I know very little about computers and how things work, are there other people posting here the same as me? Or just in denial?

Quote from Scawen :

It's a matter of time. I could spend 100% of my days working on a shape-shifting LFS to try to stay ahead of 100 hackers. And any moment I stopped they would have the answer and spread it .....

Quote from danielroelofs :

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At least I hope it remains possible to extract data to external applications like it happens now. This perhaps means that data must be stored somewhere and must be read by those external applications. This could be a weak spot perhaps? Would be such a shame if we can't use telemetry programs anymore..

In my (layman) term...if I can see you then you have sent me your stuff and we are currently "allowed" to use some of that stuff.

I can only guess that there is no way to detect if a set up has been taken...unless the download is via the game?

I agree that it is great when people can learn how to make a set up from scratch or even adjust a few things to make the car drive how they want it to....but there is the point...

I can give a day one person my set...he can not drive it at all....I can help by giving a better set up for him...(no matter it is 2 seconds/lap slower for me)...he improves.
I can enter a competition or upload a world record lap...I can share my set...if others do not share then I can still have it anyway?

Quote from Becky Rose :

It has been considered and loudly rejected - (by a few people posting very passionately about how amazing their sets are).

What is needed is not more discussion of that idea, but more ideas.

I can understand the loud rejection...I too would much rather it would be the choice of the user whether to share a set or not...

If it can not be that way then surely it is fairer that everyone shares...not just the select few (*)?

I do not see how there could be other ideas, there can be add-ons or variables..eg- wait for different physics/conditions/implementing an option to share/download notification/etc..

(*)- "select few" referring to people that have a tool to get any set up...and also those people that receive sets from the "select few"..and people that receive sets from those that received sets from...etc...

Quote from Scawen :

As some people pointed out, it can't be made impossible......

Would it not be fairer then to make set up sharing mandatory?
Instead of having "SS" (send set) in the connection box, just have "S"...click it and name it.

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

Raikkonen's dead funny though, so results don't matter.

Agreed.
I am not a fan of either Kimi or Alonso...they can both drive a car fast...
Did someone mention about the Ferrari team concentrating efforts on one driver yet? (Proof?..I have none....only history)

Quote from Forbin :

Evidence? Even if they did gain an advantage...

You already have the exact same car, just not necessarily the same settings.....

Even coming from someone who spent hours upon hours making setups over the years, I think you're tremendously overstating the importance of a good setup. It can help, but it's no replacement for good driving/racing skills.

I can not provide factual evidence that stealing a set will improve your time...but I could instantly tell you if someone has a better set up than you...

Of course it is the same car...my comment was referring to using the same set up...

The fact is that there are many fast guys....they are driving mostly to the limitations of the car set up...if one can find a way to increase the limitation of the set up then they have an advantage...

To my mind either set up sharing is mandatory...or not.

Quote from Storm_Cloud :

The Raikkonen - Alonso gap is significant

How so?
I see a bad car.
Two good drivers.
One is younger and has more current experience with the team than the other....no?

Quote from Forbin :

I just don't see the big deal. Setups are often very personal. There is no guarantee one created by a particular driver will suit another driver's style, so it's possible a setup-stealer is just shooting them self in the foot.

Do people really think they gain that much of an advantage from having exclusive, secret setups?

(Side note: This is much the same argument against fixed setups. The fixed setup is likely to favor one particular driver over another, with no recourse for the driver the setup does not suit.)

Entering a server where you use a mandatory set up is not even related to "set stealing".
If someone does not want to share a set up then they do not want to share...eh?

Of course people have gained advantage from being able to see the exact set up of an opponents car...someone said about recording the sound of the engine and recording all sorts of data...hey in LFS you can have the exact car your opponent is driving without even asking for it..

Quote from skstibi :

If you can't wrap your head around a 4-stroke or diesel then start with a 2-stroke and move your way up. They don't have as much engine braking but it's still there.

I think it is easier to learn how a four stroke engine works first...four strokes of the piston- suck, squeeze, bang, blow. Two strokes can be far more confusing.

Quote from chanoman315 :

If it already ended I made it to the National Finals

Excellent. Keep us updated on what happens and good luck.

Quote from Bmxtwins :

Hardest part about karting is how dry your throat gets from all the rubber and such. That will wear you out for sure.

If that is all that is preventing you becoming a winning karter then please contact me..I will demand a fee and a percentage of any future winnings..thanks.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Agreed, but it's still not 160hp down the whole time.

...but it is...or should be..a massive difference?
It made a difference to the lap times of the Mercedes most definitely...but I was expecting more. Dominance...mmm.

Quote from Gougoodthing :

Happens all the time in other major forms of motorsports.

Mistakes? Yes.
Never good to have open wheeled cars colliding at high speed though....
In hindsight- Perez should have been concentrating on where Massa was rather than trying to play peek-a-boo in Vettel's mirror? Or was he trying to defend the corner?
Either way a bad decision, he could not ever expect to challenge Vettel and if he wanted to defend then he should have moved into position earlier.
Massa made the mistake of expecting an easy pass, as everyone knew that Perez was on old tyres and had brake problems...

Overall the race was quite entertaining...still amazed that Mercedes can lose 160 hp (?) and still only one can catch them....looking forward to the next one.

Last edited by Anthoop, Wed 11 Jun 2014, 17:29.

Quote from Nilex :

.... it's better to beat wheelers with a shitty mouse

There you go, I knew you would have a contribution here.
Now either buy a wheel or take up that free offer. :P

Quote from S.E.T.H :

so you are saying that the force feedback you get from the wheel has no help?
fastest way around a track is definitely a good set up wheel set.

I disagree that a good wheel is the fastest way around a track (LFS).
For me personally, without a wheel I am completely useless.

Quote from sinbad :

Button clutch, on the other hand.......

Indeed.

Quote from ImudilaSkyline :

Not really... you can use small degrees of rotation and get pretty much the same effect as mouse

I disagree. Use low rotation on a wheel then the precision is less...sure you can turn the wheels lock to lock faster but it is much more sensitive to any input.

Quote from bishtop :

theres more to it than what controller is used, none of them will make someone fast or not and even after approx. 96,000 miles using a gamepad I recently decided to get a wheel and try that after id already failed trying to convert to mouse but it is going to take quite some time before I can get to the times I was at with gamepad

Yes..no one is saying using this or that controller will make anyone a driving God...

When I was playing this game I spent nearly all my time trying to go fast for just one lap, often other guys of a similar nature would be doing the same....I have observed many people intensely...using all sorts of controllers/set ups etc.
Two of the people named in this thread I have a very good knowledge of...Nilex and Marus.
I regard Nilex as a friend. He uses mouse and knows his limitations...but they are few and far between. He knows how to make the mouse work and knows the game inside out.
I had a fair bit of fun with Marus, however regarding the game I would put him into a different category altogether ......and probably best I leave it at that.

Quote from Nilex :

No controller will ever make your car go faster.... I always get the impression reading this kind of posts where it is implied that one controller is "faster" so i thought it might me worth to mention this.

I haven't responded because i don't understand Fordman's question....

Of course the peripheral used will not make the car go faster...per se...but by taking a corner better or getting on the throttle earlier you will reach a higher top speed on the straight (or higher top speed earlier)...I think "faster" is a general term for a better lap time.

I think Fordman was mainly miffed that someone with a mouse was better/faster/had more experience...

Quote from Nilex :

Mouse is inferior to wheel in LFS in every way, assuming both are working as marketed. This includes using 720° degrees of wheel rotation. But I'm saving that for when it counts.

You know I disagree...some turns/cars then the mouse will beat any wheeler...put pedals with the mouse and I could see a world beater....

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

Why would input method matter? If you're able to input the best inputs to the car (steering angle, pedal position) with a keyboard, you should be the fastest. Not penalized because you're not using a wheel.

