Since there's been the PC Zone thing, and lot of talking about wrecking, not demo-only, but in S2 aswell, I'd really like to see the dev's stick to this.

Lola Popeye's "ban the wreckers - website" is a good idea i think. Or some place you can upload *.mpr's and then the developers or some guys authorized by developers would check them. And for two wrecking replays, the wrecker would lose his lisence, for example.

I got an idea..... and it DOESN'T involve violence and is safe, legal
and fun for the whole family!

Why don't these two guys get a personal letter in an e mail stating that their actions were grossly intolerable and have their license suspended til they make a public apology?

I'm serious. Could THAT be done?
I think just some sort a permanent ban really would be as severe a punishment as having to make them come here and beg for forgiveness.

And also, with a permanent ban they'd just go around saying, "LFS sucks! They ban you for no reason just to scam your money!", or something like it.
If they had the option of just coming here and apologising though, then they can't really say stuff like that as easy and I also doubt that they'd really
want to act like that again on an LFS server.

I dunno... just a thought.

There could be a note that wrecking other drivers races in online servers will result in a perm ban.

That's it, there would be a legal rule to take away Licenses from the wreckers

I was on this server with two teammates, clean & fun races (but some mistakes, sry Jeep & Seeracer ) before theses two f*****g $#!@$s join and start their job. And this is'nt the full replay, they've keep this up : driving slow in the straights in single file and braking soon, changing their race line when overtaken, and so on. Unfortunately, I've deleted the replay.

At the end, we left the server

ps : posting a link on LFS France forum, hoping they'll be banned from a lot of servers, til they apologize.

Quote from RudiTurbo :

There could be a note that wrecking other drivers races in online servers will result in a perm ban.

That's it, there would be a legal rule to take away Licenses from the wreckers

Quote from LFS EULA :

1.5Extreme disruptive or offensive behaviour by a user, towards the developers or members of the community, may result in temporary or permanent suspension of the user's Live for Speed license.

Just change few words

I would say taking the license away completely is a bit harsh.
It's kinda like why I am against the death penalty, cause you can very rarely be 100% percent sure of the persons guilt.
I am just thinking if someone hacked my account and then went mad online. Or if my friends are being drunk and go wreck online during a party when I am not in the room (actually happend, but that was in the S1 demo days).

I like the idea of having a ban for say 2 weeks or up to a month for wreckers. Racer Y's suggestion about writing apologies is nice, too but I don't know if it's very practical.

Quote from tpa :

I would say taking the license away completely is a bit harsh.
It's kinda like why I am against the death penalty, cause you can very rarely be 100% percent sure of the persons guilt.
I am just thinking if someone hacked my account and then went mad online. Or if my friends are being drunk and go wreck online during a party when I am not in the room (actually happend, but that was in the S1 demo days).

I like the idea of having a ban for say 2 weeks or up to a month for wreckers. Racer Y's suggestion about writing apologies is nice, too but I don't know if it's very practical.

Altho it's a bit harsh, a temp ban is quite good solution imho.
As with the death penalty: why is it any better to sit in a hole, family, friends, workmates all thinking you're a criminal, your life is completely cut...?
There's no way to regain the life which was lost after 10 years. But it costs much more. much much more. (and not just in money)
I dont' agree with you on that part :-)

Look at this
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=558


As it seems that replays are allowed I will upload mine when I get the time.

Quote from ysu :

Altho it's a bit harsh, a temp ban is quite good solution imho.
As with the death penalty: why is it any better to sit in a hole, family, friends, workmates all thinking you're a criminal, your life is completely cut...?
There's no way to regain the life which was lost after 10 years. But it costs much more. much much more. (and not just in money)
I dont' agree with you on that part :-)

Sorry for O/T, but arguing pro death penalty with "costs" is quite distastefull (although you meant "more" than money). Also, it is an utterly wrong assumpiton, because it is not like "sentence spoken - bang- you're dead". The inmates of deathrow sit in their cells for decades, not knowing when (or even if) the sentence will be carried out. Can't imagine that being better than "sitting in a hole, family, friends, workmates all thinking you're a criminal, your life is completely cut..." (Despite the thought if mine, that people will think that too, if you are sentenced to death...)
Also, death penalty is purely based on the primal urge for revenge, very much like the millenia-old Codex Hammurabi: "eye for an eye". Sure, this offers "absolute" justice on the first view, but on a second glance, how is the hangman ethically better than the hanged murderer?
On the other hand, I am a "militant" pacifist and I generally object any kind of killing, except for the means of utter survival: hunger or last ressort defense


Anyhow I think that you shouldn't ban the licenses of wreckers. Rather leave it to the admins, who they allow on their server, and who not.
Allthough I agree there should be a specific place where people could exchange replays and so forth. Maybe even a Blacklist, allthough I object having such lists publically abailable... maybe a Admin-only forum?

I experienced "h0lz" and "son!c" as stupid wreckers many times, too.

THEY DESERVE A LIFETIME BAN!

<RANT>
a temporary ban is the best option IMHO, it gives a definate message of YOU ARE NOT WELCOME HERE, to the wreckers, only temporary tho, start off with a weeks ban, then move up to a month, then go permanent, all that has to happen is, if you get hassled by wreckers then save the replay, sending them a warning via e-mail if we've got a few 'naughty' replays would do for a start, then once we got a few replays (at least 5 clear cases against them) then start the banning.

if they have any objections with the bans then let them appeal to the powers that be, it means that even if somehow you had innocently caused five seperate wrecks and they wre all recorded and submitted you colud still plead your case and regain your licience.

all this makes me think we could do with a 'judicial body' of some sort maybe a group of trusted server admin's etc should get together to asses the evidence and then decide the appropriate punishment.

one thing should be made very clear to ALL players (especially impressionable noobs) that wrecking is ANTI-SOCIAL AND UNWELCOME

i think LFS has got one of the frendliest communities going, but we gotta show the dickwads we will NOT TAKE ANY BULLSH!T!

<RANT/>

thats better!

Does anyone know the LSFW-name of "h0lz"?

(s0n!c = LFSW-name too)

Please post it, that admins are able to ban.

Quote from Theafro :

<RANT>
a temporary ban is the best option IMHO, it gives a definate message of YOU ARE NOT WELCOME HERE, to the wreckers, only temporary tho, start off with a weeks ban, then move up to a month, then go permanent, all that has to happen is, if you get hassled by wreckers then save the replay, sending them a warning via e-mail if we've got a few 'naughty' replays would do for a start, then once we got a few replays (at least 5 clear cases against them) then start the banning.

if they have any objections with the bans then let them appeal to the powers that be, it means that even if somehow you had innocently caused five seperate wrecks and they wre all recorded and submitted you colud still plead your case and regain your licience.

all this makes me think we could do with a 'judicial body' of some sort maybe a group of trusted server admin's etc should get together to asses the evidence and then decide the appropriate punishment.

one thing should be made very clear to ALL players (especially impressionable noobs) that wrecking is ANTI-SOCIAL AND UNWELCOME

i think LFS has got one of the frendliest communities going, but we gotta show the dickwads we will NOT TAKE ANY BULLSH!T!

<RANT/>

thats better!

Uhmm.. well yes i agree on most points! But remember people paid for this, they feel they can do whatever they want... This'll result in reallife lawsuits..

Quote from Jimi :

Does anyone know the LSFW-name of "h0lz"?

(s0n!c = LFSW-name too)

Please post it, that admins are able to ban.

As long as the replay still is uploaded its no problem to ban from it.
I would say that each Admin must see the evidence to be able to ban someone..

Quote :

But remember people paid for this, they feel they can do whatever they want... This'll result in reallife lawsuits.

But people can Ban them from Servers without interfering any Laws.
They bought the Game, they can play it, but for beeing wreckers the are not able to join any Server......

Imo that "ban website" would be the best solution. Depending on the severity of the wreckings a "permanent ban" should be applied after 2-3 occurences.

For example
---
Mr X wrecks on a server. It's clear that the wrecking was on purpose so he gets a one week ban to cool down and think about his actions.

After one and a half week Mr X gets caught again, but this time it isn't so severe, but it was clearly intentional again. Seeing that he has wrecked again before (so no learning included) this again results in a one week ban.

For the third time Mr X has been caught, showing no tendency to improve. He receives a permanent ban.
---

How this permanent ban works is a matter of discussion here. The "unofficial" way of a long ban from the servers who utilize the ban-website seems to be insufficient, while removing the S2 license is overly harsh imo. He should officially be banned from joining ANY server for a certain amount of time (half a year - again depending on the severity), but he should still be able to wreck his A.I. drivers all he wants.

He bought the product and is entitled to play, but because his ONLINE behaviour is nonexcusable he is banned from any online activity. End.

Quote from Phill :

Uhmm.. well yes i agree on most points! But remember people paid for this, they feel they can do whatever they want... This'll result in reallife lawsuits..

By accepting the license agreement they have also accepted the fact that bad behaviour on servers might result in account being removed. Already said in this thread. "I didn't read the agreement" isn't an excuse

Quote from Phill :

Uhmm.. well yes i agree on most points! But remember people paid for this, they feel they can do whatever they want... This'll result in reallife lawsuits..

a lawduit would be fair enough if they had not been previously warned they were acting in a manner UNFIT for online play.
as long as they are aware that they are in the wrong then they've got no excuses

i'm suggesting that they would start off with a 1 week ban. not exactly serious but it'll get the message across. and for those who just don't learn then we gotta hit 'em with something more 'memorable',(a couple of months off or even revoking their licience) yeah they've paid for this game but so did i and all the thousands of others players, and i don't think the loss of a couple of crash kiddies from the game is gonna dent the sales as much as it would if they stayed. i'm not saying we should take this too far and start banning peeps left, right and center. but when a serious repeat offender starts making life difficult we need to deal with 'em firmly and fairly, instead of just umming and ahhing about it.

IMHO

Execute them live on TV. Should reduce wreckers immediately...

Quote from Jimi :

Does anyone know the LSFW-name of "h0lz"?

(s0n!c = LFSW-name too)

Please post it, that admins are able to ban.

his lfsw-name is h0lz. you only can't find him because he got the option enabled to hide his online stats.

Please excuse a fairly new member of the LFS community for asking... But how (if possible) do you create a list of people not welcome on your server?

Just watched the replay.

That is so sad What a couple of low-lifes.
Nothing better to do than ruin what was a really good clean race.

I really dont understand this kind of mentality and attitude.
I myself am not known for having an even temper, and as angry or frustrated as I might get while racing, I could never ever bring myself to do something like this to people I dont even know and have never done anything to me.

The only thing that would make me deliberately hit someone and/or spoil their race, is if they did it to me first - if I was provoked (which has happened before).
I would never go out there to ruin any races, so if I crash or hit someone, its always by pure accident and never with bad intentions.
But to just join a race in order to ruin it... well its just the pinnacle of arseholiness.

Might be an idea for people to agree to simply not join servers that dont allow kick/bans to be voted for. Then the server admins would have to enable it if they want people on their servers.
Not having that option is suicide in times like that.

I would also definately be in favour of a car being automatically sent to spectators area for the duration of the race (or even kicked) if they are 'camping' on the track for more than say 5-10s. But again, thats easy to get around by edging the car forward and backwards in small increments.

I hope a workable solution can be found to weed out these tossers who have nothing better to do than play with their pricks and ruin peoples races.

Quote from X-Ter :

Please excuse a fairly new member of the LFS community for asking... But how (if possible) do you create a list of people not welcome on your server?

Go into your S2 Alpha \data\misc folder, and open the bans.ban file with notepad.

Once opened, type in their nick, save, jobs a good un.

Quote from X-Ter :

Please excuse a fairly new member of the LFS community for asking... But how (if possible) do you create a list of people not welcome on your server?

Or...

Click on "Start New Game", set to "hidden" so no-one will join, then after starting the host, click on "options" in the game setup screen. There is a button "Edit Bans" and you can add or edit bans in there.

If you wanted to ban people on a dedicated host, edit the bans as above, in your standard copy of LFS, then exit LFS, and you can copy that newly edited bans.ban file over to your dedicated hosts's folder.

Quote from L(Oo)ney :

Go into your S2 Alpha \data\misc folder, and open the bans.ban file with notepad.

Once opened, type in their nick, save, jobs a good un.

Don't think it'll work, coz I've opened this file after using the ban command in LFS, the file is not in ascii, so typing the name to ban is useles IMO

The best way is to use the /ban command (see readme in LFS Folder for a full explanation)

Edit : Didn't read Scawen awnser before posting, maybe I had a problem with my bans.ban file

Edit2 : it's definitely NOT ascii, so notepad is useless (sry, first time I ban someone )