Quote from Rotareneg :

Here's an improved smoke texture that is more opaque which may help you survive until the developers get off their lazy butts and stop wasting time screwing around with crap like physics, new tracks and new cars and fix the most important issue in LFS: tire smoke modeling.

wow thats nice you created a .dds that won't allow the game to start thats handy.

@cupramam
WAKE UP!!!!!!! you are in America the land of BIG stuff! Everything is huge soo they like it.
so a truck that comes up to my shoulders is a big car? my blazer besides our corvettes and impala is the lowest car we have so how is it a big huge car that all Americans like?

Quote from Forbin :

Which one?

2000-2002 ws6 or trans am so its a ls1 motor. plastic body so it will be easy to keep it looking good and no rust on the body.



the comment around tickets was because every one jumped to the conclusion that i must be street racing at nite. whats to say it wasn't at a drag strip or on a privet road.

as for my point i thought i made it quite clear here.

Quote from gotspeed :

its not a arcade affect tho, it happens in a real race a cars a-arm getting hit breaks it and guess what the wheel falls off. when was the last time you watched a f1 race the guy hit a wall and just the shocks broke and the wheel bent in and he finshed the race. never happens the car falls apart and theres only 3 wheels left and hes race is over.

if the only down side to having smoke in the game is lower fps then do it already. im playing with a i7 and gtx 295 i normaly see about 300 fps even my 5 year old dell xps was still playing lfs at 70 fps with every thing set to high settings.

don't think i want a burn out image creating app from lfs. but i would like it so when the guy in front of me gets bumped and spins it makes my race more realistic if i have to hold my breath and drive through a blinding cloud of smoke once and a while.

thats a real gtr burn out that wasn't that long and the smoke is so thick you can't see through it at all in the middle. the edited pic is how the smoke should look both sides different and not just a mirror image of the other side and has the one quality of smoke that every one here seems to hate that is, it being hard to see threw

Quote from dadge :

take it to a track like you mentioned. racing on the street is an idiots game. how much fun can "chirping" the tires in 2nd gear really be?

when you drive away from some knob in a pos inport that thinks hes fast b/c he has a wing its kinda fun. but getting 30-50 miles more on a tank is the reason i got the shift kit. stock shifts i use to be able to do around 220 on a tank with the shift kit i have hit 270 on a tank driving around city and if i do any freeway it goes in to the 300+ on a tank. it shifts gears faster so theres less time where the motor is tunning 3k rpm and not engaged moving the car, its also better for the transmission temperature wise less slipping on the friction plates. between that and an after market external 1/2tube 24in 2 pass trans cooler on the frame rail with braided steal lines and -06 an fittings on all the ends. its built to be more of a gt car and not a drag make a 14 second run then it breaks down. from the brakes being drilled and slotted with a set of hawk hp street pads that were 75$ (just ordered braided steal lines for all the lines on the truck) to all the lines being braided steal for the oil and trans coolers. if it wasn't for having to drive it in the winter i would have changed the thermostat in it to a cooler 160 from the 180 thats in it from the stock 195 that it came with.

every time i go to some ones house or someone at a business im going in to if someone sees me get out of it they normally complement how good it looks and thats the main reason i drive it. so now that your done analyzing my car, what kind of performance cars do you guys drive daily or are you stuck in your moms clio 1L that can't break 100 mph?

as for tickets i don't have any on my record at all, no speeding, no racing, no red light, nothing.

i like how you guys have instantly attacked me once i made my point on the smoke.

Last edited by gotspeed, Wed, 23 Sep 2009 20:10.

Quote from XAMENO_KOPMI :

Its always fun to sit back and "listen" to what a -moddified truck driving- American has to "say" about cars...

sorry i need to be able to carry more stuff then i could fit in some little clio. wait till i get a firebird and do some work on it, thats going to by my weekend fun car and take it to the track about 1 hour north from here. as for my "truck" 240 hp is plenty to drive every day. if i really wanted to and had the money a friend of my dads has a ls1 motor that he got for nothing that he said i could have that just needs to be rebuilt. so i really wanted it could be a 350cu in 400+ hp all aluminum v8 that would weigh the same as the v6 that is in it. but that would be a pain to drive every day. as it is now it chirps the tires in to 2nt about 30% of the time and will down shift in to 2nt if your doing any thing less then 70 mph and step on it and it will take off. i have had countless different times in the rain with out meaning to i have had it break the rear tires lose and spin for 20 feet or so before they hooked back up.


so with your 250 hp clio and jail sentences in the eu for doing 10 over what exacly can you do that would be any amount of fun with out ending up in a 8x8 box with a guy that wants to be your new best friend?

Quote from Forbin :

Those are some serious performance mods.

The fact you compare an S10 to a Holden Ute shows just how little you know. Going fast on public roads doesn't make you a racer, it makes you an idiot.

keep in mind this is my daily driver my car that has 130,000 miles on it. most of the stuff done to it is to clean it up, dark windows all the way around, changing the front orange parking lights to white ones with orange bulbs. the only other "big" change i want to make is powder coat the rims glossy black to go with the rest of the red and black theme and do the extreme emblems in black. next week or so the door handles will be matched to the body and powder coated red so they blend in along with shaving the button and wiper arm from the back of it.

going from a stock 190 hp to around 240 hp i would say is some serious work. having a race shop rebuild your motor is a good idea if you got the 2k laying around and can be with out the car for 1 and a half weeks well they port and polish and blue print the motor. along with new pistons, boring out .030 and bigger injectors. there soon will be a different cold air intake and a flowmaster super 44.



this is my truck. 2 points if you can figure out what was done to the picture on the computer.

hey i just had a great idea well i was in the shower. since you guys want the perfect racing environment and all, with smokeless wrecks and no crashes from hitting tall curbing in high cg cars and all. why not well where at it put 1000% more hp in all the cars and bump up the grip on the tires 100,000% and make the cars handle like there on rails. then we can all have perfect races where every one finishes first or at least with in :00:002 seconds of the leader.

you guys come on here and complain about about one part of the sim being to real, then when some one points out what real racing is like you want to bash it for being unrealistic or what ever your perfect image of real racing is. part of racing is luck, do you get cough up in someone else's wreck or do you get lucky and squeak by. do you have just enough gas to last the whole race or because you were not able to draft some one you ran out 1/2 a lap short in the lead and the 2nt place guy passes you for the win.


so pick the worlds best perfect racing environment or the worlds best racing simulator.

Quote from marzman :

That car weights 2000 KG and is often used as policecar that is all over the place in movies. Not something a car that handles good would do. It would eat dust of all the much smaller engined GTO's on any track but the oval.

so you believe every thing in the movies?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV5OoqTefKQ
^ he seems to be able to handle it pretty well.

real burnout.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G_gELBogDY
real crash
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8TncQItkN1I
@jj72 "more realistic smoke will make the game harder - yeah right."
and as for more smoke making the game harder or not it would be much harder. the next time theres a spin in front of you not only would you have to deal with the cars you would have to be doing it though a blinding cloud of tire smoke. you guys want the ability to see though smoke that should be there. good luck with you realistic sim then.

Quote from dadge :

completely unrealistic imo.
you've compared your american truck to an american "sports" car.
compare it with a european sports car of the same price (the lotus is nearly half the price of a new mustang)and you'd soon realise that you own a skip with wheels.

i said a car not a sports car. our 96 impala would out do it. but as a "truck" it handles like a car nothing like a full size truck would.


no one has posted a better screen shot then the toca so....

Quote from JJ72 :

That's a truck.

i've never heard of a rustang, but if it lives up to its name, it doesn't sound a like hard thing to beat.

its a truck but its set up more like car. big sway bars front and rear with pretty quick steering, short stiff springs. it handles more like a go kart then a truck. as far as calling it a truck i wouldn't say that its built to be a sport truck more like a ford lighting. if you watched the last top gear ep its like the Holden ute's then a truck you would tow or go off roading with.

google rustang you will learn :P

Quote from JJ72 :

LOL that's an SUV?

seriously smoke effect isn't better is because no one is particularly bothered with it.

more realistic smoke will make the game harder - yeah right.

Someone who thinks rendering smoke in Max and smoke effect in games is comparable has no credibility on this subject in my book.

thats not mine but its the same truck. think of it like what you would call a hot hatch 200hp v6 rwd 4 speed. mine has a b&m shift kit, k&n filter, a set of msd 8.5 mm super spark plug wires with e3 plugs and soon a new blaster ss coil and also going to remove the low end restrictor from the throttle body and lower it another 2 inchs next summer with spindles up front and blocks in the rear. it will chirp the tires in to 2nt gear almost on cue every time. im starting a contract with a guy fixing printers next month or so for the federal buildings and local banks in the area and i figured in 4-6 months i will have around 10k for a ls1 6 speed firebird and that will be my project car.

i can tell you for a fact the blazer is faster then at lest 1 5.0 rustang

Quote from Forbin :

Trolls

Internet. Serious business.