I think that is the whole point of the thread. Should it be possible to be faster using wheel/kb/mouse?
Disregarding the driver for a moment (and as an example,) then we know that the mouse has the potential to turn the steering faster than wheel...and can also be precise like the wheel.
Making the peripheral used perform equally is an impossible task (even I can see that)...so if you had to choose which peripheral to favour in a driving simulator then which would you opt for?

Quote from DANIEL-CRO :

Nilex doesn't even have a driving licence AFAIK

Now you are ringing a bell in my memory bank.
Come on Nil....I know you can contribute in here.

Last edited by Anthoop, Mon 2 Jun 2014, 14:50.

Quote from Racon :

Stick Nilex in a real car, in the back seat and with his helmet bolted to the roll cage and see how fast he drives then

Haha...just putting him in a real car would be enough!
"How on earth do you steer this thing....where do I plug the mouse in?"

Sorry Nil just had to.

Quote from giannhsgr1 :

no its about having confidence in others driving expirience.. you dont want to be near maldonado for example..

In your example...I suggest letting him pass and crash on his own (or into someone else ahead of you).

Skytrill- I am finding it hard to determine which of those scenarios is more implausible.

More importantly- I think the developers are past the age for moody hissy fits (even if they ever had them)...as the saying goes "like water off a duck's back".

What they need to get is- http://www.woodbowl.com/images ... cts/detail/rooundtuit.jpg

Quote from Whiskey :

Not at all. They are completely diferent.

Thanks. So I guess I need to have a look.

If it can be of any help to you Redman then I have spare time next week and will take it apart and have a gander.....if you are sure the connections are ok and you are sure you have cleaned the pots adequately then it sounds like new pots are needed but I can not be totally sure until I see what I am looking at.

Is it potentiometers in there eh?! One day I will have mine apart and have a looksee.

I would definitely try cleaning as it costs nothing.
Anyone know if it is the same potentiometer as used in the pedals?
Due to how the pot. works they do get dirty...and they also wear out.
If the track is not worn out then a good clean will fix it...for now.

I see secondhand G25 shifters on Ebay quite often...maybe that is an option?
The micro switches have a number on them...without taking mine apart I do not know the number...but there will be parts or an equivalent available.

Note also that I seem to remember reading some fault with the G25 shifter mechanism ....the micro switches either work or not....personally I never used the shifter for changing gear.

I am only looking...and that looks very good Daniel.

Quote from bishtop :

While anyone is entitled to there opinion regardless of miles driven ect id reckon that someone with very few laps would most likely be the type of person who would moan regardless of the current situation

Quote from lfsrm :

no need 1 million of laps to understand à very simple situation , this is just an argument to allow some troll/useless comments/responses.

I totally agree with Bishtop.

Lfsrm- The situation may seem simple to you but clearly other people do not agree, different people have different wants/needs/opinions.
If you view my statistics you can see I have a handful of races compared to distance traveled, basically I raced myself. I grew bored of knowing every pixel on every corner the game had to offer (yes, exaggeration). If today was my first LFS day then I would still spend a similar amount of time playing it because it is "very good".

"Very good" will of course depend on "your" opinion. Taking opinion to the extreme then if you want neons/nitrous/etc. LFS is not the game for "you".

Quote from tristancliffe :

Maybe they haven't played BECAUSE they want updates?

Yes....but there are those that will always be wanting updates and will never be satisfied.
Exactly the same as every game forum you care to mention.
If my stats said I had joined yesterday and completed 10 laps and came asking for new cars/tracks would you have the same opinion?

Quote from Rappa Z :

They ever get around to adding heists?

Not yet...but as above there are some rumours that it will not be long.

Quite looking forward to the update though, I am hoping it will lift the boredom a little.
Being able to have a race without being punted off, should increase the driving standard of those doing the punting....
A few new missions, hopefully people will choose something other than Rooftop Rumble.