Quote from Bob Smith :

Many of the apps benefit demo racers. No need to exclude them from everything for the sake of one hacky program. I didn't look at the .ini file when I approved the app but a simply having a binary file format would make sense. If you can decode that then you know enough to edit memory anyway.

I see a couple reasons to exclude them from the addons...





They haven't bought the game. Does it really take all this and hours of gameplay to convince people to spend $40 (USD) to buy the game? Sure its great for them to know what is out there, but to be able to get 99% of the addons and make the demo last longer is the exact argument against allowing an open tweak program. Sure there are differences, but the general idea is still there.

It would be a lot easier for those of us that have bought the game to have a forum for licensed racers where we can share and develop mods easier. Shouldn't those of us that have paid have the preference?

Bob, why not just make this forum private for S2 racers?

Demo drivers shouldn't even be able to see the thread titles, much less the actual addons.

Quote from JTbo :

I think those many posts about zillion hp mods are perfectly good proof to keep modding tools away from public/enough expensive so that only serious mods will ever be created of

That made absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Top Gear all the way.

There is something about the formula of Top Gear lately. When they had the fat bloke during the first few seasons it was a nightmare. When Jeremy, James, and Richard began acting more like friends just having fun with cars and joking around it added a level of informality. Its the formal and scripted reviews that make most review shows awkward.

Over in America we have some really really really bad review shows that literally just run through the numbers and show the car wobbling down a drag strip, then call it a good car. Fifth gear comes close to that, its more of a "this car has ____,_____,____ features that make it a good value."

On the other hand Top Gear is more entertainment. Not very many people are going to even see a Bugatti Veyron in person, much less drive or own one. The fun of watching the show and these insane cars is much more appealing than finding out about what you'll be able to afford and hate to drive.

I equate the success and shortcomings of the two shows to being a kid with a choice of two posters on their wall. The first being a Ferrari racing down a runway, and the second poster being a euro-box sitting in front of a cafe' with two people reading off the teleprompter.

I don't see much of anyone choosing the latter. Hell, I'd rather watch a review of a euro-box on Top Gear and hear how terrible it is, than watch a review of a Aston Martin on Fifth Gear and hear a list of the car's accoutrements.

Quote from Bob Smith :

I do agree with Rob too, but there is a place for both apps. The fixed car-swap apps, usable offline and online, and the creation utility. I want to come up with a good way of allowing the creation of preset packs that will swap the three demo cars over (the way I'm doing it atm is a bit cumbersome). Also when LFSTweak lets you edit ~20 values (some of which may not have clear purposes), it is possible with a little time to get familiar with it. When you have a program that can edit well over 400 values, things get a little trickier. Quick and easy to use it ain't. Essentially, by releasing a preset version first, I set the standard expected of custom cars, so once the tools are released, most people won't bother releasing 5 minute jobs.

I could go down the route of only giving the editor to people I'd think were going to make good use of it, but frankly I don't fancy getting 300 PMs from different people and then have to come up with a way to decide. Whatever way I go ahead, I want to keep some degree of professionalism to it. I'll think of it more once the first static version is out. I'm sure it will keep people amused while we discuss the way forward here.

I think your idea is good but...

We just want to have the old tweak back. I think we'd all be happy with just being able to make our own cars. Obviously about 3/4ths of the people that have voted want a tweak in any fashion possible. Whether its a 5 minute crap tweak program or otherwise I want something to take some of the monotony out of single player.

Again, I can't play online because there is too much lag and every server at 0300GMT is unpopulated or a drift session.

I like that you hope to set the bar high, but while doing so at least let those of us with S2 licenses have something to play around with. Just with the basic tweaks from a year ago I could get a couple dozen cars to pull realistic figures around different tracks, and drag racing. I don't need 90% realism over 70% realism if it means waiting for 3-4 months. I am actually using a 5-minute quick Tweak and its better than nothing.

In the time it took you to post 397 times you could have worked at a really crappy job for a few days and earned the 40USD. I am willing to bet money that you have a cracked version of S2. Of course we'll never know because you wouldn't want to spill the beans and get banned.

What I don't understand is one tweak was given to the moderators a couple days ago and it still hasn't been released. What news is there? How long does it take to test if it works for the demo?

Any major delay or inhibition of tweaks by anyone but the maker of the tweak program will result in the LFS developers losing $20 from my wallet when S3 comes around.

This is the worst thread containing the worst idea in internet forum history.

PS: Considering Americans really have trouble playing online, a tweak is a good incentive to buy the game. I never play online because the lag from European servers is terrible and when I am able to play there are only 200-250 people online, most of whom are on drift servers and other useless crap.

Last edited by Dethred, Fri, 28 Dec 2007 10:34.

I am getting a pegged 100fps but occassionally it drops into the teens for no reason, then seems capped at 30fps. Eventually the framerate increases back to the limited 100fps.

Sig from hardforum.com copied over for any hardware questions, forgive the unneeded specs.


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Quote from XCNuse :

just woke up and looked at my vista newsticker, and the final number is 32 deaths and 29 injuries... :S

i also believe a few of those injuries are gunshot wounds, and 2 are from kids jumping from windows, 1 of which may be dead, and the other is a guy who broke his ankles, both kids jumped from the top story

My girlfriend goes to Tech, and one of her friends (someone who I also know), is in stable condition in the hospital with a gunshot wound to the head. Miracle he's still alive. I may be going up there this weekend so I may be able to find out more than what the news is showing.

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Why is there no weight option? This program is pretty much useless without being able to change the weight.

I think we all have to understand, especially with the open wheelers, that 100-150+mph wind (even disturbed or partially inhibited by body pieces) will cool any material exponentially faster than ambient air will.

Also, tires heating up could be a potential issue. I watched a video of a camaro with worn tires doing a burnout for nearly 8 minutes before his tires blew. If I remember correctly they were sports tires of some kind too. I've done a couple burnouts in my FWD MX-6 with Fulda's and they weren't even very hot to the touch after over a minute of wasting my money.

I am not sure what Scawen drives or if he's even willing to do it, but maybe he could go do a 30 second burnout and check the temps, or even go to a track and ask to do some investigating. Yeah it'd be time consuming but it'd put the issue to rest.

I am not sure about slicks, but doing a 10-15 burnout in a few cars that I have driven have not resulted in near-boiling-point-heated tires. They get hot, then they cool off rather fast.

Before trying to refute it, go and touch your cars' tires after a long burn out and tell me if it feels like, or is, 80-100*C.

Also, the hotter they get, the quicker they should cool down. Tires above 100*C being driven straight with minimal friction at 120mph will cool off more than a few degrees on a back straight.

Quote from Cue-Ball :

These two things are mutually exclusive. You can't make a realistic sim and have a manual transmission car with no clutch or people driving with a mouse and keyboard. It comes down to personal choice. If you want to allow keyboard racers and two-pedal setups on your server you should be able to. If you choose to race against people who have three pedal setups, steering wheels, etc. that should be your choice as well. I personally prefer the latter. If that's TOO hardcore for you, fine. There are plenty of other servers to race on and you can always host your own.

Wow, as if finding a server that isn't drift or open to all cars (thus making a decent race impossible) isn't hard enough.illepall Lets make more game divisions so that each server will have one or two people.

Quote from deggis :

LFS with CSR: sounds better

Thats why most of the sound packs are taken from other games? Its a great program, don't get me wrong, but I'd rather play a game that doesn't need heavy modding to be remotely enjoyable.

Rfactor: Sounds better
NFS (anything after 2): Sounds better
Netkar Namie: Sounds better
Netkar Pro: sounds better
Gran Turismo (1-4) sounds better.

I would have said slightly better but after several patches, and its on S2, the sounds should be better than Netkar namie, Racer, and other FREE games.

The gear whine sounds like the turbo but continually increases its pitch. I just asked my brother to listen to the sounds from outside my room and he could barely tell they were from a car.

For the love of God, if there is not going to be any feel in a FF steering wheel when the car is bouncy, please make sounds for the rumble strips. Also, if this is the best that can be done with the sounds, which are a critical part of the simulation experience, please change to the traditional sound sampling. There is no point in making all of us wait years to hear decent sounds while having to deal with these synthetic failures.

Engine sounds have gotten a lot better. Not all the way there, but closer. Turbo sound is still bad.

Here's a 2.5L V6 (MX6) turbocharged. This car makes only a slight bit more than the in-game XR GT.

http://videos.streetfire.net/s ... dac-8167-9847002c95c2.htm

Last edited by Dethred, Thu, 21 Dec 2006 05:34.

Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

I've always wondered if you've ever driven a real car before :rolleyes:

I'm actually being sincere

I suppose FWD cars ranging from an Acura legend to a Mazda MX-6, RWD cars ranging from a modified LT1 Formula, 5.0 Mustang, and full bolt-on/cammed LT1 Camaro to a 3L Z4, 540i Sport wagon, GS300, AWD cars ranging from a 330xi to a Volvo S70 wagon, don't count as cars. I have never driven a car that is as loose and easily recontrolled as the cars in LFS.

That being said, its on the right track, but not quite there yet. Considering you were audacious enough to ask if someone who has been driving legally for eight years and on closed roadways for an additional 4, I assume you were one of the people that claimed that S2's original physics were perfect. Despite the changes by the the developers in the mean time, I am sure they were perfect before and after the changes.illepall Way to go.

One more physics adjustment and you're wrong again, and I'm right again. Have a nice day.

Audio honestly isn't any better. Handling is still loose and slippery.

Quote from z3r0c00l :

A lot of cars pre 1990 are measured from the non driven wheels, there are not any wires involved, there are however cables etc. Taking it from the differential is newer technology.

Generalizations save time ONLY when talking to stupid people.

by the way, you asked me to name any real vehicle similar to any car in LFS that didn't take the speedometer off the differential (takes it from the front left wheel), well here it is:

Transmission Renault five-speed manual
Suspension front: Double wishbones with coil springs, telescopic shocks, and anti-roll bar
rear:Semi-trailing arms, coil springs, and telescopic shocks
Tires front:195/60HR14
rear:Goodyear NCT 235/60HR15
Brakes front: Discs
rear: Discs
Horsepower 145 bhp @ 5,500 rpm
Torque 162 lb ft @ 2,750 rpm


http://csh.us/wp/wp-content/uploads/2006/06/delorean.jpg


"Oh no! I'm about to plug my speedometer cable into something other than the rear diff, this needs MOAR JIGGAWATTS!!11"
http://www.homevideos.com/free ... back2thefutureone108.jpeg

Congrats on identifying my question and answering it with hog wash. I really haven't noticed any cars in LFS with more in common with the Delorean than having four wheels. I guess naming a car that many people will never see in thier lifetimes (I've seen two, sat in one.).

Quote from z3r0c00l :

Correction:

Some cars measure the speed at the differential, some at the gearbox, some at the driving wheels, and some from the non-driven wheels.

I have a GPS speedometer which measures the speed without being mechanically attached to the car.

Please research and reference before making generalised claims.

I'm sorry. Name any Real vehicle similar to any car in LFS that gets its speed anywhere than from the differential.

BMW? rear diff. VSS,
FWD Hondas, Mazdas, Toyotas, etc, all measured at front diff.
Porsche: Differential
etc etc etc.

It is the easiest measure of speed, avoiding wires running near axles and moving axles, and suspension parts. My dad's old 99 S320 Mercedes... rear diff VSS. His Lexus GS300 rear diff VSS. My friend's Formula, rear Diff VSS. Generalizations are made to avoid having to write out whole paragraphs like I just have, to keep people from trying to point out that there is that 1/1000 vehicle model that uses something other than the differential.illepall

Sounds no different than when S1's LFS tweak allowed for increased "raspyness" in the options. Definitely sounds better than stock, but it still sucks compared to just about every racing sim out there.