Please, keep going. You amuse me.

so basically you lost and your trying to change the subject with some under aged girl you have a crush on?

Quote from CUPRAMAN :

:munching_HAAHAHAAHHAAAAAAAA
OMG man grow up! 6pages of posts that proves this is real racing and you still want to be . For real have you ever drive fast in REAL track with REAL car to see how it is? Just answer me that.

does having a car thats capable of doing 160mph count and hitting 100+ from time to time. thats one of our 2 collector cars and my daily driver is a s10 blazer with a handling package with a newly rebuild motor after dexcool ate the head gaskets and let the coolant in to the crankcase. besides the handling package that it came with. i personally have put a bigger set of brakes on the front that are drilled and slotted with a set of hawk high performance street pads with 2 piston calipers. my front brakes more then likely cost more then half of what some people spent on there car. maybe if you did more then just drove in your perfect simulator world you would know how it really is to do a burn out and having smoke and the smell of burning rubber in the car.

as for programming i had 9 months of programming for my associates in computer electronics engineering. from programming bios's to .net apps. i know about shift registers and the accumulator and what not. i also know it wouldn't be that hard with all the source code to change the amount and how the smoke interacts with its environment.

the only reason the smoke isn't heavier in the game is it would make it to realistic, a simple spin (and big smoke cloud) would make the game much harder and ruin some 12 year kids race and he would complain about the smoke or some 7 year old desktop would give up the ghost from the extra load from more smoke.

Quote from jakeeatworld :

tell me that when your in a RWD

what does rwd have to do with it. fwd rwd and awd will flip if you hit a curb to hard and still try to make the turn once its on 2 wheels. you save all 3 the same way too by turning towards the ground.

honestly the curbs being tall isn't the problem. some should be. don't look at cutting a curb a way of shaving .01 seconds clip them yea but run over them and drive with 2 wheels in the grass no.

the new curbs look like they will be a lot of fun.

Quote from Forbin :

I laugh at your pitiful attempt to disparage LFS with low-res, non-antialiased pics.

ok show me a pic of lfs that looks better then that toca with out it being edited at all.

Quote from dadge :

a $400 machine in your country could be a €1000 in another.

ever won a race using those views?. (high fps in those views are pointless unless recording).you've also named more or less every racing game in my collection. the point being, i didn't swear allegiance to any of these games and by not doing this i am able to buy them all. like most people in here.
there's a thread in here with people who have already spent £24 on this game and are willing to pay an extra £12 (or more) for the new content (extra track and cars). so i would say LFS is stronger than you think.
just because LFS doesn't have Tony Hawks grinding down a pit-barrier or voice overed by Murray Walker. it doesn't mean that the devs are not going to sell any more of this product.

so they have spent £24 on the game and another £12 for extra content lets say £150 on a wheel. yet they are still playing on there 6 year old desktop to play there serious racing sim i doubt it. im 20 and have yet to have any kind of real "job" other then the work i do on my own time for friends and family for some spare cash and i was able to get together 1,500 (us $)to build my self a top of the line system. if you can afford all those games you should be able to afford a system that can run them half way decent correct?

Quote from george_tsiros :

if i didn't know any better i'd think that gotspeed says that a game that has greater demands from the system is automatically better.


so a game is good only if it stresses the system?

no a game is only good if it looks like it was relased in the last 5 years



vs

Quote from dadge :

the second link doesn't look good at all. and did you see the FPS hit?
one of the best things about LFS is that you do not need the discovery space shuttle to play it. it will run on quite old systems. adding more smoke will make alot of drivers games really unplayable.
and tbh, it didn't look that real either.

because its a hack to get the smoke to work like that. bumping the smoke up in the game and not having another program thats running doing a overlay or what not would help the performance.

as for the systems that lfs runs on. there will be a time that the minimal system requirements need to be bumped up. you want to be playing a game thats made to from on a apple 2 25 years later. no the game is in constant development so it should take a pretty reasonable system to run it. at some point i expect my 7 year old 500$ used laptop not to be able to play lfs at 50 fps when im in class.

the last year or so i have been running my own biz building and fixing computers for people. 400$ in parts will build a system that will run lfs 100+ fps on a 23inch wide screen at high settings. if the devs want new people to buy the game there needs to be a incentive to spend the money on a 6+ year old game. so doing stuff like adding smoke and better damage model needs to be done other wise people will just spend the money for forza, gtr evolution, euro truck simulator, arca sim racing, stcc, race 07, race driver:grid, superstarts v8 racing, bmw m3 challenge, toca/dtm race driver 3. i missed a few others but the point is. lfs wants people to buy it and play online it needs to look as good as the rest of the sims out not like a game from 05 that has had a few cars added. do i expect lfs to push my i7 with 6 gigs of ram or stress my gtx 295 no not at all. but it shouldn't get to the point where my mobile phone has enough gfx power to run it.

hey thinking about it lets all just live 8 years ago no dsl no high speed cable. so from now on no gfx online or video forget hosting your own game server or web cams. why not live like that instead of using all the capability we have today.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tZlCx9VYkI

here a lfs amount of smoke coming off a car upside down after rolling from a curb.

more like how lfs smoke should be: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YT9ooU_NnBg

Last edited by gotspeed, Sun, 20 Sep 2009 21:42.

Quote from Forbin :

Not to mention simulating it in real time along with with many other things.

that wouldn't be a problem. make it nvidia physx or just a normal gfx your computer is already doing all the damage model and other things that it is simulating real time. the problem wouldn't be with weather or not it could be done real time, the whole game is being done real time.

as for the code its changes to the existing code and unlike others i am not willing to break tos and modify or edit how lfs runs. people have made smoke mods that change it to how it should be but unless everyone has it. it makes my race harder then the next guys but its the way it should be for every one imo.

Quote from Rotareneg :

Simply spawn more and larger smoke polygons (with the transparent smoke texture) and do some real-time computational fluid dynamics to simulate the smoke flowing around the vehicles.

There, see how easy that was?

ding ding ding done

Quote from Breizh :

Then you should have no trouble handling a whole game on your own. Shake a leg!

building a game from ground up is different from building a robot in a program thats already made. but it isn't that much work to change how long and where the smoke comes off the tires and how it acts with the car.

Quote from Crashgate3 :

You obviously have neither used 3DMax nor have any experience programming.

actually i have, i use to use iron cad a lot in high school and i had friends of mine that did 3d animation on the cad design of our robot for first robotics. the animation was a exact copy of our finished robot and was animated for award that we could win. so if a few high school students can put together a 2 min video using a replica of there robot that they are building at the same time and have it turn out pretty good 3 programers working on lfs shouldn't have any problem having more smoke come off the cars.

Quote from Forbin :

You're switching subjects again. We were talking about an ideal sim, not necessarily LFS.

Anyway, whomever led you to believe that LFS's drivetrain damage model was complete? That LFS was complete? It's a work in progress and the current focus is on the tires. This has been stated quite clearly by the devs.

they have clutch temp why not a trans temp where if its to high for to long it can let go and you lose the race b/c of it. lfs could be the ideal sim one day but with the attitude you have towards smoke and oil on track it doesn't sound like one you will like.

Quote from Forbin :

Sim racing is an environment that lends itself to a level playing field that is fairly difficult to acheive in real life. As such, skill is and should be the primary factor.

I've been in a motorcycle race behind a bike that blew a hole in its crankcase, dumping its contents on the track. Every effort is made by racing organizations around the world to mitigate those circumstances in real life. We have the opportunity to eliminate them, so why not?

A motor in a sim shouldn't just let go of its own accord, it should be because the driver was abusing it. Likewise for tires.

but parts fail. there will never be a car that nothing ever breaks, panels don't bend or windows break in a roll over. i can take a lfs car hold the clutch and run the motor at red line at 8000rpm all day long and the only reason it will quit is when it runs out of fuel. yet theres no water temp or trans temp.

Quote from Forbin :

So maybe a police simulator should only simulate what happens on the street, or during a police chase, or during a shootout.

The problem with a simulator becomes where to draw the line between realism and absurdity and the mass of idiots on the internet that you will inevitably encounter in an online game.

so its absurd to have tire smoke from a spinning car. yet having to do 2 laps to warm up tires so you can turn a hot lap then having the tires over heat after a few more laps isn't absurd. both are part of racing yet the first could make someone else who has better luck then flat out skill win a race. most races the best driver isn't the guy that wins the race. theres a ton of races where the leader after 150+ laps gets a flat tire or motor lets go and causes a crash that takes out 5 or 10 cars.