The online racing simulator
Rfactor vs LFS
12711
13
1516212735455665727475
(1872 posts, started )
#301 - axus
I'm gonna side with Kid to some extent on this one. Honestly, you guys ought to read his posts and think at the same time. He won't do the thinking for you. Maybe you'll see that most of his posts have a vaild point. As for going to other forums to sign up a new account just to "review" another sim or something to that effect, that I don't get. nK-Pro and rFactor, to me are not interesting enough to talk about, let alone argue over.

Back to the topic, the whole attitude of ISI simmers towards the sims that its OK to be mediocre annoys me. The LFS community on the other hand doesn't let go of something until its fixed. IMO, LFS is in a bit of a boring state right now. The tyre model is extremely realistic and as such very predictable and few of the other things that a racer has to think about in real life are simmulated so there's really not much to keep one interested.
#302 - Don
imho its just that "noobs" like the bling bling design of softwares - metal, bevel, many sounds, button gets "pressed" when you click on it, everything is animated, sparks, lens flare, glow, bloom, while "pros" are more happy with the simplest design, without any special effects. I dont know about 1 thing in lfs menus which could make it look arcadish.

and on topic:
august 2006: installed rfactor, tried few mods (vw lupo, pcc, megane, lienz, nurbirging),
august 2006:uninstalled.
X
september 2002: unpacked lfs
#303 - Pain-less
I like them both LFS and rFactor. I even like GTL and GTR. I have them all, and will most likely buy GTR2. Although I spend most of my time in rFactor.


I also like Operation Flashpoint and Americas Army, anyone want to debate those? <I was just kidding about the debate>
#304 - Jakg
its the little things i love about LFS, like when you click a button it doesnt just play a "click" sound, it looks at where the button was on screen and puts it out the correct speaker (ie a button on the right realeases a right-channel biased sound)

I love the fact that you can run lfs in windowed mode, oh, i just love LFS!
#305 - AndroidXP
Quote from Jakg :... oh, i just love LFS!

QFE = quoted for emphasis, for all that don't know
#306 - Jakg
Quote from AndroidXP :QFE = quoted for emphasis, for all that don't know

yeap, its the little things, like the easy setup and skins, and stuff like OutGauge, i don't know anyone that bought LFS just for it, but the Devs put it in anyway, and its great, its a programmer doing what he does best without some marketing bloke riding him for a realease 3 weeks ago, and yes, it means that things take longer in the short term, but things get done right the first time. Its a dream of a game, and if it cost £100 id buy it all over again, heck i love it (LFS) and the community, so i bought it again, i just hope that Scavier takes it and goes and has a trip down the pub
#307 - yegadoyai
As you can see I'm pretty knew to the S2 licensed deal here and I have to say I'm loving every minute of it. Jumping online and racing and all that is great, physics yada yada yada.

Tried rFactor because I wanted to see if the 70s F1 was up to much and instantly disliked it in the same (but reverse) way to the way I reacted to LFS. Shame really as I wanted to race the 70s F1 cars.

Which brings me neatly to my point. rFactor is covering a different sector of the race sim market to LFS (user updateable content, fancy graphics etc) but what of those things would be most important to people should they be brought to LFS and what of LFS would be most important if it were to go to rFactor?

If LFSs only saving grace is it's physics moddeling then I say, we, the community PAY to get the LFS physics engine into rFactor. That way we don't have two sims to pay for and update and bitch and moan about when the latest patch doesn't work etc. It may be a labour of love by the holy trinity but at the end of the day would we not benefit more if that happened?

Likewise if the only real benefit behind rFactor is the graphics (read immersion aswell) and updateable content then we at least know what we should lobby hardest for in the improvements section.

This was always going to be a flame war but maybe the devs could get some sense of perspective if we tried to look at it objectively.
#308 - Hyperactive
Just minutes away from the "100% downloaded rf demo"...

The way I see it, LFS has always been the pure and raw sim where rf is the overly polished lesn flare app and the GPL the true believers playground. GTRs and GTLs go with the same class with rf, just eyecandy over physics.

But that is just my opinion and I'm not forcing others to think that way.

The main thing is for me, that when decisions are made I can feel pretty confident that they aren't made on the basis of money income or "product ego" or wtf the right word was. Physics have and will be the main part of LFS and that's the reason why we're here, right?

