Quote from SparkyDave :

if comparing Iracing to LFS, one very important point springs to mind,
LFS= single payment (assuming current model, s3 will be £36 (you pay once and can play forever))
Iracing you have to keep on paying and paying and paying
so over time LFS offers far better value for money

SD.

Amen to that! Having completed my iRacing rookie licence it quickly became obvious that to progress further you have to buy a car and/or circuit(s) that are not in the starter set, so have shelled out for the Skip Barber F2000 and Sebring (because that's where they are racing this week). But next week I won't be able to race in that league till I buy next week's circuit or till the league comes round to a track I do have. Most of the tracks being USA ones are not ones I am familiar with from TV either so it takes a longer time to learn them although more UK/Europe ones are making an appearance. I suppose eventually once you have all the licenced tracks and cars in your collection then you are in the same situation as we are on LFS, in that you can race anything anywhere for no extra cost. But the cost of getting to that state is way, way, more than £24 or £36. So certainly LFS has a very value-for-money model in comparison, the downside of that being the slow pace of development.

Quote from sinanju :

With so many faster cars all racing each other, you tend to get in someone's way, no matter how careful you are (and some people in front expect you to get off the track when they're coming past (as an aside - when you're in a slow car, the amount of time between a blue flag being shown and a fast car going past you is way too brief).

So not so sure you're idea would really help. In fact, I see it making things much worse.

Completely agree, implemented as it is now would not be helpful. And not getting a blue flag till the faster car is beside you is a real problem. But if multiclass servers were to stick to long tracks (not SO Classic) it would be better. Just enough laps for the slowest cars not to be lapped any more than once in normal conditions. Less frequent track changes and less hurried restarts so the "first grid" issue doesn't happen so often. (For comparison, iRacing rookie races start every hour and last 20-30 minutes). Generally making everything on race servers less frantic will help to calm everything down I think and make each race a bit more "special".

Quote from EQ Worry :

From my perspective, and I never had/seen any crasher problems at IHR, but then maybe I'm a scary guy, the many many extra long bans were wrong. Extra long bans teach nothing, they only enrage people. We use them rarely even in demo, and only for really wild characters. IHR team was giving them quite often even for minor problems. This approach has seriously backfired, as you can also see in this thread.

The last drop, again my view only, was setting the minimum LFSEI requirement. I know I took part in making such setting available, but you must have seen how many people are not allowed to race at all. And, believe it or not, average and below average drivers make the server populated, the fast and experienced join and stay only if the average are around. Calls for creating pro-like servers, either using time limit or LFSEI, repeatedly fail. So the LFS beginners went to the other server, because there was no limit, even TBO cars available to start with, and they stayed there, drawing others.

I certainly preferred IHR for racing when it was busy, and only went over to CG when it was clear that was where everyone else had gone once the LFSEI limit came in. The additional IHR servers probably assisted in thinning out the fields too. But (for me) the language on CG can be bad, the driving standards often not as good, and the races are shorter - but it is nonetheless popular. I also like the multiclass concept as it gives you much more to think about in terms of traffic and lapped cars. Then again I also like the AMG GTR concept too. Multiclass with longer races and a compulsory pit stop would be even better IMO.

But because I shared some concerns that LFS is not what it once was I recently dipped a toe into iRacing, which whilst on first impressions is well organised and structured, LFS still has many neat features iRacing lacks. But at the heart of iRacing's driving standards is the safety rating which quickly demotes poor drivers to the lowest class of car. Bans and suspensions there, as far as I can see, are a much more formal process with written submissions to stewards (much the way CTRA used to operate) - not handed out in-session by admins.

So I wonder if Airio servers on LFS can be set up to hit safety ratings harder (particularly repeat infringments in the same race) and also have a default car at the bottom of the pile, a restricted/ballasted XFG for example, which people risk dropping down to if their safety rating dictates. Admins can then apply safety penalties for bad driving (but give people the chance to still race and recover their status) and leave bans or suspensions purely for abuse, harrassment and more serious infringements. I can see potential issues with the first race on a new multiclass circuit with ballasted cars on pole and on any short circuit with them being repeatedly lapped but maybe these are not insurmountable - anyway just an idea.

Cool thanks for the link, hadn't spotted that thread was about the same thing.

Blackwood as you've never driven it before:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dppMTLEu8QU

I agree with the general feeling of the OP that LFS needs some new direction, marketing, etc. as before long, events will probably overtake it and LFS could become an irrelevance. The closest analogy that springs to my mind is the old space warfare game Elite, which was great in its time but nowadays if you wanted to play that kind of game you'd choose Eve Online because it's all that Elite was and much more. I'm sure there are many other analogies too. However at the moment I personally don't see anything in the other sims (that I'm aware of) that blows LFS completely out of the water just yet. As an example, as a European, I find Iracing seems rather US-centric and I begrudge paying subscription money for a simulator where I don't really relate to the cars, tracks and terminology used for example. But if an iracing.eu or iracing.co.uk version came along, with a more European or international flavour, I would be more likely to give it a try.

For me LFS is still the best racing sim but if it is left for too much longer without a fresh lick of paint to generate some new interest, something else will come along which we will all end up playing instead and the collective will to improve LFS will be lost. At the moment LFS still gets occasional mentions in Sim Racing Tonight, but eventually there will be nothing new for them to report on and that will be the last that SRT viewers hear of it.

I suppose the other thing that could happen, which I have seen in other computer games where the original developers have moved on or lost interest, is that they release the code so someone else can pick it up and run with it. I do hope that LFS continues from strength to strength but do worry sometimes that it could just wither on the vine.

A point worth mentioning in relation to IHR multi class racing, where I have recently started working up the ranks myself, is that as I have discovered, the speed differential between my XFG and the leader's FZR is so great that on fast track sections you don't even get the blue flag before the guy is passing you. Yes you can keep an occasional eye on the minimap to see where the leaders are but not if you are in your own battle with other XFGs. But it mostly seems that the fastest cars are actually aware that their arrival amongst the back markers may be a bit of a surprise and do choose their moments carefully.

I haven't played Batracer for a couple of months but noticed the site had gone down this morning. Ferrari's approach seems very counter-productive, not likely to win them many fans by spoiling the game for everyone else. Ferrari lawyers would have a field day here in LFS with the number of user-generated Ferrari liveries you see on here.

Well I'm usually on ConeDodgers, fail to observe one blue flag and you are instantly vapourised on there So I was clearly too keen to get out of the way of anything that looked like an FZR in my mirrors!

Well it was my first 2 hour event and it was very enjoyable, although a bit lonely down in the midfield. Most of the other guys I was on a par with speed-wise either had an incident and ended up round the other side of the circuit to me or disconnected, so I didn't get to do much wheel to wheel racing. But apart from one slight off when moving aside to allow a leader through, I kept a steady pace and stayed on the black stuff for the whole race which I was pleased with. Looked back at the race replay this morning to fill in the picture as to what was going on up ahead, looked like a good race. Hope to be able to get along for a future event.

I saw one of your fast laps and am trying to copy your approach, I know what to do but my setup is a bit lacking around the back of the circuit. I seem to lose 1-2 seconds through the climb from the far hairpin through the chicanes and back down to join the National circuit. I think it's just a case of fine tuning the gear ratios and having a bit more confidence that it will stick to the track. Anyway I'll be happy to be only one lap down at the finish. Assuming I qualify!

Well be glad you're not in an FXR I'm still struggling to get under 2-34, current best by anyone is a 2-31.99. Not that I'm complaining as I'm a bit of a noob at these events and would prefer to be nearer the back, out of the way of the fast guys anyway. I'll only be able to keep up with the FZRs if they are made to tow caravans.

Last edited by modelmotorracing, Thu 9 Jul 2009, 06:47.

Did you add me, or am I too late?

I'd like to have a crack at this please, even if I progress no further than qualifying.

Real Name(s): Martin Kay
LFS Username(s): modelmotorracing
Team Name: Muddle Motor Racing
Number: 9
Car: FXR-GT2

31% restriction on that, is that right?

It would be a dream to be able to race LFS cars on a Scalextric track but realistically there is a limited appeal amongst the public for anything that doesn't appear on mainstream TV or film regularly (i.e. F1 cars, stuff from Top Gear, James Bond films etc.) - your average Scalextric buyer looks for Porsches and Ferraris, not fictional cars (except that, Scalextric are producing a "Micro" set for the Disney Pixar Cars Film and have done similar for Transformers in the past). Only a very few of us (relatively speaking) would be interested in buying LFS cars or sets but you'd still have to get a decent quantity made. Other racing simulators that have modelled more real-life cars would be in a better position I reckon. Having said that there is a Scalextric set due out shortly with NFS cars in it and an NFS game unlock code for exclusive in-game skins. So there is perhaps starting to be some cross-fertilisation between slot cars and video gaming.

I presume these still work:

LFS Race Viewer: http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=30433
and
LFS TV Director: http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=244630

Quote from EQ Worry :

This is a thing that I discovered only recently and corrected in the latest 2.2.7 compile. The error means (probably) you're trying to handle strings larger than 256 bytes/characters. Make sure you're not using such extensive text in config files for now (and when possible, update to the latest 2.2.7). But it is strange the error appeared suddenly, if you did not make any config changes...

I don't have any long strings as far as I can see, and there is no option to upgrade yet. But assuming it's not actually stopping Airio from working then no worries.

On 500 Servers, after their server reload at the weekend, I see the Airio log is full of this, every minute:

09.06.22 08:55:14 AIRIO ERROR: Index was outside the bounds of the array.
at LiveForSpeed.InSim.Aegio.Strings.GetBytes(String str) in c:\Development Files\LFS_Airio2\Aegio\InSimStrings.cs:line 228
at LiveForSpeed.InSim.Airio.Airio.timerMin_Elapsed(Object sender, ElapsedEventArgs e) in c:\Development Files\LFS_Airio2\Timer.cs:line 200

Any ideas? Still on 2.2.5 there.

Thanks I will ask them for the direct path.

Quote from michele0676 :

For me use i've done a php script that work with airio.sta.un.txt and airio.sta.cr.txt and it display in a web page the time and best time.

Did u like it ? Do u think that i need share beacuse i can help someone or not ?

- Show online time

Hi Michele, I have just got your script working on my server, all looks pretty good, the only problem I have is that my latest Airio data files are on 500 Servers at a login protected IP address: port/path, and the PHP script is on my web site (where I have MySQL) at a separate location. Is there any way to directly get to the latest files in the lines $file = "Airio.sta.cr.txt"; and $file2 = "Airio.sta.un.txt"; To test the script I just copied the files from 500 servers to my PC and then up to my web server, and I have an FTP package which I can set up to do that periodically, but I just wondered if there is any syntax I can use to go straight across to the live files from the script?

Watched the video all the way through, sounds very interesting, but I doubt if I would be able to afford a whole Saturday to sit and watch the proceedings, too much other family stuff going on. Having said that, I used to think I wouldn't be able to find the time to watch the Inside Sim Racing programmes on Youtube but actually I do. Whether that has anything to do with Jessica Lopez is another matter .

I think I would be more likely to try and find time to tune in to as much as I can, if there were some people racing I know or can relate to. So if one of the Inside Sim Racing guys was taking part for example. Or a reasonably famous real life or ex- racing driver, that kind of thing. Either way, full driver profiles, photos, race history etc. for all participants on a supporting web site would be essential, so you really know who you're watching. As opposed to just watching a load of driver names moving up and down the list.

Becky, if you haven't already done so, worth talking to EQ Worry to see if there are any data elements that would be useful for Blue 2 that can be captured by the increasing number of server operators using the Airio application.

I've been playing around with a simple Twitter PHP script and am delighted to say (for someone who doesn't consider themselves much of a coder) that I have now got Airio to send (as admin) a "tweet" whenever someone starts a race (I just put the name of the script in the ScriptStart= line). Just so that if I am at a computer I can go and check on proceedings in LFSRemote. Not an earth-shattering thing in itself but at least it works! I've suggested to EQ that Twitter would be a great way to output data from races (especially long endurance ones, say, a tweet every 50 laps with the details of the top 3) - and maybe other stuff, fastest laps, retirements etc., so hopefully that function can be provided in due course. There are limitations on the length of message (140 characters) and calls per hour, but at least it seems do-able.

I'm involved with the UK Scalextric collectors' assocation, we produce an annual slot car (1/32 scale) with a club livery but as has been mentioned already, the issue is quantities, particularly in the current economic climate. Sometimes we can get away with a minimum order of 500 from some manufacturers but more often than not it's 1000. So you would really need a lot of interest to make 1000 worthwhile, and even then they sell at 30-40 UK pounds. It would certainly be cheapest to put an LFS livery on a previously-modelled car, rather than try and model one anew, using the closest available match. Something I'm looking into at the moment is the possibility of an LFS team livery on something like a Porsche 997 (an existing model), which you could either use as a slot car or take the guide blade out and have it on your desk as a static model. I *think* the only LFS car that already exists as a slot car model is the BMW F1, although there are close matches in LFS with other slot car models like Caterhams, Supras, Astras etc. Otherwise if you want to ask a manufacturer to make a decent model of a car "just for you" that doesn't relate to anything in real life that they could re-use the moulds for in the future, I imagine the costs would be exhorbitant.

Now I have got the PB limit working, every minute I see these chat messages:
PB time limit applied, server is closed...
PB time limit removed, server is opened...
Should I be worried about that? It seems to be working OK.

EDIT: Back to answer my own question.
LockPrimeUsersMax= and LockPrimeUsersMin= have to be different values, otherwise it's permanently turning itself off and on.

Last edited by modelmotorracing, Fri 5 Jun 2009, 16:35. Reason : found the answer