Any chance of putting that somewhere Becky? FIA downloads seem rather broken.
2008 Formula 1 Spa-Francorchamps Grand Prix *Spoilers*
(779 posts, started )
Additional - I don't think you can consider the position of the two cars partway through the chicane. A chicane is a single element. Inevitably, whichever car takes the left hand line in a right->left chicane will be slower through the first part and faster through the second. To me it makes sense to consider the position of the cars entering the chicane as the determining factor for the whole chicane, although I don't know if this is actually how it's done under the official regulations.
Most of the grid would have been given 25 second penalties if they had applied that ruling the same way they applied it to Hamilton.
Exactly, including Mr Massa when he avoided hamilton's spin
Thanks for the vid.
OK, on the La Source pass if I was Kimi i'd be annoyed about it, but given that the incident at the chicane was totally Kimi's fault i'd also be darn quiet about it!
Hamilton did return the place and did not have mommentum, but re-passed Kimi as part of the same move, but only because Kimi bottled his braking. The decision therefore is more open to interpretation than a Hamilton fan might like, and only the specifics of the FIA rules can clear that up - but the rules cited by the stewards are totally ambiguous.
Here is something else to consider, when Hamilton braked to avoid the Williams there is clearly a yellow flag waving, Kimi doesnt see it because of his dangerous choice of using the run off area as racing line. He then muscles his way past Hamilton and causes him to go off the road. The picture shows the yellow flag waving. Although the camera angles are not perfect, it seems clear as day to me - it was a pass under yellow flag.
OK, on the La Source pass if I was Kimi i'd be annoyed about it, but given that the incident at the chicane was totally Kimi's fault i'd also be darn quiet about it!
Hamilton did return the place and did not have mommentum, but re-passed Kimi as part of the same move, but only because Kimi bottled his braking. The decision therefore is more open to interpretation than a Hamilton fan might like, and only the specifics of the FIA rules can clear that up - but the rules cited by the stewards are totally ambiguous.
Here is something else to consider, when Hamilton braked to avoid the Williams there is clearly a yellow flag waving, Kimi doesnt see it because of his dangerous choice of using the run off area as racing line. He then muscles his way past Hamilton and causes him to go off the road. The picture shows the yellow flag waving. Although the camera angles are not perfect, it seems clear as day to me - it was a pass under yellow flag.
This is what gets me about the stewards, at one track they treat the rules as a loose guideline and make their own decisions (which is how it should be), at others they enforce the rules as if they are black and white, and at some tracks they bend the rules so their favourite teams can win.
sorry pic didnt attach (user error 
)
)If McLaren win the appeal then I might consider watching F1 again after today's silly decision.
What gets me is that, not only did he give up the place (granted he got it back again, but he was closing in that fast anyway before the incident), Raikkonen took himself out of the race anyway. This therefore should not have been relevant considering Hamilton cut the corner to avoid taking him out.
This is ridiculous.
What gets me is that, not only did he give up the place (granted he got it back again, but he was closing in that fast anyway before the incident), Raikkonen took himself out of the race anyway. This therefore should not have been relevant considering Hamilton cut the corner to avoid taking him out.
This is ridiculous.
someone should set up a league to run against the F1 GP. A 2 hour event so we have something to do while the F1 joke is on TV.
found This
I would of signed that slightly differently than Hamilton, perhaps just a big F*** YOU in block letters.
F**K the FIA.
I don't like Hamilton but heck, if Ferrari is going to win a championship this way, even the most avid fan of F1 cannot watch it with any illusion that it's a sport.
F**K you, F**k you in your French arse.
I don't like Hamilton but heck, if Ferrari is going to win a championship this way, even the most avid fan of F1 cannot watch it with any illusion that it's a sport.
F**K you, F**k you in your French arse.
I've been re-passed myself in LFS (on CTRA servers) by cars that dissadvantaged me and "gave the place back" only to repass me when there really wasnt any way I could keep the position, it's very frustrating when it happens to you.
After watching it again, i'm open to a coherent argument that the place wasnt returned properly. Certainly the FIA statement hasn't done this, but i'm willing to listen to justification. I think it's a little more open to interpretation than I originaly perceived it live.
My feeling, given that Kimi caused the incident, if I was race steward i'd disregard the incident, but I would impose a 10 grid slot penalty and a fine of around 10% or so of his yearly salary on Kimi for the overtaking under black flag. Though shalt not pass under yellow on my watch!
After watching it again, i'm open to a coherent argument that the place wasnt returned properly. Certainly the FIA statement hasn't done this, but i'm willing to listen to justification. I think it's a little more open to interpretation than I originaly perceived it live.
My feeling, given that Kimi caused the incident, if I was race steward i'd disregard the incident, but I would impose a 10 grid slot penalty and a fine of around 10% or so of his yearly salary on Kimi for the overtaking under black flag. Though shalt not pass under yellow on my watch!
well basically Hamilton was in the wrong place at the wrong time, if he would of kept on teh track there are very high chances that kimi would of been spun out or something, ofcourse recieving drive through just like heikki did earlier, so instead he cut teh chicane and still recieved the penalty..... (which he shouldnt of)
Yes there is a flag but the williams and and Hamilton both did an error and were out of the track... So what do you want him to do? Brake and wait till they recover?
Hamilton should have hit the teleport button Asteroids style and hoped to pop up in some clear air behind Kimi.
