Who's to say that the Renault car/team is average? what are you judging this on? if you go by Alonso's results id say hes in a very good team and a very good car.

I'd say his car was crap in the first half of the season but he managed to work with the team to improve it dramaticly in the second part of the season.

Or the car was always good but he just needed to get used to it and set it up how he liked it.

Quote from andybarsblade :

Who's to say that the Renault car/team is average? what are you judging this on? if you go by Alonso's results id say hes in a very good team and a very good car.

I am judging this on the performances from the first half of the season because I was talking about when he left McLaren to join Renault and it just so happens that he raced from the beginning of the season ...

... and if it was always a good car, just needing to be setup right for Alonso, then how come over the entire season Piquet could not get his car set up right. Do you think Alonso was given a better car or something ?

No i think Piquet's just pants.

Quote from Gills4life :

No.

He went from a car and team that was seriously challenging for the driver and constructors title, to a very average team and car. Admittedly the team mate was poor this season, but to take such a radical step down the ladder and still fight and get some wins without moaning and using loads of excuses, is very inspiring to me.

Let's not forget at the start of 2007 the Renault wasn't ALL that bad in heindseight, and it was made clear by Renault they were ditching the development of that car for the 08 car mid season. Comparing the first half of Fisi 07 to Alonso 08 - they weren't LEAGUES apart.

Had Renault continued development throughout 2007 with Fisi and Kovi, and with some luck, they could have achieved almost similar results as Alonso did. Look at Kovi in Japan. Had Hamilton slipped up or had been penalised he would have WON that race!

Not downplaying Alonso's achievements just bringing some balance.

Alonso + disaster area team mate + continual development throughout the year + luck = good results in 08

Alonso IS one of the best drivers on the grid... but has certain things on his side that has attracted disproportionate acclaim IMO.

Quote from Intrepid :

Let's not forget at the start of 2007 the Renault wasn't ALL that bad in heindseight, and it was made clear by Renault they were ditching the development of that car for the 08 car mid season. Comparing the first half of Fisi 07 to Alonso 08 - they weren't LEAGUES apart.

Had Renault continued development throughout 2007 with Fisi and Kovi, and with some luck, they could have achieved almost similar results as Alonso did. Look at Kovi in Japan. Had Hamilton slipped up or had been penalised he would have WON that race!

Not downplaying Alonso's achievements just bringing some balance.

Alonso + disaster area team mate + continual development throughout the year + luck = good results in 08

Alonso IS one of the best drivers on the grid... but has certain things on his side that has attracted disproportionate acclaim IMO.

This has strayed off of the point I was trying to make. I was impressed with the way he did not moan about having a weaker car, he just got his head down and did well. If you were challenging for the drivers title one year and then trying to just aim for a top 6 finish the next year, do not tell me you would not be frustrated. The Renault was not as strong as the Ferrari, McLaren or BMW. Alonso is just a great driver and got some good results and for that i give him mucho respect.

i'm sure mid season he wanted to move and some other roobish.

This is just stupid, at the start of 08 the Renault was crap, it was basically Redbull whooping the midfield, then after france Renault and Toyota kicked in.

The Renault this year had soo much capability but at the start of the season it wasn't reached.Although It gave a early indiciton of the cars potential in spain.

Quote from Mustafur :

This is just stupid, at the start of 08 the Renault was crap, it was basically Redbull whooping the midfield, then after france Renault and Toyota kicked in.

The Renault this year had soo much capability but at the start of the season it wasn't reached.Although It gave a early indiciton of the cars potential in spain.

We'll just have to see what it will cost them next season, though. It wouldn't be surprising that they spent so much time developing this 2008 car that they will have missed the change boat for the 2009 one. BMW, on the other hand, won in Canada, and basically stopped developing the 2008 car, so to get a head start on the 2009 one. We'll see how it goes in 2009, but I wouldn't be surprised that the same thing happens again, where BMW will begin stronger than Renault, but the latter might catch up again.