We don't have a build story on the website. In fact, the car isn't finished yet. It still has to go to paint and then final assembly can begin. The mock up actually weighed in at 1910 lbs. When it was weighed the car had no hood on, had no seat, windshield, quarter windows or dash (which will be a small carbon fiber panel that just holds the tach, temp, oil pressure, oil temp and switches for the windshield wiper and so forth). The cage wasn't completed yet. We were still missing about 30lbs of cage. It did still have the glass rear window in it though. That's going to end up being plastic like the windshield. So, 2200lbs for the final product is a pretty conservative estimate. I think this car is going to be lighter than our wrecked E30 that we raced last year. It came in at 2181lbs with a half tank of gas.
One thing we did that we haven't seen any other E36 club racers do is we completely cut out the rear firewall that separates the trunk area from the passenger compartment. It's going to stay like that too as we're using the stock fuel tank. SCCA/NASA/BMWCCA have designated that the E30/E36 can use the stock tank since it's plastic and located in front of the rear axle/subframe. Fuel cells typically weigh more than BMW stock gas tanks. Most people in BMWCCA use a fuel cell. I'm not exactly sure why they do this with the E36 chassis since the fuel starvation problems prevalent with the E30 is a non factor with the E36 and a duel fuel pump setup. I guess because it has a high cool factor. Anyway, since there wont be a fuel cell back there, we wont be needing a firewall. Another thing we've done is completely cut out the trunk floor sheet metal and replaced it with sheet aluminum. We've even cut off the frame rails aft of the subframe and replaced them with 1.5"x.095 chrome moly to mount the gutted rear bumper to. Don't worry, the entire rear subframe/suspension is located and mounted to the cage. This includes the upper shock mounts which are boxed in with .095 sheet steel. The rear fabbed frame rails are mounted to this box as are the rear trailing arm mounting points, and all four subframe mounting points. The rear down tubes for the cage are also mounted to the boxed in shock mounts.
These are all things we haven't seen from any other car we've examined at the track. The thing is, we want to win. We just don't have the kind of coin the other front runners have. What we do have is know how and time. So, we try innovative stuff like fitting 18x305 slicks onto an E30. Yeah, they all said that couldn't be done either..but we did it anyway. One thing we can't do is spend $20,000 on a motor, so we are constantly underpowered. Last year we were down an estimated 60 hp from the other top competitors. Next year is going to be just as bad. One of the top CMod drivers will be moving down to DMod next year. He's going to be bringing a de-stroked 3.0l Euro M3 motor that we estimate will be putting out 340-350hp (incidentally, we built that car). This is going to be the first time some one's going to be running that moter and after he shows up with it, others will migrate. We can't even come close to matching that. So, where's that leave us? We aren't going to go racing just to give a good showing. We're going racing to vie for another championship. So, we've got to do stuff no one has ever tried before. We've got to push the envelope of chassis fabrication. Getting light has always been our mantra. This year we're taking it to a whole new level.
To go fast, just add lightness -Colin Chapman
It's amazing to me how many people in club racing really don't take this to heart. Can anyone take a guess as to how many roll cages in BMWCCA don't use Chrome moly as their metal of choice? As far as I can tell, I'm the only cage builder in the series who uses the stuff. Mostly because other builders charge outrageous prices to install chrome moly because they don't want to take the time to preheat and anneal the welds. But a chrome moly cage can save 100lbs (45 kgs) or more.
We just finished building a new car for our shop. This car isn't a customer's car. It was built by us for us. This means that we sparred no expense in weight savings and chassis strength. The chassis is a BMW E36 which normally weighs in at ~3200 lbs (1450 kgs). After we were finished with it, it weighed in at just under 2200 lbs (997 kgs). It has an extensive cage that ties into all the suspension/subframe mounting points. It still has the heavy iron block straight six (for durability's sake) and giant 18 x 305 tires and wheels. There's still weight to be taken out of the car.
Here's the thing. Everyone says the magic number for this chassis is 2400 lbs (1088 kgs) and if you get under that you're a magician. I mean, big time builders are saying this. People who've spent a decade building these chassis are all saying that. Recently, Jon posted the weight on a BMWCCA message list and got a very lukewarm response. NO ONE BELIVES US! Well, it's going to be fun when we show up at an event and roll that thing up on the scales for all to see and then go out on the track and proceed to kick their ass with 40 less HP.
This E36 weighs the same as our old E30.
It's amazing to me how many people in club racing really don't take this to heart. Can anyone take a guess as to how many roll cages in BMWCCA don't use Chrome moly as their metal of choice? As far as I can tell, I'm the only cage builder in the series who uses the stuff. Mostly because other builders charge outrageous prices to install chrome moly because they don't want to take the time to preheat and anneal the welds. But a chrome moly cage can save 100lbs (45 kgs) or more.
We just finished building a new car for our shop. This car isn't a customer's car. It was built by us for us. This means that we sparred no expense in weight savings and chassis strength. The chassis is a BMW E36 which normally weighs in at ~3200 lbs (1450 kgs). After we were finished with it, it weighed in at just under 2200 lbs (997 kgs). It has an extensive cage that ties into all the suspension/subframe mounting points. It still has the heavy iron block straight six (for durability's sake) and giant 18 x 305 tires and wheels. There's still weight to be taken out of the car.
Here's the thing. Everyone says the magic number for this chassis is 2400 lbs (1088 kgs) and if you get under that you're a magician. I mean, big time builders are saying this. People who've spent a decade building these chassis are all saying that. Recently, Jon posted the weight on a BMWCCA message list and got a very lukewarm response. NO ONE BELIVES US! Well, it's going to be fun when we show up at an event and roll that thing up on the scales for all to see and then go out on the track and proceed to kick their ass with 40 less HP.
This E36 weighs the same as our old E30.
All you people who have referenced rulebooks from the FIA and NASCAR and NASA and the International United Nations Federation for Blue Flag Etiquette are overlooking the one point that makes all the preceding arguments moot.
That being, the FIA, NASCAR, NASA, SCCA and any other sanctioning body you feel the need to mention will not let dudes who have never been on a race track before go out and race in a real live race. LFS's blue flag policy should be the same as mine. That is, if you have a blue flag and you have less than one month with the game, you need to stop, get into the grass and wait until the next race starts where after the first turn you wont have a chance of ruining any one's race that may have a shot at winning.
Here's the primary reason why. I cannot tell you how many times I've approached some dude who just left the pits. I mean, I'm not on his ass yet, but I'm close enough so he gets a Blue Flag just in time for the next set of turns. He sees the BF and immediately panics, hitting a wall, which rockets him back out onto the track right in front of yours truly. BAM! My race is done. Thanks for the memories. And you know, it's not even the dudes who've only had the game for 2 days. This same shit happens with guys who've raced regularly for weeks. Guys I've even helped out with sets or pointers in spec mode. They get all nervous, run out of talent and use my car as an anvil. Every time I get within 300 meters of someone who is orange on my mini-map, I cringe and hope that the (what seems like) inevitable spin he does isn't directly in my path, leaving me no room to avoid it. And you know, Even if he somehow manages to keep it together for me to make a pass on the straight, that's no guarantee he wont forget his freakin' break point and try to ram his headlights up my tail pipe in the process. Believe me, it's happened before.
It's mildly irritating when it happens with someone who's on the same lap and your trying a legitimate pass on, but for it to happen from someone who's three laps down is infuriating.
I guess I get so worked up over shit like this because I try so damned hard to make sure I don't ruin anyone elses fun only to get shafted in the end from people who either don't think, don't know or just don't care.
What we need is a script that will only let racers join if they have X number of total laps under their belt. Or X number of credits..or something...anything. Imagine, a dedicated LFS veterans only server that doesn't have to be PW protected. We can dream can't we?
That being, the FIA, NASCAR, NASA, SCCA and any other sanctioning body you feel the need to mention will not let dudes who have never been on a race track before go out and race in a real live race. LFS's blue flag policy should be the same as mine. That is, if you have a blue flag and you have less than one month with the game, you need to stop, get into the grass and wait until the next race starts where after the first turn you wont have a chance of ruining any one's race that may have a shot at winning.
