Quote from JeffR :

Removing auto-cut and auto-blip didn't make LFS more realistic, since the players that were truly concerned about the realism weren't using those features anyway. It only affected the players that didn't care about the "ultimate" in realism in the first place.

If auto-cut and auto-blip were giving an unfair advantage, then they should have been tweaked to remove the advantage, rather than completely removed. NFS's Prostreet mangaged to handicap the assists quite nicely, why can't LFS do the same? All other racing sims have assists that allow a wider range of players to enjoy those games, and as long as servers can specify what assists are allowed I don't see why LFS should want to restrict it's potential customer base.

Regarding the cost of controllers, one option players have is to buy a controller with good macro features to re-implement the features that LFS removes, like auto-cut, auto-blip, auto-clutch, which makes removal of those features moot.

I agree completely, good post!

Quote from Gnomie :

A little off track, but I'll get back to the core issue in a little while:

IMO the perfect racing game would be one which is founded on a super-realistic physics engine (like the one in LFS) but where the racers can select different difficulties. So the arcade people could turn on all sorts of aids and have fun wrecking each other on closed servers. Then there'd be the intermediate servers, which have some restrictions on aids, and finally the pure-sim servers. (for the rich bastards. ) Since all this would be found in the same game, the game would appeal to many people, which again would generate lots of ££ to the developers. Hence they could afford to hire lots of guys to improve graphics and stuff to GT5-levels. One game suits all.

But since this is not where LFS is today, I suggest a compromise: how about having dedicated servers for people using manual shifting and no aids whatsoever? Would that help? Then you'd know that you'd be racing against like minded people. However I'm afraid the userbase isn't large enough to provide much interesting racing on these servers..

Agree on that Gnomie.
One sim with different options like you suggested is maybe the answer.

I have a wheel but no clutch pedal, I can use button as a clutch. Will it be more realistic? I guess no.

Quote from halo :

Agree on that Gnomie.
One sim with different options like you suggested is maybe the answer.

I have a wheel but no clutch pedal, I can use button as a clutch. Will it be more realistic? I guess no.

When you have control over something rather than computer doing it for you, it's more realistic of course.

Bitching and crying and whatever yet.

Just drive

Quote from JeffR :

......

If auto-cut and auto-blip were giving an unfair advantage, then they should have been tweaked to remove the advantage, rather than completely removed. NFS's Prostreet mangaged to handicap the assists quite nicely, why can't LFS do the same? All other racing sims have assists that allow a wider range of players to enjoy those games, and as long as servers can specify what assists are allowed I don't see why LFS should want to restrict it's potential customer base.

..........

A very good point. I would agree that limiting your potential customer base isn't a good idea from a purely business point of view. Though I suppose if your aims are more along the lines of attempting to create a sim with "ultimate" realism then that might not be of such a concern. Who is to know what the devs ulitmate aim is. Presumably they are in it to make some money at least otherwise it would be entirely free to use.

I can only say if it were my project, (which of course I understand it isn't), then I would work it along the lines you proposed. Keep the aids in, (only to the extent of allowing users to use alternative controllers, not to make driving easy), but give them a distinct disadvantage, though not to the point where people will think it's pointless taking part, (say 0.5 second per lap for each aid used).

In my opinion, ultimately if a project is going to be so exclusive your customer base is practically non existant you might as well have just developed it for you and your mates to play. Which is fine if you're doing it purely as an intellectual exersize (ie to prove that it can be done), but if you're out to make any money out of it then it's not the best business plan.