The camera doesnt show it clearly, but from the looks of it Hamilton broke to avoid the Williams and took to the grass to avoid Kimi passing him. Unfortunately the pictures switch to onboard Kimi at just the wrong moment and there's no replay of it because of all the other crazy things that happened after, but that's how it looked to me.
oh well... thats just the final nail in the coffin, i wont watch F1 again, well unless they change the way they do things.
Biased?
Don't know what you mean, sir!
Well, does anyone remember a little incident in Valencia where Massa pulled out of his pit slot and nearly collided with Sutil?
"Ooh", they said, "Yes, we'll have to look at that after the race", they said. "Unsafe release from a pit stop ... possible time penalty there ... could cost Massa his win", they said.
And what happened?
A €10,000 fine (pfft!), a "Naughty boy, don't do that again" and Massa keeps his win. :haha:
Well, what a surprise!
Don't know what you mean, sir!
Well, does anyone remember a little incident in Valencia where Massa pulled out of his pit slot and nearly collided with Sutil?
"Ooh", they said, "Yes, we'll have to look at that after the race", they said. "Unsafe release from a pit stop ... possible time penalty there ... could cost Massa his win", they said.
And what happened?
A €10,000 fine (pfft!), a "Naughty boy, don't do that again" and Massa keeps his win. :haha:
Well, what a surprise!
Yes well the day before a GP2 driver got a DT for that, and yesterday it happened again in GP2 and guess what? He got a DT...
I think while Kimi had such troubles, Hamilton should be ready for his mistakes (like off the track, spin out and crash later) Damn, in this conditions they should drive like there was You + 20 Nakajimas on track!
But Lewis decided to took Kimi by outside. Kimi went wide, which was very predictible, and Lewis went on full throttle through short-cut. He was just behind Kimi before that corner, but after avoiding contact and without speeding through short-cut, he would not. And this is IMO advantage which he gained. It was very comfortable move for Lewis.
On the other side, action with Massa and Kubica in Japan... they were both involved in the fight with cutting corners and pushing off. Maybe they both should be penalised but no one was gaining anything until straight.
On 'straight-off the track' Massa pushed hard and gone without penalty, so 'Ferrari I... A...' makes sense,
but hey, where are "Hamilton the children of FIA" voices now?
Once FIA bless You, once someone else...
Not good, but what we can do?
"I'll stop whatching F1 races!" ? Oh come on
But Lewis decided to took Kimi by outside. Kimi went wide, which was very predictible, and Lewis went on full throttle through short-cut. He was just behind Kimi before that corner, but after avoiding contact and without speeding through short-cut, he would not. And this is IMO advantage which he gained. It was very comfortable move for Lewis.
On the other side, action with Massa and Kubica in Japan... they were both involved in the fight with cutting corners and pushing off. Maybe they both should be penalised but no one was gaining anything until straight.
On 'straight-off the track' Massa pushed hard and gone without penalty, so 'Ferrari I... A...' makes sense,
but hey, where are "Hamilton the children of FIA" voices now?
Once FIA bless You, once someone else...
Not good, but what we can do?
"I'll stop whatching F1 races!" ? Oh come on
If Hamilton signed this piece of paper. don't that mean he's admitted it was his fault.
I would say it means that he has received and read it. Nothing more.
Exactly.
God this is terrible. Those last few laps were some of the most exciting I've seen in a long while, its not often you get an adrenalin rush watching F1 to say the least. In fact the incident in question is what I watch racing for. Who cares if things get a bit tight and one car has to go off track? As long as the offending car lets the other back through all is fair, that's the spirit of racing right?
I'm no fan-boy of any driver, but I was really pleased to see Hamilton catch Kimi, have a great battle with him, and keep it on the road for the remaining hazardous laps.
And now thanks to that idiotic judgement everything I watched feels like a waste
. This is the sort of thing that makes hardcore fans question why they watch the sport, and keeps the casual viewers away.
I've thought of a few more rules that I'm sure the FIA will like:
#1. An overtaking manoeuvre must be completed on a straight. Any attempt to overtake on a corner is deemed dangerous and will be penalized.
#2. If a driver comes in contact with another car and drives away undamaged, this will be considered an unfair advantage and will take a penalty.
#3. Cars must keep a 1 meter distance from other opponents at all times. Any ignorance of this rule could lead to contact (see rule #2).
#4. Any on-track action that causes excitement may be penalised because THE FIA ARE IDIOTIC TW*TS AND ONLY SERVE TO RUIN EVERYTHING THAT MAKES F1 WATCHABLE!
I'm no fan-boy of any driver, but I was really pleased to see Hamilton catch Kimi, have a great battle with him, and keep it on the road for the remaining hazardous laps.
And now thanks to that idiotic judgement everything I watched feels like a waste
. This is the sort of thing that makes hardcore fans question why they watch the sport, and keeps the casual viewers away.I've thought of a few more rules that I'm sure the FIA will like:
#1. An overtaking manoeuvre must be completed on a straight. Any attempt to overtake on a corner is deemed dangerous and will be penalized.
#2. If a driver comes in contact with another car and drives away undamaged, this will be considered an unfair advantage and will take a penalty.
#3. Cars must keep a 1 meter distance from other opponents at all times. Any ignorance of this rule could lead to contact (see rule #2).
#4. Any on-track action that causes excitement may be penalised because THE FIA ARE IDIOTIC TW*TS AND ONLY SERVE TO RUIN EVERYTHING THAT MAKES F1 WATCHABLE!
2008 Formula 1 Spa-Francorchamps Grand Prix *Spoilers*
(779 posts, started )
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG