Quote from SamH :

I don't think that would help since it seems the FIA is using what WASN'T said as the basis for the penalty. This being distinct from what they're directly implying was a "lie". In my opinion, it was an error of omission for good reason - the presumption that the stewards would refer to the radio traffic, since this would normally be pivotal in determining wrongdoing. Unfortunately I'm obviously demanding more of the stewards than they're capable of - to do their jobs properly.

That was my first impression also. But the official wording is

Quote from FIA :

During the hearing, held approximately one hour after the end of the race, the Stewards and the Race Director questioned Lewis Hamilton and his Team Manager David Ryan specifically about whether there had been an instruction given to Hamilton to allow Trulli to overtake. Both the driver and the Team Manager stated that no such instruction had been given. The Race Director specifically asked Hamilton whether he had consciously allowed Trulli to overtake. Hamilton insisted that he had not done so.

Even the FIA can't make that up. But of course they still look like amateurs. With today's technology they shouldn't have to rely on what McLaren have to say.

Quote from SamH :

"failure to mention, when questioned, something that WE might rely on in court"

But that's Whitmarsh's version, not what the official FIA wording says. See amp88's link.

Quote from amp88 :

Pretty damning evidence which has already been posted in the Malaysian thread.

Thx, I hadn't seen the full wording. Of course the situation would still be clearer if the was an actual transcript of the Melbourne hearing available, but I guess even the FIA wouldn't make this stuff up completely. I just wonder wth Whitmarsh is on about?

Last edited by J.B., Thu, 2 Apr 2009 17:49.

What isn't clear is that FIA and Whitmarsh are still saying two different things and no transcript has been released to prove either one or the other.

FIA says that they asked Hamilton after the race if he had been instructed to let Trulli pass and he said no. Whitmarsch says that all that happened was that they didn't tell the FIA about the instruction because they thought they were aware of the radio conversation anyway.

Two different things. Either Hamilton lied and Whitmarsh is still lying, or FIA is lying.

I'm still not quite clear on the situation. Somebody is still lying.

Quote from FIA :

"Both the driver [Hamilton] and the team manager stated that no such instruction had been given."

vs

Quote from Martin Whitmarsh :

What they believe is that... the information about that radio conversation with the team was withheld, and that is what they believe was misleading.

and

Quote from Trulli :

And he was slowing down more and more, so I overtook him at 80km/h. So we were basically stopped.

vs

Quote from Martin Whitmarsh :

It was difficult conditions but there was no evidence from the data that Lewis did anything that induced Trulli to go past.

Does look like Mclaren are the bad boys here though.

Another important question is wtf don't the stewards have onboards, radio and data recordings when they look into these situations?

Last edited by J.B., Thu, 2 Apr 2009 17:12.

Quote from Shotglass :

lifepos actually which barely contain any lithium and are fairly safe to use

Just had a quick look at the Wikipedia article. It says energy per mass is lower than with normal Li-ion cells. So what might the advantages be for F1? Safety? Do you know if they are all using this type of battery?

Ah, you already got it... I just did the calculation myself and was about to show you how. Well glad you fixed it anyway.

How can we tell if you made a mistake if you don't tell us what you did?

Looks like those that are using KERS are using Ion Lithium batteries (same stuff that mobile phones, laptops and the Tesla Roadster use) while Williams was the only team to try and get a mechanical energy storage to work (less weight than batteries) but failed. Bosch seems to have a mechanical system ready but AFAICT nobody bought it...

Two other concepts that had been thought of but it looks like nobody tried are super capacitors and fluid pressure storage.

Last edited by J.B., Fri, 27 Mar 2009 08:14.

Quote from PaulC2K :

oh, and they mentioned in the BBC commentry that the issue of the lack of visable indication had been brought up to the FIA (or whoever it would be) to show who was using it and who wasnt...

Good to hear that at least some people in F1 are finally waking up... Published car weight after Quali is another long overdue step that they want to do for the first time tomorrow.

Of course that's still a far cry from Nascar where they can screen overlay multiple moving cars with live telemetry and have onboard views of all incidents from all involved cars immediately after the incident, not months later on the season review DVD, and played in real time, not pointless slo mo.

I could go on but at least F1 is beginning to respect their viewers a little bit.

So where's the information on who's using KERS, what kind of system they're using and how to tell when it's on? I checked autosport.com and formula1.com.

Or are they seriously arrogant and clueless enough to make this a top secret not for spectators deal? Not that I'd be surprised...

Quote from S14 DRIFT :

I can't speak for others, but I keep to myself most of the time and while I dislike people out of the box, I'd never even contemplate killing someone (or a whole group for that matter!). It doesn't always mean you're unnormal, but then again it's not normally normal for someone to prefer not to be around others

I think he had a few wires lose. :rolleyes:

As long as you're comfortable with yourself there's no problem of course. And of course you can't just categorize every loner as a potential mass murderer. But I do think that it's not really surprising that these kind of shootings happen now and then, while many people seem to be genuinely surprised that someone who is completely without a social life, may actually be suffering a great deal as opposed to being "just normal".

I've read some of the news stories now and the quotes are just as expected: "he avoided eye contact and hardly ever said anything to anyone but we didn't think he was strange", "he never had a girlfriend" (did any of the school shooters?) etc.

Quote from Electrik Kar :

Isn't that a recurring theme with a lot of these killers- that they're mostly normal, average, nice guy types?

If by normal, average and nice you mean boring, shy people that have such problems with their social skills that they hardly have any real friends and have zero experience with the opposite sex then yes.

It's always the same. The media asks around "what was he like?" and everyone basically says "I don't know anything about him" and then all of a sudden everyone jumps to the conclusion that he must have been pretty nice and normal. I don't see what's normal about having zero relationships to people. In fact I think it is quite obvious that these type of people are very likely to be depressed and frustrated to a point where they end up just hating everyone.

BTW, was replying to your question in general, I haven't informed myself about this most recent case.

Here's my take.

Don't listen to people who think they know it all and suggest you just "pull yourself out of it" or even accuse you of over dramaticizing for the sake of either being able to live a lazy life or to get more attention. Most people have never been through real shit but everybody is convinced they have (probably including me ).

Most important thing is to get the most out of the medical services that are available to you but it sounds like you have already been to a few doctors (not saying you should get yourself full of drugs, just saying you need to try the best you can to find out if there is anything wrong with you that is diagnosable and treatable).

When you've done that you have no other option than to accept your health the way it is and try to find goals that you can achieve and will allow you to live as worthwhile a life as possible (whatever that means).

Do you have real physical problems that keep you from being able to do normal things, like panic attacks or disorientation? If yes then you probably need medication. If no then you need to start doing something new, like trying to get a new job (if you're old enough, not sure about your age). If you can't do anything because you're too young and there is no option but school, then you need to get yourself through there somehow until you are old enough to have more life choices available to you.

Get well soon!

What a stupid example for their cause. Since when is learning to work safely with dangerous tools something you do by trial and error?

Quote from tristancliffe :

But if they accelerate from the same line, one with a head stand and an initial speed advantage then the gain difference at the end will be more than the head start.

e.g. Car one at line at t=0 and V=60
Car two at line at t=0.5 and V=58 (i.e. the first car got on the power earlier, possibly from an initially lower speed and is therefore faster at corner exit, where the line is).

At the finish line some distance further on it might be something like:

Car 1: t=15 V=150
Car 2: t=17 V=149

And so, by going slower INTO the corner but faster OUT of the corner car one is ultimately quicker.

Does that make sense? Numbers picked from thin air of course, but prove the point.

Well the simplest cornering model I can come up with is that two cars are absolutely identical, in speed and position, at the apex of a corner, and then one car fully accelerates while the other car will first continue at the apex speed for 0.1 s and the accelerate.

In this case the second car will actually be less then 0.1 s behind the first car when they reach the end of the straight. This is because, compared to the pure drag racing example, the second car is actually moving and shortening the length of the following straight instead of just waiting.

The way I see it, the most you're going to get out of accelerating earlier is a time advantage that is exactly the amount of time that you started accelerating earlier. To get a time gap that increases along the straight you need to accelerate better than the other car i.e. go from zero to full throttle faster.

Quote from lerts :

i was thinking if you start acelerating in the corner 1 tenth of a second before at the end of the straight you have not gained on tenth but maybe a whole second, is this correct

No. Why should it be like that? If two identical cars accelerate from the same line, with a one second head start for one car, why would one expect the time difference to change by the time they reach the end of the straight?

But I don't get what the point of it all is for home computers used by small numbers people. To make sure Joe Blow doesn't accidentally delete "important" program files? Aren't the most protected files (program files) the least important and most easily restored type of data anyway? And putting programs in 5 different places at once just makes it even harder to protect yourself against data loss as you have find a way to do a backup in the first place. I just don't get it.

What do you mean by "After formatting you simply restore your home, copy your 20GB of games, and there you go." How do you simply restore all the registry entries and files that are scattered everywhere? Just disabling UAC and keeping everything in one place is far simpler than any of the other options I can imagine.

Directory Opus: Get used to it once and you won't believe all the stupid things that Windows Explorer does, like not display full file names, remove file extensions when renaming, abort a complete file move batch because of one error, change drag and drop behavior depending on type of drive, not allowing a dual view, no tabs, no wildcard filter, no folder size display, err, I could go on and on.

Lets's put hardware settings in HKLM, driver settings in HKCU, program files in, well, program files, user files in app data and savegames in "my games"...

Not.

Dos style program folders are perfect for almost all the programs that most people use on their personal PC. I hate how program structures that only make sense for large companies and massively multi user terminals are shoved down our throats for no reason whatsoever.

PS: I have a DOS games folder over 20 GB in size and guess how long it takes to install all those games? That's right: just as long as at takes to copy the data.

Last edited by J.B., Wed, 21 Jan 2009 22:32.

Quote from ShUckErU :

it is an easier version to use. you dont have to specify the folder

But is that really an advantage? I think it probably makes it more difficult to carry personal settings along with you, which is the whole point of a portable app.

Don't want to sound too negative, but how exactly is it more portable than it was before? LFS doesn't use the registry anyway and all files and settings are in one folder.

Quote from Shotglass :

which is why the hotfix was finalised before they released the _beta_... jesus if you want to critizise microsoft at least keep your critique away from lerts like logical fallacies

I didn't realize that the fix was out before the public release. But still, I spent two days recovering data... No matter how you but it, data corruption is not acceptable for a public release. I mean my impression of Win7 is still better the BSODware that was Vista upon release but at least that was ATI/Nvidia's fault, not MS themselves.

And btw I consider myself an MS fanboi, XP is a lot more stable than anything from OSS or Apple but Win7 just seems to be backwards in terms of quality. I can accept all kinds of bugs but not data corruption.

My point is that causing data corruption is about the worst thing that any software can do to a system and not even a beta released to the public should have any of these type of bugs. Sure, it can happen, but when it does, my trust in the capability of the company that messed up falls dramatically.

Quote from Shotglass :

btw you guys better grab the mp3 patch somewhere too

Woah, MS are really trying hard to lose their reputation of making stable, reliable software. Not touching anything beta from them any time soon.