NKpro tried to get both goals but has so far been a failure.

Oops, download must have finished like minutes ago

EDIT: Fawk! I get to load 45%, then the fawking sh*t tells me that some dll is messing around. Grrr
EDIT2: emptying the temp folder can make magic happen, gee
#309 - BWX232
Quote : whats a real shame is that for 2 years you havent stoped your bashing of lfs, and the usual "whatever in fashion isi product" propaganda.
anyone can make up their mind and anyone can see whats the best online racing sim.you and deggis sound like a broken record and i wish we would get better trolls , with creativity, and proper ill intended acute thought. you guys just bore me. keep trashing this sim in bhms or rsc and whatever you want but if u wanna trash it here pick better references than plastic toy rfactor, or no one here will give a shit at what you are saying. its not even a sim, and worse, its not fun at all.

Are you illiterate or something? If your post directly after my last post was directed at me you must be.. I never bashed anything. illepall




Quote from KiDCoDEa :at least i read the posts i reply to. stop posting like an american clan.

Nice to see that you are also a bigoted, prejudice anti-American.. Par for the course!!


Pick up the latest A.S.S and read about Driver's Republic physics and maybe you'll understand why LFS isn't the god of physics like you think. It is better than most, but very far from perfect, just like all other race sims on the planet.
#310 - AndroidXP
#311 - BWX232
Quote from AndroidXP ::doh:

Yeah I forgot some people here are allergic to a unbiased, neutral point of view..

Or do you not even know what A.S.S. is?
#312 - AndroidXP
Yes, it's that online magazine that provided us with that unbiased and neutral point of view of how awsome and hyper and revolutionizing nKP is.
#313 - Blackout
Don't say it's the same magazine which ran stories about nKpro. Is it?

edit. oh, ok..slow typing here :P
#314 - axus
Quote from BWX232 :Yeah I forgot some people here are allergic to a unbiased, neutral point of view..

Or do you not even know what A.S.S. is?

ASS is a magazine that's in its early stages and too afraid to publish anything that might offend some reader, nevermind a whole sim-making company. If you think seing the world through pink glasses is fine, then I can see why RSC and indeed ISI sims are in the state in which they are.
#315 - AndroidXP
Quote from BWX232 :...

Anyway, please don't get me wrong, I did by no means want to discredit DR or something. It's just that since the nKP debacle, I judge a game after I have played it, not by something someone has said, especially if A.S.S. is the source. DR's physics model might aswell be better than the LFS one, but I cannot give an opinion to that, as I haven't played it myself. Why on earth you steer the discussion to Drivers Republic in a "rFactor vs LFS" thread is beyond me, though.
#316 - Pain-less
Quote from axus :If you think seing the world through pink glasses is fine, then I can see why RSC and indeed ISI sims are in the state in which they are.

Just curious, but what state would that be?
#317 - deggis
BWX, thanks for the hint actually... after the nkPoo bullshit I banned ASS but now I just had to read that DR arcticle and it was actually good, though still written in some weird "we have never played any other sims than GTR" way. Although this time they can't talk 100% bullshit because you can already test and play DR.
#318 - Shotglass
Quote from Don :I dont know about 1 thing in lfs menus which could make it look arcadish.

the only thing i know of that could be described as arcadeish is the spinning car on the race setup screen other than that i have no idea what people are talking about

the only menu i know which looks even less like an arcade game than lfses is nkps which i would like a lot if it werent awefully slow and integrated into the game engine
#319 - axus
Quote from Pain-less :Just curious, but what state would that be?

RSC supports mediocrity and misguidance.

"I don't like this about this sim. I think it should be like this instead. What do you guys think?" - "ZOMG, you fanboy!"

Thus, ISI sims never get out of their state of mediocrity and they are just almost the same product re-packaged with new cars and tracks because the fan base doesn't want anything more. They are willing to buy the same thing over and over again and the companies are giving them just that...
#320 - ajp71
I like the LFS menus and would choose them over those in pretty much every other sim, however, I can totally understand how they look arcadish in comparison to other sims and I remember it being a factor that put me off the original S2 demo.

and Kid please grow up your senseless ranting has absolutely no benefit, your not helping to get the points across.
#321 - tristancliffe
According to ASS (Brilliant name - they obviously completely ignore the downsides of it, just like they ignore the downsides of anything the write about)

LFS is best
rFactor is best
GTR is best
GTR2 is best and GTR1 was rubbish
nKP will be best
DR will be best
RBR is best

I don't even bother reading it anymore. So I don't think them hyping DR means anything in the slightest. Until it's out it could turn out to be utterly utterly rubbish.

But we all know LFS isn't perfect. If it was there would be no need for alpha and beta stages, or S3. None of the others above are perfect either, and they have their alpha and beta stages, and other than the odd patch here and there, won't recieve any more support (nKP might, but don't get your hopes up as Kunos is now so ashamed of posting on RSC that he's gonna wear a gorilla suit and hide in the congo until people forget he existed).
#322 - Captain Slow
i havent read this thread because its a bit to long now, but i want to say, lfs needs a bit of class, or style. im not sure how to word it, but when i used to play gt4 on my ps2(in the days before broadband and my knowledge of lfs), it had a feeling of sophistication, whether it was just the background music or something else. but lfs seems to be missing this. not that it effects the driving as lfs outstrips everything iv played before.
#323 - Pain-less
Quote from axus :RSC supports mediocrity and misguidance.

"I don't like this about this sim. I think it should be like this instead. What do you guys think?" - "ZOMG, you fanboy!"

Thus, ISI sims never get out of their state of mediocrity and they are just almost the same product re-packaged with new cars and tracks because the fan base doesn't want anything more. They are willing to buy the same thing over and over again and the companies are giving them just that...

And that's your opinion, I can't say I agree with RSC "supporting" that type of behavior, although I do see it.

Your second paragraph describes marketing practices. Look at GTR and GTR2...fancy packaged "more of the same" "new & improved". In time LFS S3 will do the same. Maybe some new cars, new tracks, but pretty much the same thing. It's not called mediocrity but marketing. You provide the public with what they will purchase. LFS will be no exception to that rule. The devs have to make a living too.

Oh and BTW, I do like LFS
#324 - axus
Quote from Pain-less :And that's your opinion, I can't say I agree with RSC "supporting" that type of behavior, although I do see it.

Your second paragraph describes marketing practices. Look at GTR and GTR2...fancy packaged "more of the same" "new & improved". In time LFS S3 will do the same. Maybe some new cars, new tracks, but pretty much the same thing. It's not called mediocrity but marketing. You provide the public with what they will purchase. LFS will be no exception to that rule. The devs have to make a living too.

Oh and BTW, I do like LFS

Yes, its my oppinion by the virtue of the fact that I said it.

What I'm getting at is the fact that the physics, the actual engine is hardly changing from version 1 to version 2. The fact that RACE will have a simulation of random stones hitting the car and thus affecting its travel is a pointer to the fact that they're running out of ideas and they don't know what's wrong with their current simulation (and I have seen FEM-generated data that suggests that GTR2's slip angle vs lateral force curve alone is 35% off at points). LFS, although a bit boring at the moment, is really on top in terms of tyre physics.
#325 - Boris Lozac
It's an excellent discusion in these last couple of posts.
What really pisses me off in this kind of discussions beatwean ISI games and LFS, is that when you say something that makes perfect sense and it really is true, for example "ISI FF tells me nothing, i don't know when is going to countersteer or whatever" the ISI fanboys never listen, and they will always defend it, and never give you an answer to that.. illepall
It's like in this documentary "conspiracy theory" when they present bunch of evidence how Nasa and USA governement lied and never landed on the Moon, and then the Nasa spokesman "reject" that with no counter proof or whatsoever, just says that it is not true, and that they really landed on the Moon. Then say something in defence, or give some evidence that you did?? No hard feelings to the Americans, maybe you reall did land.
It's the same when discussing things with ISI fans.. they just rejects you and say that it is not true, just because they can drive the "Porsche" or whatever. And then i can't help but think that they don't care about the physics at all, they care more about having real cars and tracks, and the physics can be ok, nevermind. I mean, am i wrong or what?? That just really pisses me off, you can't discuss things in normal way..
12711
13
1516212735455665727475

Rfactor vs LFS
(1872 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG