Quote from Gunn :

It's easy, even after years of doing it a different way, but you must have faith in yourself. I know you can succeed!

But I don't like everyone being able to use those other views in a race. I like the idea that all racers in the race are on even footing as far as what they can see is concerned. I wouldn't care if every view was forceable. It isn't about what I prefer to use, it's about making the racing more fair and equal. Coincidentally, I (and about 8 out of ten other people) prefer cockpit view. I suppose that's a better outcome for me than it is you, but the change isn't malicious. This option is useful to me and I'm glad it has been included. I hope to see more server-side forced options in the future.

If you care that everyone should have the same opertunities and be equal in races you would not hope that this will be implented on the mayority. Some people are fast with cockpit veiw and some are fast with other veiws. It`s like saying that using chase-veiw is an EXPLOID of the system of LFS. But just THINK of all the disadvantages we 3th person veiw people has? Do we have morrows for example? We lose a lot of orientation of stuff when using that veiw, compared to cockpit users, so saying that we have advantages is just ...sorry for word... Bullshit

i guess all the people who don't like cockpit view can protest by not joining the servers that force cockpit view then. or they can take a day or two to get used to it.

Yea, us silly silly arcade racers. We canot of course race, because we use n00bish veiws. Come on! What is this awfull atitute from some people.
"Just get used to it", "be a real hardcore sim racer", what a big pile of comments.

But ok, maybe my username should be !ARCADE DRIVER! The Very End, and the same goes for everyone who not have a wheel, clucth pedals and using a other veiw than cockpit..

Quote from Gabkicks :

i guess all the people who don't like cockpit view can protest by not joining the servers that force cockpit view then. or they can take a day or two to get used to it.

A day or two !????
I just tried cockpitview, and narrowed the FOV to fit my needs. I couldn`t get around As North, without disasters. I drove three laps, and went off 2 - 3 times every lap.

I have absolutely no feeling with the car/road and I have driven my own cars since 1977, so I know a little about sitting inside a car

I don`t protest against the inside view - I Protest against the antisimulation, because inside view STINKS really bad
It`s simply not good enough, for the time beeing

I would want a tripple creen solution, but I really don`t have that kind of money. Then I would sit inside the car

Quote from The Very End :

"Just get used to it", "be a real hardcore sim racer", what a big pile of comments.

Okay, calm down mate. No one here has said anything like that second "quote". Please don't drag this down in the mud.

I can absolutely see where you're coming from, I drove in wheels view for 3 or so years up until last month. It can be a bit tricky adjusting to the cockpit view, but it's certainly not impossible. After about a day, I was around the same speed I was before. (Slow :tilt

Now granted it will probably be a lot harder to switch from chase view to the cockpit, but at least give it a serious go before going waaay over board and abandoning LFS all together.

Quote from The Very End :

If you care that everyone should have the same opertunities and be equal in races you would not hope that this will be implented on the mayority.

I don't care about the majority nor the minority. I only care about the races I'm in. I don't care about what is popular and what is not. I don't care if people are having fun or not, it isn't my business to worry about their personal state. If you are using chase view for example, I'm not interested in racing with you anyway. You're playing a totally different game.

Quote from The Very End :

.. so saying that we have advantages is just ...sorry for word... Bullshit

Well, I see that discussing this with you is a waste of time, so I'll spend no more energy doing do.

Do you find usefull a server option that allows to:

- Force FF wheel controller
- Force 90º FOV
- Force wheel turn compensation 0.5
- Force H shifter

Does any of this make sense?

Why should Force cockpit view should even exist?

People must be allowed to drive with the view and other options they want! Only that way you assure equality among them, otherwise people already used to the forced options will have a huge advantage!

Quote from Gunn :

I don't care about the majority nor the minority. I only care about the races I'm in. I don't care about what is popular and what is not. I don't care if people are having fun or not, it isn't my business to worry about their personal state. If you are using chase view for example, I'm not interested in racing with you anyway. You're playing a totally different game.

Well, I see that discussing this with you is a waste of time, so I'll spend no more energy doing do.

As I said in this or the other topic, I understand both the reasons for having an option like this, and why it should not be.



I can accept, and have no problem that I have limited choises in the future of LFS, I just at least have the right to say I don`t like it. But again - everyone can`t be happy with everything, so I guess it`s just t oaccept, tho it takes away a lot of the charm of LFS, at least for me.

Just one little more thing - why not have a server options that makes it possible for the host to chose if only wheel drivers would be allowed to enter, mouse, keyboard and gamepad goodbye ^^

Quote from Gunn :

I don't care about the majority nor the minority. I only care about the races I'm in. I don't care about what is popular and what is not. I don't care if people are having fun or not, it isn't my business to worry about their personal state. If you are using chase view for example, I'm not interested in racing with you anyway. You're playing a totally different game.

Well, I see that discussing this with you is a waste of time, so I'll spend no more energy doing do.

It's hard to discuss with someone that doesn't care a lot.

Quote from alland44 :

I have absolutely no feeling with the car/road and I have driven my own cars since 1977, so I know a little about sitting inside a car

But your experience with real cars is not going to transfer to LFS that easily. You need to train your eyes to detect G-forces instead of using your arse for starters. This is similar to what you're doing in chase view, but instead of looking at the car itself, you need to detect "camera" rotations when in the cockpit. You're just not going to adapt to this after a few laps around Aston. If you really want to learn you need to give it at least a day of serious practice.

But you will learn, and you will be just as fast as you are now if you give it a serious go.

Quote from wien :

But your experience with real cars is not going to transfer to LFS that easily. You need to train your eyes to detect G-forces instead of using your arse for starters. This is similar to what you're doing in chase view, but instead of looking at the car itself, you need to detect "camera" rotations when in the cockpit. You're just not going to adapt to this after a few laps around Aston. If you really want to learn you need to give it at least a day of serious practice.

But you will learn, and you will be just as fast as you are now if you give it a serious go.

There's goes the option thingy.
Instead let's teach how to drive in cockpit view, in a few months this is all forgotten and the chase view is no longer available.

Quote from dungbeetle :

Yeah, an adjustable seat would be nice - maybe some kind of 'restricted' X, Y, Z axis and pitch adjustment.

I use cockpit view but usually go to custom just to shift the view up a little to bring the horizon a bit more clear of the bonnet.

Provided the adjustments are restricted so you can't position yourself outside the car, it wouldn't be unrealistic I don't think.

This would be my preferred way to go aswell. I shift the seat up slightly (no more than 5cm usually) and the pitch down a little as there is no point looking at half a screen of sky when I can't actually see any kerbs.

Please allow custom view restricted to small tolerances of X, Y, Z and pitch.

Quote from fujiwara :

There's goes the option thingy.
Instead let's teach how to drive in cockpit view, in a few months this is all forgotten and the chase view is no longer available.

I'm not saying he has to, I'm just pointing out that if we wants to learn, his experience with real cars and isn't going to be that helpful in the beginning. It takes time to adjust, but it's not going to hurt your times or feeling once you do.

Quote from rc10racer :

You talk out of your ass

Actually you are doing it.
I've only given my own opinion and so you already did.

Quote from rc10racer :

What makes chase view so dangerous in your eyes because there no mirrors.

It's because I'm admin on populated servers and with the experience I can tell you who is driving with a mouse/keyboard/gamepad and who is using a custom/chase view only by spectating them (well, most of them).
You may be experienced enough to race using chase view but I'm seeing every day the results of the mayhem caused by people using chase view and who have no idea at all of what is happening around their cars.

Quote from The Very End :

Why?

I already answered that.

Quote from Gunn :

Honestly, cockpit view can be mastered in just a few days, so I'd love to see more people persevering with it. I'm sure many would be surprised how quickly they would adapt.

But the cockpit view is a FPS killer.
There are more people than you think who are still using 'old' PC's and in this case a wheels/custom view helps a LOT. Read again the dozens of threads where people are so happy to reach the 50 FPS whilst they had 30 FPS before.

Quote from eRaptor :

I'm still waiting for someone to point me positive things on having this option!

Because some people are lobbying about the fact it should be more realistic.
It may look realistic for people who are using three monitors, but there is no way that it will look realistic on a standard 4:3 single monitor.

great patch,
only bad thing is, our Servers don´t run with it.
We host on Linux/Wine, and with X10 they freeze after a few minutes.

I don't get it... I feel my custom view which shows the top of the dash, some a-pillar and the hood is more realistic than the cockpit view - it's not as if i would see two steering wheels and two pairs of hands etc when driving a real car... I think this is the first bad call I've seen Scawen make.

Quote from Vykos69 :

- customcam available for spectators pls (especially for streaming, watching league races with roof-cam e.g.)

All cameras should be available for spectating IMO.

Quote from Gabkicks :

in scavier we trust.

All others pay cash

Forced cockpit (provided there is some seat movement) is just about OK provided we don't start going down the Force G25 road.

Finally forced cockpit view! Now only forced default set and we're set

Quote from eRaptor :

Do you find usefull a server option that allows to:

- Force FF wheel controller
- Force 90º FOV
- Force wheel turn compensation 0.5
- Force H shifter

Yes I find it useful even though currently I couldn't join that server because I don't have a H-shifter yet. I'd even add mandatory usage of multiturn wheel and that you use the same degrees as the car has. It irks me to no end that I have use low degrees to stay competitive on my DFP.

Quote :

People must be allowed to drive with the view and other options they want! Only that way you assure equality among them, otherwise people already used to the forced options will have a huge advantage!

You can drive with the view and options you want, only not on those servers where the admin wants to set rules otherwise. You want to make the rules or have no rules, start your own server.


It's not that hard to get used to other driving view, it's much eaiser than getting used to a new wheel. Believe me, I did that couple years ago.

Quote from Batterypark :

it's not as if i would see two steering wheels and two pairs of hands etc when driving a real car...

Then disable the hands and the steering wheel

As a loser/noob-cam driver I am disappointed in this for reasons already stated by others.

My fear is that the vast majority of servers will force this and the "CHOICE" that the pro-fcv spin doctors speak of will be anything but a "CHOICE" for those who used other views since day 1.

I hope that doesn't happen but the paranoia runs deep here.

And while we're forcing crap on people, lets have a fixed setup option too. Why not... it "levels the playing field"...

I play racing sims with two monitors and I am sure I am not alone in that case, as most graphic cards have 2 outputs.

This is only possible if I can slightly rotate the view, left or right, in order not to have the monitor gap exactly in my line.
With default interior view, I just can't play, unless I use only one monitor.

(hope this thread is not reserved for licensed players)

I think the force cockpit view is great.. i mean common it's a racing simulation, in real life you don't fly behind your car either.

Quote from Lotesdelere :

But the cockpit view is a FPS killer.
There are more people than you think who are still using 'old' PC's and in this case a wheels/custom view helps a LOT. Read again the dozens of threads where people are so happy to reach the 50 FPS whilst they had 30 FPS before.

That may be, but if people want to race against each other using the same view they shouldn't be prevented from doing so just because another person has an old PC. Every game has this issue, not everybody's PC is going to be up to the task. It's great having server-side options so that those who would like to use these features or who are able to use these features, can use these features.

Quote from auto emocion :

I think the force cockpit view is great.. i mean common it's a racing simulation, in real life you don't fly behind your car either.

Yeah, but in real life you don't look at the world through a 17" window, and you don't sense g-forces with your eyes, you don't use buttons to turn your head and you won't have the dashboard and that apex 200 meters in the distance in focus at once.

There's two sides to this issue, and both sides have a couple of good points if you ask me...

Quote from Gunn :

It's great having server-side options so that those who would like to use these features or who are able to use these features, can use these features.

Does that mean you're open to forced chase view too?

Quote from wien :

Does that mean you're open to forced chase view too?

Absolutely.

What I fear is that we get a divided community.
We have the elite drivers that have wheel and only use cockpit veiw.


..And we have the arcade drivers, with mouses, keyboards, strange veiws and other..stuff,
that arcadish drivers on the servers on the boddom of the list.

Do we want that? I divided communty, that sais that some people are not as good as
other because of simple ways they prefer to playing the game?