post by r3zp3k7 who uses the LFS music system but isn't happy because it doesn't support more formats: https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/2033665#post2033665

Personally, I find the music feature a bit useless nowadays when you can just play a playlist from your favourite music streaming service or using a music player app with local files / playlists. But maybe there are still some people who use it. Perhaps because you can skip the tunes while driving? I don't know what their reasons are.

'Not fantastic' quite an understatement.

They follow the racing line with zero variation and brake when detecting a car near them. That's nowhere near 'fantastic'.
And with some mods it can be quite catastrophic tbh
I find it hard to believe that other current simracing titles aren't on a higher level than that.

Not that i imagine programming an AI driver is exactly an easy task, and with primary focus of LFS being a multiplayer game, i'm not surprised it's not a priority.

Quote from Flame CZE :

This reminded me of a recent post by r3zp3k7 who uses the LFS music system but isn't happy because it doesn't support more formats: https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/2033665#post2033665

Personally, I find the music feature a bit useless nowadays when you can just play a playlist from your favourite music streaming service or using a music player app with local files / playlists. But maybe there are still some people who use it. Perhaps because you can skip the tunes while driving? I don't know what their reasons are.

indeed, lfs is a racing simulator, not music simulator

Quote from Scawen :

It got me thinking, do we need the music player at all? Well... no, we don't really need an intro video, setupscreenloop.ogg and in-game radio system. Smile

I used the in-game radio back in 2010 when spotify wasn't as popular, but these days spotify and apple music is the way to go.

I also never used LFS music player.
Also I think there is no need of intro (music or video) either.

But being on the tracks there is no background sounds, which can be added via a music player or some sort.

I suggest to add (it the future) a background sounds simulating a track/city environment which can be turned on/off in the audio options.
This will make the experience more immersive.

EDIT: There is a wind sound only when the car engine is running and being close to the car.
EDIT №2: The attached screenshot is from BeamNG.

Quote from johneysvk :

'Not fantastic' quite an understatement.

They follow the racing line with zero variation and brake when detecting a car near them. That's nowhere near 'fantastic'.
And with some mods it can be quite catastrophic tbh
I find it hard to believe that other current simracing titles aren't on a higher level than that.

Not that i imagine programming an AI driver is exactly an easy task, and with primary focus of LFS being a multiplayer game, i'm not surprised it's not a priority.

That's what I often read here. But that doesn't completely match my experience with AI. Scawen may shed us some light on AI programming one day, but it sounds more subtle than what you're describing.

It's true, when you start a first race with the AI, you sometimes have the impression of seeing a train come on a line. But after a few races, that changes. Behaviors become more varied. Lap times improve (a little ). AIs make mistakes. Bots seem to be trying stuff.

When bots are boosted (with more powerful engines on the original cars in the game) all these phenomena are amplified. The AIs double-cross you with rage. They sometimes brake too late and get out. Or get in the way. Sometimes it gets messy but it's often amazing, at least entertaining.

I no longer play online, but I am unable to take a lap on the track alone without getting bored .

I understand that AI is not a priority, but it exists and deserves to be a little better. Many people play against the AI. And a good AI would be better online.