I've been out of LFS for just over a year and getting back into it now, but i'm experiencing some strange gear shifting problems.
I've brought myself up to speed, and gather that it has alot to do with the clutch blip being taken out. I use a momo black and the paddles so i put the clutch on auto. I can't change down the gears with the throttle down, that makes sense but sometimes i can't change up with the throttle hard down.
I've had a good look around the forum to try and see exactly why it does this, but all i've found is people moaning about the clutch change. How should i be using it?
i see tristan missed the important bit. the reason you cant change down with the throttle down is you are probably driving one of the cars with the sequential and ignition cut?? so for it to "allow" a change down you need to be off the accelerator, hope that helps.
I think it's a shame this has been implemented. It just makes it harder to drive the cars, takes some of the enjoyment out of it unless you have a clutch pedal, which i don't have.
It's implemented because this way LFS is closer to reality. Certainly not a shame. And I don't think it's very hard to blip or change gears with a little more caution. This has nothing to do with clutch pedal. I don't really see how this takes out the enjoyment, quite the opposit IMHO. LFS won't get any easier, it's a simulator and if you don't like this little change I don't think you will like S2 final which probably will require more skill and mechanical sympathy to drive than the current version.
Thanks for that, but you still didn't tell me what was wrong with the blip?
Mate, i'm looking out at the LFS world on a 22inch monitor on a crappy desk, this isn't very realistic. The reason why i mentioned the clutch pedal is because of the realism your going on about. Do you change gear IRL by lifting off the throttle and changing up or down on sequential paddles, no...
The monitor thing is a limitation of computing. Deal with it. The control interface doesn't need to be quite as constrained, so it can be more realistic.
Not many road or race cars have auto blip, so why should they in LFS?
And yes, most sequential boxes require a lift. Don't confuse sequential with semi-automatic.
Judging by the aggressive replies by certain people in this thread and around the forum i can see this is a sore point. So I'm not gonna comment about this anymore.
And thanks tristan, i deal with my monitor everyday.
The sore point is that lots of people complain about the gear changing or the clutch without having the slightest bit of knowledge to back it up. In your case you thought sequentials didn't need a throttle lift. We've put you right, and now you can concentrate on driving in LFS like you drive in real life, but with an automatic clutch.
I don't have a clutch pedal either. It didn't take very long to get used to lifting off the throttle between shifts. In fact, I avoid driving the XRR and FXR now because you can (should) flatshift those, but I just can't force myself to anymore.
Give it try and I'm sure you'll find it's not that hard to adjust.
Danke, I'm exactly the same, came back to lfs after quite a long break, got in the new car and wondered what the hell was going on whilst trying to flatshift (well i used to have throttle cut on) read the forums, found i just had to lift sorted.... few days later I thought I had somehow stuck throttle cut on again because my timings between letting off the throttle and changing gear was pretty near perfect, so its very easy to adjust.
Now throttle blipping I just can't get my head around, but that maybe something to do with using autoclutch, it just seems to change gear to quick for me to blip. Is it actually worth blipping all the time in the formula cars?
What if devs would remove autoclutch from all cars except XRR, FXR and one-seaters?
No, this was no rant. Clutch can be assigned as button, and usually wheels have several buttons that can be used... After all, blip was removed to make LFS more realistic. Next step would be to remove auto-clutch.
But that would put everyone with out a clutch pedal at a pretty major disadvantage, button clutch its either full on or off, no control over it really.
Keyboard-users already have this kind of disadvantage.
To put little bit rant into my post, I would say "Real cars with manual transmission has clutch pedal. Why should someone who wants to simulate these cars using computer simulator would use controller without one?"
As I said in the most recent clutch thread I use manual clutch all the time, even when I'm racing with mouse and keyboard and I never had any problem. You don't need a lot of clutch control to race, you can pull away or change gears perfectly with a button clutch after a little practice.
Because controllers cost pennies, not everyone has the pennies to splurge out on a new controller. Everyone has a limit on how much they're willing to spend on a sim, I don't drive often enough and I'm not fast enough to justify getting a g25 (or that porsche 911 wheel).
To truly simulate these cars you'd need a full motion rig and top of the range wheel/pedal set, are you willing to buy that?
_--NZ--_[HUN]: Indeed I am praticing :P but removing auto clutch will put most people at a disadvantage untill clutch pedals are the standard on wheels.
I am willing to pay for ultimate realism. If you don't require as realistic driving simulator as possible, why do you need features like clutch heat, suspension behaviour or traction (The way it is simulated in LFS)? What is left? Semi-realistic driving simulator.
No, I am not judging you. Wheel without necessary features (Clutch and h-shifter for street cars) is like flight simulator using TAC-2 (It is not analog, does not have force feedback and only has one button).
Imho controller without clutch, h-shifter and less than "enough" turn rate is not for simulators, it is for arcade. My car's wheel turns more than 270 degrees...
Edit: Forgot to answer to the main question. If someone can't afford to buy necessary equipments to start any kind of hobby, maybe he should pick other (Cheaper) hobby. Sounds pretty rude, but life isn't fair.
I don't NEED features like you mentioned but they add to the challange, but removing autoclutch whilst adding to this challange would also give other racers who have a clutch pedal a bigger advantage, it might be minor but its still there. I'm not willing to pay for ultimate simulation, and I'm pretty sure you're not, if you are please post pictures of your full motion rig, custom steering wheel and pedals made to order.
And If you what the most realistic driving sim possible why not just go and drive nkP? For me its not just the realism I play LFS for, its the ease of racing against other people,all the support it gets from the devs (not just updates, but LFSworld and the skin system etc) and I feel for alot of people thats the reason they play LFS as well.
I got my wheel a few months into using LFS (just before the G25 was released), before hand I had an old 180 thrustmaster modena, upgraded to a dfp, the best there was at the time, the wheel everyone recommended for sim racing, or I could of splurged out on a top of the range setup, hmm £80 or £1000. Now that wheel is good enough, alot of people still use it, and I'm just not willing to upgrade untill I have enough disposible income to justify it.
The reason why I choose to play sims, is because real racing isn't cheap. I enjoy gaming, and I enjoy sims, should I just give up because I can't afford the very best? Thats like saying an angler shouldn't fish because he can't afford the very best equipment and go out on a boat in the pacific every time. Alot of hobbiest make do with the equipment they can afford.
Equipment that allows you to feel g-forces would be as useful as FFB. It gives an advantage over to those who don't have one. You could have much better feel to the car and thus can react to situations that you can't predict without one. Nope, don't have that yet, but I have been planning to make one for years. Originally wanted to have one when I played orbiter.
Also devs should disable brake help, as there is no such thing in real life. Auto-shift is also unrealistic, as it doesn't work like real automatic transmission.
For the same reason I used to play Rainbow Six using hardest difficulty (Makes it more realistic when you don't have helping features. Imho auto-aim in your h&k mp5 is a little bit odd).
My ultimate realism doesn't concern traction control, however, as there are lots of cars irl with TC (Discussed in other thread, and most of the hc-lfsers was against my suggestion that there should be more street cars with TC)
Until even the most basic wheel comes with a clutch pedal I would call that a realism step too far. A button isn't going to be progressive like a clutch is so would be more unrealistic than having auto clutch as far as I'm concerned.
It's all well and good touting the "LFS is a sim" argument, (and I'm all for it in principle), but it can't achieve full reality in terms of control inputs in one step because the vast majority of controllers simply don't have that level of control and you would be limiting your market to rich kids (or more well off older people) who can afford fully fledged wheel, gear stick and pedal set ups. And yes £100+ for a wheel is a lot of money for most people.
Personally I can see autoclutch never being removed for exactly this reason. Unless of course the devs want LFS to be realistic to motorsport to the point where only the well off, (or extremely dedicated), can afford to partake just like motorsport is in real life.
That would be a great shame in my opinion, (and business suicide to boot).
It's worse than rude actually. It's elitist arrogance IMHO. Excuse me while I laugh when LFS requires a £100,000 sit in simulator to play and you start whining about how you can't afford it.
First of all, £100 for expenses for hobby isn't much (And how often do you have to buy a new wheel..?). Heck, you can't even start paintball with that kind of money! £100 is practically free! And what about golf? Golf-sets and club-fees... Pets? Do you realize how much dog eats? And what about when it becomes sick? Veterinaries aren't free... Racing? Oh boy. People spends that much money in a week or two for movie tickets, fast-food, candy and beverages. Good place to save some money...
Secondly, where is your common sense about value of money? I would be ready to spend 10k eur for ultimate realism. But 100000 pounds? Oh, please. Do you also say that "It takes hundred years to finish the S3" or something like that? You are exaggerate things.
Well all fine and good if LFS is considered a hobby. Unfortunately for your point of view the vast majority see it as a game, sure a relatively immersive one but a game none the less. At best it will only ever become a tool for real racers to hone their skills without having to pay through the nose for track testing time. Is that where you would like to see LFS ending up? as a testing tool for those already privileged enough to be involved in motorsport that no one else can afford?? I don't that's for sure.
Do you know how much a full motion simulator costs??
Sure for the money you mention, you can get the likes of these:
but in all honesty they are just toys in terms of serious simulators. Real civil aviation flight simulators cost around £10 million ! Of course a race car one will be much cheaper as it has a relatively low tech cockpit in comparison, and the physics of cars on circuits is much simpler than an Airbus flying through turbulence. But, I am certain a full motion driving simulator of the same standard as a real flight simulator is going to cost a lot more than 10,000 pounds let alone Euros. Orders of magnitude more I suspect.
As £100 is practically free would you mind sending £100 to everyone here that cant afford a clutch pedal setup please.
Quite frankly your completely arrogant,elitist attitude is a bit disturbing.
Your saying that all people that aren't in a favourable economic situation shouldn't be allowed to enjoy their hobby. If we cant afford the best equipment then we should just stop playing?
May i suggest you step away form your computer and go out in the world and have a look around. There are a lot of people on this planet, even in 'wealthy' countries that are living on or below the breadline. People that have to scrimp and save for every last thing.
Just because i cant afford a G25 i should pack in my hobby?
**** off. Pull your head out of your arse and look beyond your own narrow minded little world.
