You are a ****ing liar. You wouldnt give a shit, only because your loverboy lost the championship are you crying about this.
*SPOILERS* F1 Brazilian Grand Prix 2007, Final Race!!
(756 posts, started )
You are a ****ing liar. You wouldnt give a shit, only because your loverboy lost the championship are you crying about this.
put it this way
If a drive through can be given for jumping the start by .2 of a second which would dramatically effect a DRIVERS points and position, yet a fuel infringement which can gain more time than .2 be punished by NOTHINg then surely questions need to be asked again of the FIA
Nothing? I only said they shouldn't mess up with drivers points, only team points.
Edit: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63567
Now i can go to bed... Its almost 3am here already :/
2 tenths of a second from a standing start gives, more than likely, that particular driver several positions and a better run to the first corner.
considering the cold fuel will give them maybe 5 bhp for about 3 laps after their stop, which are laps they are probably pretty slow on as the tyres are cold, will maybe gain the car about 2 tenths for 2 laps, then go back to normal. and considering williams and BMW were fighting each other and in no way influenced hamiltons drive in the slightest, it doesnt matter.
but the car on the track is illegal?
The FIA would not have allowed those cars to run the race if they knew of the technical infringement before hand????? which would be impossible of course..... it's a disgrace.... once again!
Once again it seems you can cheat and get away with!
Considering the vigur people show against hackers I am surprised the support shown for this behaviour on here!
The FIA would not have allowed those cars to run the race if they knew of the technical infringement before hand????? which would be impossible of course..... it's a disgrace.... once again!
Once again it seems you can cheat and get away with!
Considering the vigur people show against hackers I am surprised the support shown for this behaviour on here!
Although i'm a Hamilton fan, i'm glad he didn't win. I could see the arrogance starting to creep in, this year was not meant to be but next year probably will be.
You seriously think BMW and williams actually meant to do this? An extra 2 tenths for about 3 laps is not worth the risk, they purely got caught out by a very high ambient temp.
And may i point you towards the incident on friday? Hamilton used 2 sets of tyres, which again was a mistake from the team, but it was cheating, basically. as he gained no advantage however no action was taken (10 grand is nothing to mclaren). BMW and Williams gained no advantage from a mistake do to with the fuel, so why should they be punished severly?
Using your logic, hamilton shouldnt even have been allowed to race this weekend because of a wee daft mistake on friday, and the 2 teams should be taken out of the race by a wee daft mistake which got them no advantage.
ferrari with ~400 points ?
the fia has been selectively making decisions through the use of dice and coins for years now ... its not like they have any credibility left that could be lost
all that could happen at this point is turning the whole thing from comical to a complete farce
btw ... zomg photoshop:
http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/4145/kimi12fl1.jpg
And this tells it all. Even an appeal at the court of Paris couldn't grant anything more than a huge fine or deduction from constructor points, starting from this deliberation. Anything more would be considered just one more outrage.
I don't know if it's a good decision or not, but I'm satisfied.
I don't know if it's a good decision or not, but I'm satisfied.
OH I see... so it's OK to cheat as long as the guy behind wouldn't have beat you anyway?
it doesn't matter!
Are you suggesting that cheating should go unpunished as long as the guy you beat 'probably' wouldn't have beaten you anyway?
So say if I won the F1 World Championship with illegal fuel.... but because my car was as fast as anyone else without the illegal fuel it doesn't matter any because to quote you 'it doesn't matter.'
I am not denying this raises serious questions about the FIAt and StepneyGate...
but cheating is cheating whether you finish first or last.
Imagine in athletics if Dwain Chambers was let off his positive drug test because he wouldn't have beaten Asafa Powell anyway!
The Stepny case isn't as clear as people like to make out, and is very mirky... but this case with BMW and Williams seems crystal clear to me. I look forward to reading the FIA's explanations.. hopefully it will enlighten us further
Disgrace my arse. They got hardly anything from it. They proberly didn't do it on purpose, since both teams weren't in the running to win anything. Its really not as serious as potentually copying other teams car parts.
Intrepid: in this whole exchange you just come across as a bit of a tit, and trying to cause an argument (hmmm seen that somewhere before). Just chill out ffs, and look at other peoples point of view instead of blindly dismissing it.
And again well done Kimi, he really did deserve the championship. It would of been great for hamilton to win it, but kimi is a damn fast driver, and at least alonso didn't win.
fd
Intrepid: in this whole exchange you just come across as a bit of a tit, and trying to cause an argument (hmmm seen that somewhere before). Just chill out ffs, and look at other peoples point of view instead of blindly dismissing it.
And again well done Kimi, he really did deserve the championship. It would of been great for hamilton to win it, but kimi is a damn fast driver, and at least alonso didn't win
.fd
...
Couple of points.
Just watched the ITV highlights, still can't workout why they put Hamilton onto a 3 stop strategy ?. He was easily quick enough to climb back into 5th or 6th on a 2 stopper. After the team admitted they kept him out too long on badly worn tyres in China, maybe it could be said Hamilton lost the Championship because of mistakes made by the team ?
If drivers gained an illegal performance advantage within a race, shouldn't they be penalised ?. You can say what you will about the spying saga, but it's never been proved that Mclaren gained any performance advantage on the track with the information they had. Incidentally ITV never mentioned the fuel irregularities.
I'm not a Hamilton fanboy or anything, but I'm beginning to think the stewards/FIA bottled it with regards to the punishment, but it wouldn't be the first time. FIA inconsistent, nah, never !
Just watched the ITV highlights, still can't workout why they put Hamilton onto a 3 stop strategy ?. He was easily quick enough to climb back into 5th or 6th on a 2 stopper. After the team admitted they kept him out too long on badly worn tyres in China, maybe it could be said Hamilton lost the Championship because of mistakes made by the team ?
If drivers gained an illegal performance advantage within a race, shouldn't they be penalised ?. You can say what you will about the spying saga, but it's never been proved that Mclaren gained any performance advantage on the track with the information they had. Incidentally ITV never mentioned the fuel irregularities.
I'm not a Hamilton fanboy or anything, but I'm beginning to think the stewards/FIA bottled it with regards to the punishment, but it wouldn't be the first time. FIA inconsistent, nah, never !
they cant prove that the teams gained any kind of advantage from the fuel, and in theory they gained very little anyway. In previous years, drivers points havent been touched when this situation happened, so i suppose the FIA are being quite consistent. *shock*
and ron said lewis gained about 10 seconds from the 3 stopper, so it probably was pretty sound tactically. If he did a 2 stopper, he would have been very heavy with 35 (iirc) laps worth of fuel and would have went nowhere anyway.
In my opinion they should have been excluded.... no doubt... you can't even run a restrictor in a kart engine that's .1mm out without being punished ffs!
That would then make Hamilton champion... but then it's questionable Macca should be racin...
2007 F1 WDC/WCC - null and void
That would then make Hamilton champion... but then it's questionable Macca should be racin...
2007 F1 WDC/WCC - null and void
<dp>
IMO then hamilton should have been withdrawn from this race for a meaningless mistake with little or no advantage. again, your using different sets of rules for people you like.
and .1mm is absolutely tiny, definetely not measurable on a living breathing kart which moves about a lot by some random guy at a barely maintaned kart track. a few mm maybe, not 0.1mm.
OK, I've followed this petty argument now for about 6 odd pages, and I have now had enough of standing on the sidelines, and want part of the action
First of all, lets get it clear, I believe that yes there was something illegal on the BMW and Williams cars, and while they had gained an advantage, it wouldn't have last long enough for significant gain, and therefore docking points from the drivers would be unfair and unjust.
Second, Intrepid - If you want to dock points from the BMW and Williams drivers then thats fine, but do so also to Alonso and Hamiltion. You just do not hand out record fines for no specific reason but for 'poops and giggles'. Whatever way you want to dissect this Maclaren were found guilty of having specific and confidential documents in there hands, also it is clear that at least Alonso and the test driver (cant mind his name, damn drink
) had some knowledge, and I'm pretty sure that Hamilton knew also, there is now way you can be as close to the team as he was without knowing something of what is going on inside. And please, for you're own credibility, don't come out and say that Maclaren didn't use this information, you don't have documents like that without taking a sneak peek and use to you're advantage, especially when the stakes are high.BT should use this thread as a new advert, I can see the tag line now.
"BT telecommunications, because it's good to rant"
hahaha, only if McFerrari had won...
Erm, not sure about the biological aspects, but doesn't fuel become more efficient if its cooler or is it hotter, not sure ?, certainly the engines have an optimum operating temperature. And also, doesn't it change the density or something of the fuel, meaning it'd be lighter ?
{edit} bloody hell guys, you're typing too fast, can't keep up here
hey if I use illegal tyre softener but it only gained an minute advantage then that's OK....yh... what if I hacked (which I totally condemn) and made my FOX a little faster that would be fine.. because it's only a small difference... u support those...yh?
I can't recall another case in recent times regarding specific fuel temperatures... anyone know the cases people keep on quoting?
I have seen people thrown out of races for being so minutely underweight it's a complete joke.. but you take it... that's racing!
why should hamilton then just be allowed to break the rules and gain an advantage from running 2 sets of wets on friday when everybody else had to run 1?
when its cooler, its a little more compact so they can fit more in iirc, but i doubt that F1 teams fill the cars to the brim at every stop so its a bit of a non question. It probably does have some performance enhancing effect for at most a couple of laps, but once the fuel is up to normal operating temp that advantage dissapears.
You are wrong....
KIMI RAIKKONEN 2007 WINNER WITH FERRARI
*SPOILERS* F1 Brazilian Grand Prix 2007, Final Race!!
(756 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG