Regarding Kev's comment about being excited with the prospect of learning a new, better LFS technique (heel and toe with clutch, rather than using auto-blip or no clutch), I have ordered a clutch addon for my ECCI pedals to plug into the G25 - yippee yippee joy joy! I can't wait to balance a clutch at the start, avoid bogging down and properly heel&toeing (something I've tried and failed to do with G25 pedals).

Great news (and I only read the first page of this thread)!
Only when I saw "new car" I hoped it would be a car, not some sort of driving device. (Yes, I hate formulas )

Quote from The Very End :

I do understand that people find it strange and utterly stupid that I and others chose to drive with chase view, it`s all ok.

But why do you let your choice of view be such a big issue? If chase view disappeared tomorrow, would you really stop playing because of it? Is change really that scary? It would take you a week, tops, to adapt to cockpit view if you really wanted to, probably a lot less. It's only a problem because you let it be one.

As long as the goal of a change is making LFS more realistic (within the boundaries of computer gaming of course), I really don't mind changing my ways to adapt. It's a challenge, treat it as such.

It`s just that, erhm how to explain this hmm... anyway, it`s just that I have used it since S1. It`s something that I allways have done, in any game, to chose chase veiw. And trust me, I once tried to drive cockpit veiw for some days, sure, I can go around track but I`ll lose those 5 seconds lol.

My point it, it`s a limitation. It should not develope that way. The game should open new aspects, adding new contest and fixing current contest. But it should not ( BUT THIS IS IMO IMO IMO!!!) limitate the current choises that are in the game.

It`s not like removing the chase veiw would kill me, but it`s the principe (horrible fail spelled) about it, that you removing something that is pretty important to some people, because other people want it to be realistic. I think it`s unfair, but again, everything is imo

Quote from Vykos69 :

SILENCE




I KILL YOU!

oh noo not agmet or is it Achlem...,,,????

see, the forced cockpit view isnt a limitation. As it is an option it increses the choices of servers. Those width and those without. Same for leagues Now people can look, if they want to drive in an fcv league or an arcade (err sorry, free choice of view) league

Quote from Vykos69 :

see, the forced cockpit view isnt a limitation. As it is an option it increses the choices of servers. Those width and those without. Same for leagues Now people can look, if they want to drive in an fcv league or an arcade (err sorry, free choice of view) league

Baning chase veiw from the game is something else, don`t you think?

i find it funny that people are complaining about a patch that isn't even out yet. would you complain about a meal that hasn't been cooked yet? so what if you have to blip the throttle yourself. i'll just let you ladies get back to the speculations and assumptions.
"don't knock it until you try it"

Quote from The Very End :

I just want to point out that people should be able to play the game how they want. If it`s a wheel, keyboard, pad or if it`s chase veiw, cockpit veiw or custom veiw. What I hope, and beg for, is that there will be no more "limitations", that decrease the enjoyment of this fantastic game. I do understand that people find it strange and utterly stupid that I and others chose to drive with chase view, it`s all ok. But, as someone has asked for many times, baning chase veiw and other optional choises or put restrictions and limitations of any kinds is a bad idea.

I think these thoughts here are flawed in the sense of LFS. I agree with both sides of the arguement, for Tristan in how LFS should be about, but also to have the options for new players to learn. Not everyone can pick it up perfectly right away. Some need the tools to be able to learn. LFS does not have someone sitting in the car beside you to teach you. You are on your own 99% of the time.

It's not that "people should be able to play how they want". They should play it like it is replicating racing a car virtually. That is what LFS is. But for the learning process, the features discussed are helpful until you are able to compete as it is intended.

Many are here to play a game. Many are here to replicate what they can not do IRL, that is race. LFS gives us the tool to replicate that racing to the best capablities on a PC and is what it's intention is to do. It is not being developed as the game that many are here for. But the tools are needed to not shy away those who are just starting their hobby of PC sim racing.

I think we should call Blueflame Toenails, he is so far up Tristans arse we can only see his toenails and we would need a calving jack to get him out...



(sorry if a failed badly :schwitz

i (personally) welcome all aids that are offered to new drivers. as long and they can't be used on "live" servers.

Quote from mrodgers :

But the tools are needed to not shy away those who are just starting their hobby of PC sim racing.

But that's the whole point, they shouldn't be shy away, they should be "omg, this is so real and hard, can't believe i finaly found a sim that is worthy of my free time"
Like i said, i wouldn't expect to buy a Joystick, start up the Flight Simulator and expect to perfectly launch a plane from the airport and land it in the first try, if i do, than the game is not realistic and i would be put off by it.. because it is impossiblle to do it in the first try..
But i'm not saying this because of the racin line help and that, i'm talking about more arcadey helps that destroys the whole simulation thing.. like someone said, if Hamilton doesn't have a perfect racing line in that Mclaren simulator it's rubish then

but you will land the plane if you do it through the tutorial. (been there, done that)

http://nakkitartsani.1g.fi/kuv ... ForSpeed/newsouthcity.jpg

Quote from mrodgers :

Not everyone can pick it up perfectly right away. Some need the tools to be able to learn.

Sure, some tools (like auto clutch) are okay and indeed necessary, but many others aren't strictly needed. Blip on downshift and to a lesser extent throttle cut are examples of these IMO.

You can get around the track perfectly fine without blipping. Whether you blip or not will only make a real difference once you're at a certain speed and you need every tenth of a second you can get to improve your lap time. Throttle cut should also be fairly easy to understand in Patch Y since you won't be able to shift without doing it in most cars. People will learn that pretty quickly if you let them.

Quote from niall09 :

I think we should call Blueflame Toenails, he is so far up Tristans arse we can only see his toenails and we would need a calving jack to get him out...

You, sir, are 100% correct. And Tristan is so far up Logitech's arse as well.

Quote from sinbad :

I just find the "LFS is too popular" sentiment more idiotic than anything else I've read in this thead. Sounds like cheesy fanboy speak, but give Scawen and co. some credit. The forum might become more populated by nos-seeking cruisers as the numbers continue to increase, but I don't think LFS will suddenly drift away from the realistic, serious, online racing philosophy as a result. Just be glad people continue to buy LFS licenses!

I also agree.

LFS - being a proper sim - will have a steep learning curve. BUT surely it's right to give them a few foot holds.

Re. hotlapping with the line. The line probably won't be of any assistance to people like Bawbag or for that matter anyone that is in the top half of most public server races.

Re. the blipping issue - where does this leave users of hardware with a single throttle/brake axis (pad users, joystick users, users of older wheels)? I'm pretty sure most racing cars with sequentials basically autoblip.

I don't have an issue with a FCV PROVIDED it is forced COCKPIT not forced back seat, which, TBH, is what the current cockpit view looks rather like. IMO moving it a bit further forward would be very helpful, when you sit in a car seat you see more road than car interior.

Let's see what happens though. Few things are official at this stage.

HOWEVER. Tristan has a right to his opinion (I.E. to be an advert for Logitech). However, we all have our right to an opinion (to agree with him, disagree with him, tell him to shut up or laugh at him). Even that idiot Griffin does.
Even though Tristan looks like an advert for logitech

Yeah I mean why on earth is someone's concern what view are other using? Is that disturbing someones here or what?

Those other views aren't for the racing view only but to look at your car, surroundings and such.

I have a feeling that the people who are whining about other people using anything different from what they are using are just childish and as The Very End sais can't imagine further than their own nose

Is it so hard to accept that someone just likes to use kb+mouse instead of wheel, can't afford it or is desabled? Is it so hard to accept that someone drives from different angle than you do?
What is so hard in that that?

Does it bother you so much that you have to rely on some lines like "Life isn't fare so poor people and disabled ones should stay away from this game 'cause I think that this is harcore sim" or "If you can only handle NFS and are new to the LFS don't even try and stay within the arcades" ?
Some weird lines are used in this topic :twirl:

Quote from duke_toaster :

Tristan is so far up Logitech's arse as well.

Tristan has a right to his opinion (I.E. to be an advert for Logitech).

Even though Tristan looks like an advert for logitech

How does buying ECCI pedals make you a Logitech shill exactly?

Some people need to do more reading and less posting.

Quote from thisnameistaken :

How does buying ECCI pedals make you a Logitech shill exactly?

Some people need to do more reading and less posting.

+1

I also may add to my post that I agree on the most part with Tristan

Quote from Californian :

Yeah I mean why on earth is someone's concern what view are other using? Is that disturbing someones here or what?

Those other views aren't for the racing view only but to look at your car, surroundings and such.

I have a feeling that the people who are whining about other people using anything different from what they are using are just childish and as The Very End sais can't imagine further than their own nose

Is it so hard to accept that someone just likes to use kb+mouse instead of wheel, can't afford it or is desabled? Is it so hard to accept that someone drives from different angle than you do?
What is so hard in that that?

Does it bother you so much that you have to rely on some lines like "Life isn't fare so poor people and disabled ones should stay away from this game 'cause I think that this is harcore sim" or "If you can only handle NFS and are new to the LFS don't even try and stay within the arcades" ?
Some weird lines are used in this topic :twirl:

you're forgetting the fact that when someone uses chase view they are physically not in the car, which makes the car lighter and gives them an advantage over the rest of us. so really, it isn't fair.

Well, one thing I learned from the video is that Scawen is pronounced "Skån", and not "Skeiven". I've always assumed the latter was correct.

Quote from UncleBenny :

you're forgetting the fact that when someone uses chase view they are physically not in the car, which makes the car lighter and gives them an advantage over the rest of us. so really, it isn't fair.

I hope that's sarcasm. The driver is still in the car.

The advantage that some seem to think is that they can be more aware around themselves and see the corners better.

My view is, the chase view users have a disadvantage as they don't have a first person's view of how the car is reacting, thus g-forces and the behavior of the oversteer/understeer.

..and it looks really stupid

The excuse of "I always driven like this" is kinda lame. Older games often didn't have in car view, so I used the external cam a lot too, because I hated hood cams. You just need a bit time to adapt, since I've been playing LFS, I always used the interior view, and when I play other games without interior view now, I use the hood view because it feels way better because I got used to it now.

Good greif!



TristIan is definitely right, and why are people saying that he can't "see outside himself"? That's hogwash, and nothing he's said has solicited that kind of response.

Heck, even I'm nervous about the clutch heat because of my poor driving habits (dragging the engine slowly up to RPM on downshifts using the clutch) but I'm still 100% glad it's there.

What's so hard about understanding that LFS "should" be played with a wheel (and if possible a clutch pedal too)? If you can't for whatever (likely bogus) reason, or don't want to, then fine - but don't whine about not being able to control a car properly with buttons, because that's rather silly.

Sinbad, I don't think TristIan mean't "absolute" popularity, but rather specific popularity with certain groups. "Groups" exist, not everyone is the same as has been pointed out.

TVE and co, quit saying "treat everone the same" and then in the same breath argue that "everyone is different". (!)

...

On a different note, since clutch heat is in... it should be almost copy and paste code to do brake temps! :hide: