nihill: you don't want to hear, so don't read it. Skip to next post. Problem solved.


Nisskid,

You make fair points and I genuinely read and consider your arguments, even if they are a little defensive.

I will say though, I'm not "insulting" anyone or anything (as you suggested). I don't like it for some reasons (which maybe flawed) but that's not an insult. That's my opinion.

Well, yeah I do think it's kind of "moronic" to drift race in public streets, whether you expect there to be traffic or not - in fact, in some ways, not expecting traffic is even more dangerous! Ditto to be proud of the damage you've caused your tyres. I guess "moronic" is an insult, but if you don't do those things it doesn't apply to you or other drifters who don't do those things.

Now you do actually make a fair point about the same type of kids racing around the streets in their ricer-cars and that not being representative of circuit racing, however I don't think it's entirely valid. The different is that "drifting" is primarily a street racing thing that has only recently made the transition to a properly controlled track environment. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think it originated on a track, it originated from kids in ricer cars trying to do power-slides.

Closed circuit racing and rally certainly did not originate on the streets. The origins of these types of motor-sports go way back to the invention of the auto-mobile when racing was the pass-time of high society and the aristocratic class that could actually afford cars. A lot of this mentality can still be seen in F1 in particular.

So while those same kids might also be into street racing that holds some similarities to closed circuit racing or rally racing, I think it's extremely disingenuous to pretend that the "proper" (note inverted commas - no offence) motor-racing genres have anywhere close to the same kind of link to the "bling" street-racer culture.

Yes, drag racing started on the streets too. But I'm no great fan of drag racing either.

So, is it fair to dislike something because of where it originates from? No, it's not. But because of the origins, it still retains a lot of the mentalities and style of street racing and that is the thing I really don't like. And that's not for any other reason than personal opinion. I don't like ultra-flashy, imported cars or the fashion and culture that goes along with them. Just not my thing. Well, it is for another reason I guess: street racing is dangerous and done by idiot kids who just have the drivers licence but think they're the best drivers in the world. But that's off the point of drifting, I know (unless it's done on public roads).

Lastly, I just don't like the actual act of "drifting". To me it's driving slowly around a corner, sideways and ruining tyres. Doesn't appeal to me on a personal level.

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Wed 20 Feb 2008, 10:56.

Quote from nihil :

Don't even begin to assume anything about me... You will most likely be wrong. Continue by PM if you wish

LOL. No thanks.

You're not being fair at all. Go back the last few pages and read my posts. The big long one on this page is just directly responding to one person's post. Other than that I've made only 3 or 4 posts in the last four pages and haven't said anything of consequence apart from encouraging people to accept that everyone likes different things.

The real thing that is annoying you is that you don't like my personal opinion.

Quote from nihil :

You on the other hand are just a pain in the arse. OK, we get it. You don't like it, so STFU.

You plainly have nothing of interest to say on the matter

I was answering another poster. Is that not allowed?

You're clearly just offended by my opinion which is the silly type of behaviour that makes people dislike "drifters".

People ask why I or others don't like drifting, complain about us not liking drifting, claim we don't understanding it or not giving it a chance. So I make an effort to validate my reasons and tell you the reasons behind my opinions. You should not get offended and defensive about it! Just accept it. It's not a personal insult to you.

If you engaged in a discussion about open-wheel circuit racing and told me you didn't like it much and validated your reasoning I wouldn't hold it against you. Each to their own.

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Wed 20 Feb 2008, 09:31.

Quote from JO53PHS :

No offence, but If they put a NASCAR car in LFS, I'll be gone quicker than you can say 'NASCAR actually doesn't suck'

Why? I think it would be cool. NASCAR forms a massive sector of motorsport with it's own unique challenges and style. That may not be your personal cup of tea, but it would help complete LFS in my opinion!

Quote from Inouva :

Jesus , another tread like this

Take it easy tiger! Seems 95% of people don't mind. It's just a bit of fun.

Quote from nisskid :

no sorry, your post went further than simply describing your preference.

Yes, it also described why I have that preference. What's the big deal?

Quote from nisskid :

in this post you lumped drifting with Fast and the Furious

So? Like it or lump it, that kind of "street racer kid" is the type of person attracted to drifting. Sure I believe there are other types of people that like drifting too, and I'm sure they're nice blokes. But the stereotype exists for a reason.

Quote from nisskid :

and donuts and burnouts. what can i say but that donuts are as much a part of racing as drift, watch nascar, hell watch F1, what do they do after they win an event? they do a donut? mm well thats about the same resemblance a donut has to racing as a donut has to drifting, i hardly think drifting around a corner at 100kmh's+ is similar to turning the steering wheel full lock and dropping the clutch in a circle.

Be aware it's not "drifting" that I dislike. I love WRC Rally etc. and in a way you could say they do a lot of "drifting". The two things I don't like are the culture that comes with drifting (and yes, that is a bling bling 19yo fast'n'furious culture whether you like it or not) and also that it's just pointless. To me, my personal view, it's just some guys who have made an art form out of driving like an idiot in a street car (sideways around every corner on tarmac). Thus the burnout comparison. It's just glorified, institutionalised auto-hooliganism. I can understand why they get a rush out of it, but I don't like it personally.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7uitHW6WKUQ Idiots.

This type of shit is just moronic. Firstly, it's only public streets. Secondly, can you imagine people having their stereo blasting during any other "serious" motorsport? Thirdly, are you honestly trying to tell me the street racer culture is not part of drifting? They actually seem proud to have ruined their tyres. LOL.

Quote from nisskid :

fast and the furious? i could be wrong but i beleive the first movie was based around drag racing, and the 2nd was was based around street circuit racing, it was only until the 3rd one until they even touched on drifting. mm so fast and the furious focused on drag racing and grip racing before drift, yet somehow F&F is only associated with drift? mm strange...

You're not seriously trying to suggest that this kind of culture has not attached itself to the "drifting" scene or visa versa? ... as compared to say, F1 racing, NASCAR, WRC or even high octane drag racing. Seriously? For better or worse, whether you like it or not, the fact is that silly type of street racer culture is part of drifting (or visa versa).

Type in "drift racing" in YouTube. This is the No.1 hit. No sign of the fast'n'furious culture, right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMeSIcYeLyo

Quote from nisskid :

dont want drift to affect the serious aspects of the game as a simulator? correct me if im wrong but it simulates driving, drift is one aspect of driving, just like race is another.

I don't mind drifting being in the game as far as "real cars can drift, so if it's a real simulator, these cars should be able to drift too", but leave it at that. I hope they don't do anything to encourage it. My hope is that this will be a pure, unadulterated racing simulator. "Drifting" is a fringe motor-sport, if you can even call it a "sport".

Quote :

also, i think at this point, i should point out that this refusal to go watch a drift event displays the close mindedness that people like yourself are renown for. it comes down to "you will never know if you never go", if you are not willing to go and see drift, you will never know what its all about. until that time you struggle to hold any credibility in my mind.

Some of the users here posted plenty of YouTube videos that I gladly watched. That's enough. I got the idea. Just like I don't have to buy a model train set and spend five hours watching them drive around on a model set to know that's not my cup of tea, I don't have to go and watch a bunch of guys slowly drive around a track sideways to know that's not my scene either. Thanks for the offer.

Seriously, each to their own. If you like it then great, and I don't hold that against you at all unless you try and do it on public roads. After giving it genuine consideration, I just don't like it and there's many valid reasons I have come to that personal conclusion.

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Wed 20 Feb 2008, 09:17.

Quote from UncleBenny :

Had about 9 of these checked off at first, managed to scale it back to 4. Sprint cars would be my number one choice for sure.

Did you ever check out any of those RatBag games? They're actually pretty good.

The one I'd love to see most is the "classic racing" genres.

I think that's what a simulation can really excel at; letting people experience something that is not even possible any-more at all! I'd love to compare old GP cars to the cars from Grand Prix Legends. I actually think they'd probably be more realistic in LFS.

Quote from nisskid :

god your so far from anything remotely resembling truth I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry, i saw your intro thread and thought you seemed like a good bloke, but you certainly are the epitome of ignorance when it comes to this subject.

Geez. What do you want me to say? I don't like it, it simply doesn't appeal to me. Sorry. Like I said in my post that is "so far from resembling truth", That doesn't mean I don't like other people who like drifting. I'm sure they're great guys. Not my cup of tea. No offence! How can my post not resemble truth? It's just my opinion and I assure you it's true!

Quote :

also, if i read correctly you're coming back to Australia soon? if so throw me a PM and i will let you know about the next drift event in your local area, you will pay between $10-$20 entry, but i beleive it will change your view forever on the sport.

Zero interest mate. Thanks anyway. You knock yourself out.

Probably all of them I guess. I don't know.

Resolution is going to make little difference on modern computers.

It runs flawlessly on my MacBook Pro which is a dual core 2.4ghz, 2G ram, 512MB Nvidia card with everything maxed out at 4XAA, 16XAF.

Had some teething problems but new DirectX and drivers install and all was fine.

Quote from spanks :

you guys are insane

my first full lap was 2:33.xx

this is my first real time tryin to drive the f08...the racing line was telling me to go flat out, but the tail end was telling me otherwise

How do you "turn on" the racing line?

I know there's lots of threads on this, but I thought a poll might be interesting.

Multiple choices allowed (but keep it to 2 or 3 - don't just vote for them all).

Last edited by Ikaponthus, Tue 19 Feb 2008, 13:38.

Quote from Bandit77 :

by the way: I've seen km/h and I've seen kph, and maybe there's kmph... but km/ph just doesn't make any sense as it would be "kilometers per per hour". am I picky? probably. but considering the fact that it's written in so many places...

I see. Meh. Shrug.

Double post for a double thread.

For anyone here unfamiliar with the legendary Bathurst track:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juayGkTKYEo -Good track intro - 2004 V8 Supercars

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SawhpwFnLFc - Poll Lap 06 V8 SCs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5jtf83eKGs - 1985 Jag v12 on-board cam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvWFMOF7CWU - 1979 -Aus V8s

Gets my vote.

I think it's perfectly legitimate to not like drifting.

In my opinion it's just a bit silly and immature. But more off-putting than that, is the whole "bling bling" fast'n'furious culture the surrounds the "sport" too. That crap is so far removed from real driving and real racing it's not funny.

However that doesn't mean I dislike all "drifters". I dislike what they do, but I'm sure many of them are nice blokes and we could be friends. I accept that different people like different things.

I don't mind "drift" related stuff being included in Live for Speed either as long as it doesn't impact on the serious-racing aspects of the simulator.

Each to their own, and I can understand the appeal to a limited degree. I like to do burnouts and doughnuts too when I'm bored (which I know is much easier than so called "pro drifting"), but it holds my attention for about fifteen seconds. Drifting is only mildly more impressive IMO. Each to their own. I'm not going to pretend to like it or pretend I find it impressive. I don't. But I also don't care if people do it in LFS or even in real life as long as they don't do it on the streets, in which case they're effing idiots.

I think that's fair.

For anyone here unfamiliar with the legendary Bathurst track:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juayGkTKYEo -Good track intro - 2004 V8 Supercars

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SawhpwFnLFc - Poll Lap 06 V8 SCs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5jtf83eKGs - 1985 Jag v12 on-board cam

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvWFMOF7CWU - 1979 -Aus V8s

Gets my vote.

Thanks guys.

Lap times are dropping! Now getting into the 1:11's fairly consistently which is good enough to poll on the "Quick" setting. I'll try Pro tonight and see what times the AI do then.

Quote :

Yeah, sounds like a great idea. Not. Look at rFactor for a good example of why officially supported car/track modding is a bad idea in racing games (other than, say, Generally).

While agreed, not as good as LFS, I think RFactor is a fantastic game. Easy to sort the shit stuff from the good stuff by just downloading the highly rated mods.

Quote from Bob Smith :

As for heating, you don't want even heating, you want equal loads during cornering, which on the UF1 (with its lack of ARBs) you probably want near maximum negative camber. This should make the inner edges nice and warm but the outside edges even cooler. Within normal ranges, tyres in LFS are more sensitive to camber than pressure.

Thanks for you reply. If you have time, can u please go into a little more detail here? Why do I not want even heating? And how can I tell if there are equal loads on the tyre during cornering?

Bathurst is definitely and amazing and a unique track!!

I'd say it would be easier for the devs just to make the means available for 3rd party tracks to be added. Then there will be hundreds of real life tracks available!

I'm fiddling around with the UF1000 setup for the Ashton Cadet track and I'm having a lot of trouble.

Firstly, it seems to get the front tyres to heat up evenly I have to have a lot of positive camber! Does that make sense?

Secondly, I can't get the rear tyres to heat up anywhere near the optimal temperature! I've taken the pressure right down but still can't get them out of the blue.

Any tips?

Quote from 5haz :

The hate of most things, including drifting/racing is often caused by ignorance IMO, those that slag off drifting/racing probrably don't know anything about what they are talking about, therefore they go by well overused stereotypes, coming to the conclusion that all drifters are 11 year old kids that can't drive, plus you don't have to be just a drifter or a racer, can't we be both, or does it satisfy some primitive human need to be in a certain group and slag off the other group in an effort to make yourself feel supierior? Who knows?

I race because I enjoy the rush of getting a lap perfect and getting a new personal best/race win.

I drift because its a rush when you pull off a drift perfectly.

Both racing and drifting require a high level of car control, if you look hard there is nothing wrong with drifting and racing, its just some people love to be snobbish and look down on others, and therefore pick on drifting

What worries me is that theres a class system where certain 'groups' of people are thought by many to be below others by the 'master race' of supposedly supierior racing s2 liscensed users, (a.k.a Drifters/Demo Racers), didnt something similar to this happen in Germany in the 1930's/1940's??

Good Post.

So far it's the UF1000.

I just get a buzz out of trying to make the slow cars go as quickly as possible! Obviously boring on long tracks, but great fun on the short ones.

I also like the MRT5 although I haven't learned to drive it properly yet. It's very difficult!

Quote from wien :

If you really want to feel deflated, have a look at the WR at LFSWorld (and official LFS site, so don't worry about logging in). You can download a replay by clicking the time of the lap you want to see. It's excellent help for tuning your lines and brake-points.

Am I reading that right!?

nesrulz
1:07.18

I don't know how that is even possible!! I will check it out when I get back. Unbelievable.