Here's the primary reason why. I cannot tell you how many times I've approached some dude who just left the pits. I mean, I'm not on his ass yet, but I'm close enough so he gets a Blue Flag just in time for the next set of turns. He sees the BF and immediately panics, hitting a wall, which rockets him back out onto the track right in front of yours truly. BAM! My race is done. Thanks for the memories. And you know, it's not even the dudes who've only had the game for 2 days. This same shit happens with guys who've raced regularly for weeks. Guys I've even helped out with sets or pointers in spec mode. They get all nervous, run out of talent and use my car as an anvil. Every time I get within 300 meters of someone who is orange on my mini-map, I cringe and hope that the (what seems like) inevitable spin he does isn't directly in my path, leaving me no room to avoid it. And you know, Even if he somehow manages to keep it together for me to make a pass on the straight, that's no guarantee he wont forget his freakin' break point and try to ram his headlights up my tail pipe in the process. Believe me, it's happened before.
It's mildly irritating when it happens with someone who's on the same lap and your trying a legitimate pass on, but for it to happen from someone who's three laps down is infuriating.
I guess I get so worked up over shit like this because I try so damned hard to make sure I don't ruin anyone elses fun only to get shafted in the end from people who either don't think, don't know or just don't care.
What we need is a script that will only let racers join if they have X number of total laps under their belt. Or X number of credits..or something...anything. Imagine, a dedicated LFS veterans only server that doesn't have to be PW protected. We can dream can't we?
I'm really not sure how you could come up with a physical test of this. Someone with an advanced math background might be able to figure up a way to test it in a theoretical environment though.
In all honesty, race car physics is an ever evolving science. Tomorrow, someone will come up with a new tire deformation model and the day after that someone will come up with one to supersede that one.
In all honesty, race car physics is an ever evolving science. Tomorrow, someone will come up with a new tire deformation model and the day after that someone will come up with one to supersede that one.
I've got over 5000 laps in the XRR. There's a few more of us that race the XRR. Chrinkler, CWMAX and a few others I've forgotten. We don't have problems winning our fair share of races. That being said, I'll admit that the XRR isn't quite as capable as the FZR, but it's so close as to not be a major problem. The TBO class on the other hand....
7000+ laps on one track with a particular car. (MRT/SO1)
Four more car/track combos have about 2000 laps. (XRR/ASNat, XRR/BL1, MRT/BL1, LX4/SO1)
Clearly, I have too much free time.
To me, LFS is one of the greatest online games of all time. I'm serious here. I've played a bunch of online games to include playing the original Doom over com port...yes, I am that old..all the way to BF2. To me the only game that comes close to LFS' online experience is the original Tribes.
If this game weren't changed in any way except had the backing of a large publisher and thus had more press, I'm convinced it would consistantly be mentioned as one of the classic games of all time simply because of it's online prowess.
I had never given a driving simulator much of a try before LFS. The devs hooked me with the outstanding online play.
If this game weren't changed in any way except had the backing of a large publisher and thus had more press, I'm convinced it would consistantly be mentioned as one of the classic games of all time simply because of it's online prowess.
I had never given a driving simulator much of a try before LFS. The devs hooked me with the outstanding online play.
There's also a hotlap portion to the game. Some people don't like racing with others and instead hotlap the cars and compete with others that way. You should check out http://www.lfsworld.net/ and then double click on s2 hotlaps. I'm warning you though that the fast guys aren't beatable by mere mortals.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXQSEbuNKQ8&search=wreck
Matrixi:
You got anything to say about those "idiotic" Belgians?
Matrixi:
You got anything to say about those "idiotic" Belgians?
The difference is that I won't ask questions, then only read half the posts, then try to cover up that fact by proclaiming I "meant" to do something, all the while everyone knows I'm just trying to blow smoke up their skirt.
I'll tell you what's worse than that though. Defending the actions of said poster. Those are the kinds of guys that dont want to ban a wrecker because he hasn't wrecked them yet and they are of the mindset that we should "just give him a chance to change". Yeah, that always works out.
I mean, at least I don't do any of that.
**edit** Ok, I'm going to quite before I get into trouble. I'll be more than happy to continue this conversation with PLATEX and Mad TIzITe XXXg3 in PMs.
And still, you havn't posted the skin.
Yes, and by edit, he ment create your skin from scratch on that CMX Viewer template. Not:
Well, you aren't completely hopeless. At least you don't type like some 12 year old jackass. So, maybe there is hope for you. Although I see that you're currently online at a drift server, so the jury's still out.
What he said was "you should START with CMX viewer". You cannot resize skins with CMX viewer. However, just in case your reading comprehension is as below average as I believe it to be, the next time you make a skin, you should start with a blank template that's in CMX viewer.
Having said that, someone has already told you to post them up and they would be happy to resize them for you. Inexplicably, you have decided to go another route, so that person has now rescinded his offer. Paying attention can really pay off for you. You should try it sometime. I think you'll be happy with the results.
Having said that, someone has already told you to post them up and they would be happy to resize them for you. Inexplicably, you have decided to go another route, so that person has now rescinded his offer. Paying attention can really pay off for you. You should try it sometime. I think you'll be happy with the results.
Last edited by operator0, .
I use a sidewinder stick also. I have the throttle and brake on the slider control. This is what I would recomend you use. The slider control works very well for both brake and throttle. It wont take you very long at all to learn where neutral is.
This setup works very very well. Don't listen to the guys who insist you buy a wheel. You have enough equipment to be very competative and to stay competative in the future.
This is not to say that a wheel wouldn't be a better option, but some of us don't want to spend the cash for a wheel on a game we may not be interested in. Of course, that was my initial reasoning for not getting a wheel. The reason why I still don't have a wheel after playing the game for three years is because I don't want to have to relearn a new controler. Besides, it's fun when I tell people that I use a stick. Especialy when I tell them it's an old Sidewinder that doesn't have FF.
This setup works very very well. Don't listen to the guys who insist you buy a wheel. You have enough equipment to be very competative and to stay competative in the future.
This is not to say that a wheel wouldn't be a better option, but some of us don't want to spend the cash for a wheel on a game we may not be interested in. Of course, that was my initial reasoning for not getting a wheel. The reason why I still don't have a wheel after playing the game for three years is because I don't want to have to relearn a new controler. Besides, it's fun when I tell people that I use a stick. Especialy when I tell them it's an old Sidewinder that doesn't have FF.
GTT, SO long. The. Best. Combo. Ever.
Alright, I've seen a number postings about this. Most of what's been said in those posts is bunk. Some of it it is correct.
The point is we do not know what kind of compound the devs are trying to simulate. i doubt they even know. they have probably plugged in some numbers that appear to be proper, and they work for the game. In reality, the tire tire such as the hybrids probably only exists in the world of high dollar racing. Something like F1 and pro rallying. that being said, it is completely plausible to create a tire that shreds itself in a few laps but provides a huge amount of grip.
Real Life Evidence:
The only tire I know of that comes close to this is the Hoosier Dirt Stockers. These tires were originaly created to be used on dirt oval tracks. Their compound is very soft. Some bright guy decided to try them out on his BMW in a club race in 1999. It was raining very heavily. He lapped the entire feild and the tires managed to stay intact for the whole race. ever since then, these tires have been the prefered wet track tire in America. But, when these tires are used on damp tracks, they do not last more than 2 or 3 laps. They do provide more grip, even with their tread, on semi dry tracks, they just wont last. No one has ever tried to race them on a completely dry track. That being said, the time difference on semi dry tracks compared to those with both rain intermediates and slicks with treads hand cut into them is such that on a dry track the Dirt Stockers will still have more grip than even a full race slick that's been shaved. I have serious doubts abotu whether they could be used on the rear end of a FWD car and stay together for five laps. I don't think that's possible.
Again, going off of the above evidence, it is certainly possible for a tire manufacture to create a tire with a compound that's soft enough to provide that kind of grip and still last in a low load situation like being on the rear end of a FWD car.
The point is we do not know what kind of compound the devs are trying to simulate. i doubt they even know. they have probably plugged in some numbers that appear to be proper, and they work for the game. In reality, the tire tire such as the hybrids probably only exists in the world of high dollar racing. Something like F1 and pro rallying. that being said, it is completely plausible to create a tire that shreds itself in a few laps but provides a huge amount of grip.
Real Life Evidence:
The only tire I know of that comes close to this is the Hoosier Dirt Stockers. These tires were originaly created to be used on dirt oval tracks. Their compound is very soft. Some bright guy decided to try them out on his BMW in a club race in 1999. It was raining very heavily. He lapped the entire feild and the tires managed to stay intact for the whole race. ever since then, these tires have been the prefered wet track tire in America. But, when these tires are used on damp tracks, they do not last more than 2 or 3 laps. They do provide more grip, even with their tread, on semi dry tracks, they just wont last. No one has ever tried to race them on a completely dry track. That being said, the time difference on semi dry tracks compared to those with both rain intermediates and slicks with treads hand cut into them is such that on a dry track the Dirt Stockers will still have more grip than even a full race slick that's been shaved. I have serious doubts abotu whether they could be used on the rear end of a FWD car and stay together for five laps. I don't think that's possible.
Again, going off of the above evidence, it is certainly possible for a tire manufacture to create a tire with a compound that's soft enough to provide that kind of grip and still last in a low load situation like being on the rear end of a FWD car.
I switch sides and am proficient with both sides. I can tell you that sometimes i drive a track..say AS Nat..that's CW for a few hours or days, then go to say, WE Nat and run that track for a few races and wonder why my times are so slow, then realize that I haven't switched sides. It's usualy good for .5 to a full second on WE Nat. Not only that, but I can deffinately tell a huge difference in handeling.
Finaly, someone who can explain what is happening over there. Although, I certainly don't have any firsthand knowledge about the racism that may or may not be present over there, I do find it a little hard to believe that the police and by proxy, the French guvernment is enacting racist policies, or at least enacting racist tactics against the Muslims. Am I to believe that the French would rather see all the Muslism out of their country? Is this a thought process of most native French citizens? If it is, I'm shocked. We haven't heard any of this here in America. The portait that is painted of Western European countries is that the they are all the pinical of social harmony. Are you telling me that the U.S. press has lied to us all these years? To tell you the truth, I wouldn't be surprised if they have been lieing.
Racist police don't start riots. There is litteraly no reason to ever start a riot. From what I understand, the kids were electrocuted after running into an electrical substation to hide from police. Is this true? At what point do people look at a stupid act and recognize it for it's stupidity. I mean, running into an electrical substation? Cmon, didn't it cross these guys' minds at least once that it would be a pretty dangerous thing to do?
What? They havn't enacted a curfew yet? You've got to be kidding me. This is what, the 14th day? 14 days of riots and they havn't enacted a curfew? That's rediculous.
Holy moses dude. You need to get out more. I didn't say that CNN isn't covering it, I just don't believe I'm getting the whole story, or I'm getting a watered down version of the story.
It's clear to me that your utter hatred of the USA is so ingrained that it will be nigh on impossible to recieve any kind of unbiased opinion about this, or pretty much any other topic, directed towards me by you. Therefor, you are now on my ignore list. Don't bother replying, because I can't see it. You need to get a Prozac perscription.
I should have known this would turn into a quazi political yelling match.
Uhh, I'm going to have to go ahead and take an opposing veiw here. Less weight will always make a car handle better. Polar moment of inertia is a huge factor in designing race cars. Many people have a misinterpratation about how much weight on a tire effects the handeling. While I'll agree that it does indeed effect handeling, it doesn't effect it as much as CG shifts and polar moments affect handeling. There are always tradeoffs and I'll take less weight over less grip anyday. Keep in mind that the weight of fuel doesn't effect overall tire grip nearly as much as it will effect "tossability". This is born out by the fact that a car is always faster with less fuel and/or less people then it is with such things, and it's not all due to acceleration.
Riots in France.
So uhhh, can anyone over in Europe enlighten us Americans who are far away from the events on what exactly is happening. Our news isn't covering it as much as I would like them to. Is this as bad as it sounds?
This sounds like fun. I'm also not really into the timed races. It's alot harder to stratagize when a race is timed vrs when one races a set number of laps. I really like the idea of a driver change. One thing to consider is that it's very hard to get that many people to clear their callender. Especialy whith the time zone differences and such.
Anyway, that's my two cents.
Anyway, that's my two cents.
It's already happening as I predicted in another thread. More people are racing the other classes everyday. Still hard to find, but it's getting more and more prevelent.
Bah, minor details. We live to long anyway
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