Quote from baSh0r :

Opel (Vauxhall) Astra F GSI

cheap reliable and cheap insured

No they're not! They're expensive to insure over here for a young driver lol.

Last edited by sam93, Fri 28 May 2010, 14:49.

Quote from ajp71 :

Then go and get a job working on cars then, if that's what you want to do. You don't need any qualifications beyond GCSEs to start working for a motorsport team, although some will be dubious about employing someone who has failed so badly at school. Once you're working for a team they'll often encourage you to go to a specialist college and do courses relevant to what they do, this will allow you to progress with a secure job, much better than doing general courses.



I've worked with people who have been to such colleges, they make good mechanics but don't seem to have gained much and certainly the brighter ones reckon they'd have been better learning on the job than attending a college doing a course like these.



You've not read what he said, nothing about designing cars and no guarantee of a job.

I have read what he said and knew that there isn't no guarantee of a job and I didn't ask him if I'll be able to design the cars.

He said that they're basically as good as each other and the amount of knowledge you get from either depends on how well you listen and learn from the lectures etc... How the hell can a BSc Motorsport Engineering Degree be a general course lmfao.

I'll get myself involved with a team after about a year so I know a bit then I can start building myself up.

Quote from Dajmin :

I have to sympathise that I totally screwed up my education too, so I know where he's coming from. If I had the ability to go back now and study something I was interested in (music or graphic design) I would do, but they wouldn't let me back then so I'm stuck where I am 15 years later. Let that be a lesson to you all At least portfolios appear to be more important than qualifications in both of my fields.

I like how passionate sam93 is about stuff, and you need that. But I have say that attitude needs reeling in some. Just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean you need to tell them to get lost. Take it on board. They might be wrong, but they also might give you the single most important piece of advice you ever get.
Everywhere you go people will criticise you; if you take it all that personally you'll spend more time getting yourself out of fights than doing the actual work.

I'm a pretty layed back person until annoyed. Takes a lot for me to get like that now-a-days. But, constantly on here, no one gives you credit, just critisism. You've gave me credit and critisism in a non arrogant manor. So I take that on board and give you respect for your words. If people on here gave credit aswell as critisism. There would be a totally different side to me lol.

Hopefully I'll get to where I want to though ay haha.

Quote from DevilDare :

Tristan, just dont bother... If he wants to let him do it... At the end of the day, its not you that will be stuck with the qualification.

Loads of people get qualifications and dont then use them later on in life.

Quote :

Sam,
Because Wiltshire College runs formula Ford card, most of our students who go into motorsport related jobs start with formula ford teams, although we have students working with touring cars as well.
As far as jobs are concerned, there are no guarantees of jobs at the end of any course. Individual students have to make opportunities for themselves or take advantage of opportunities that arise, helped by getting as much experience as possible, and getting themselves known – with the assistance of a bit of luck!
A BEng is an academic engineering qualification whereas the BSc is a more technology based qualification. Although at the same level, they are significantly different in content and nature. The level of knowledge that you acquire during your education is mostly down to you and how interested in the subject you are studying.
Regards,
Richard.

So... Straight from the horses mouth. I'll be able to do what I want to do. I'm happy with the course and thats all that matters to be honest.

Quote from ajp71 :

They'll teach you a little bit about fixing cars, though as you'll most likely end up as a road car mechanic you'd probably be better off doing a more conventional road car mechanic's apprenticeship.

What you're failing to see is that GCSEs are a qualification, they aren't meant to show how well behaved you were in school (although they often do), they show whether you understand the required grade of knowledge in the subject that a 16 year old should have (in your case clearly not).

A university degree takes A levels as the base and builds on them, it assumes you were able to cope and learn at the rate expected to do A levels in the usual two years. An undergraduate degree is a natural progression from A level so as a result a greater level of independence and rate of learning are expected.

The courses you are on about aim to take extra years to slowly bring you to the required level to enter uni, this is fundamentally flawed, because once you're at uni you'll be expected to work like everybody else, which you just won't be able to do. Not everybody can do physics and maths beyond GCSE level, even those who get A* struggle, my college refused to take anybody with less than an A (exceptionally Bs) at GCSE onto physics or maths, and with good reason. The idea that you can't even pass GCSE applied science (which is already dumbed down) and want to do what is an applied physics and maths subject is ridiculous.



They're next to a race circuit so you get hands on experience as a mechanic, on a course that is designed to produce mechanics, technicians and fabricators but not engineers. Silverstone also has a similar course, nothing wrong with them but don't expect to be designing anything or using them as a spring step to an engineering degree. Brookes also has a college tied to it (Cherwell Valley) and sells the premise that you can move onto to do an engineering degree, but the actual success rate of this is pretty much zero. There are plenty of engineering foundation years and most will be recognised by other unis, if you can't get on one of those give up.



In exceptional circumstances when it is accompanied by 4 As... not exactly Sam's situation.

I've said loads of times, I messed school up. I ****ed about in lessons and hardly listened. Hence why my results are shite! But I'm going the long run.

Make me a good mechanic? I doubt it. You haven't been there, seen what they do. I have done. So why don't you just STFU you stuck up ****!

Quote from ajp71 :

Brookes require 5 GCSE passes to get onto the foundation course, with two GCSEs you are going to struggle in life and I wouldn't bother trying to go down an academic route of any kind, go get a job at Kwik Fit or do a vocational course, it would suit you a lot better than trying to waste time and money either doing a meaningless foundation degree or actually managing to get onto a real course that you can't handle.

You're ****ing necky! I'll do what I want, whats the point in going doing a vocational course in mechanics when I know a lot more about cars than most 17yr olds! I've been working on cars since I can remember.

You all think its a pointless course, if it was pointless they wouldn't run it. You lot make me laugh tbh.

You should knuckle it ****ing down. Trying to make me feel small and you thinking you're better than me... PAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

You need to learn to grow up ffs. Stop thinking you're better than everyone, you'll piss a lot of people off in your life.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Yes, some universities will allow non-A-level and GCSE failures to do a foundation course (probably a two year course) before attempting the degree course.

It is possible to get into university, as a mature student, with no prior qualifications at all. It is possible to get a degree without doing any work (honourary - usually for celebrities).

But that doesn't mean that Bath Uni will be even vaguely interested in wasting time putting you on their course. You will have to do a good job in the interviews to convince them when you get there.....

He was a mature student and done the foundation year and is now on the actual course. Yeah, he says he struggles with the maths but it wont be easy.

I can always do all these BSc degree and then go and try to get a B/MEng. Nothing stopping me.

Oh, and who ever said this course just teaches you to be a mechanic, not exactly true. Thats why as you move up to each better course they start teaching you some bloody interesting subjects.

I can't see why people are saying these courses I'll be doing (BTEC FD+ND, Foundation Degree, Honours Degree in Motorsport Engineering) Is pointless and wont teach me nothing. If it was a pointless course I doubt Bath University would be interested in running their course! Says a lot aswell that this college is the only one in the UK with a college on a racing circuit. So yeah, totally pointless right?

It'll be good that I'll live very closely to Castle Combe so can always go down on a race weekend in the pits getting myself known!

Quote from ajp71 :

Without meaning to be harsh if you can't get As or at the very least Bs in GCSE maths and physics without trying then there is no hope of ever getting an engineering degree or working in any kind of motorsport design role.

A load of crap tbh. My mate who left school with worse GCSEs than me is now in Uni doing Mechanical Engineering with Composites. So it can be done, just have to work hard to get there. He didn't do any A-Levels. Just got distinctions in CAD/CAM (2 of them) and was then allowed on the course.

Last edited by sam93, Fri 28 May 2010, 11:29.

Quote from ajp71 :

Give up? From what you've said I see no evidence that you've started anything to give up.



That's all great until you try and apply for a decent job, employers ask for a sum of your GCSE grades or ask you the number of A*-C passes you have, answering that you have 2 GCSEs will get you immediately discredited from any interview, they can afford to be picky.



IIRC your dad works in salvage which is a pikey led industry and certainly isn't engineering, contacts help to an extent in engineering but people often mistake simply knowing people with effective networking.

My Dad doesn't work in Salvage thats for sure! Not going into what he does as its no ones business but he doesn't do anything pikey led.

I've lost my GCSE certificates anyway.

I haven't started anything? No not yet, my course starts in september, but yay ho. I'll reply later on, got better things to do like going out now haha.

Scared of smart people...? People will think I generally will think that I think I'm hard by this comment. But I'm not scared of no one, wont get no where in life being that way lol.

I'm very thick? How would you know? You don't even know me and if you have those thoughts about people and you think you're better than them, I wouldn't like to meet you at all.

I never give up, so can't see why I wont get to where I want to.

Can always bullshit GCSEs... I got told this by my mate who runs his own recruitment company, he redone my CV saying I have passes in loads of subjects.

Yeah, is my own doing but I wasn't the best in school as I had a firey temper and anyone who pissed me off would end up knowing about it which ended up getting my kicked out of one school and externally excluded a few times but I'm now paying the price which I accept. That is why when I go to College/Uni I'll make sure I do everything to the best of my ability as my anger/temper is now sorted and the college know about the way I can be like and perfectly accept it and still got accepted onto the course.

I was good at coursework but didn't perform as well in the exams... I was getting As Bs and Cs on my coursework but shows I didn't revise when it came to my exams which wont happen again. The college course I'm doing is aimed at getting people onto the course who don't have good grades and you get extra qualifications in Maths and Science so it then makes up for the grades I've been told.

We will see what happens at the end of it. This college helps you get a career at the end of it also so is great. But I can always go so far and then go to Brunel Uni and get a good degree in Motorsport Engineering. I can always turn everything around.

It's getting your name out there now-a-days. My Dad gets phone calls all the time with people asking him to go work for their company as he is top notch at what he does which is all experienced based.

We will see when the time comes I suppose.

Quote from DevilDare :

Truth is, they probably are.

Good luck talking to an employee with that attitude and language.

I wouldn't talk to them like that lol. I'm totally different when working.

But when you apply for a job and have everything they ask for and then you get a reply with, you have the qualifications but not the experience so we can't take you on... How often do you get that.

So yes, you need a degree but you also need someone willing to take you on to get the experience.

My cousin just finished a degree is Science, no one will take her on as she has no experience.

****ING LOL!!! Employer will really care about GCSEs when they see experience and degrees layed out infront of em they'll really care.

I got a double D in applied Science and a C in Maths, my predicted grades were all Bs Cs.

I'm not exactly thick by no means.

I obviously will end up being really smart at the end of it as I'll have to be. But I hate these smart people who think they're a lot better than most people.

I wasn't asking for anyones opinion on my course... Started asking about car and like every thread on this forum goes off topic

Obviously you have to be smart once you work in a race team. I meant that you shouldn't have to be really smart at first once you're starting to get the qualifications.

I'm saying that every type of person should be given the chance to get qualified. I'm starting from bottom and working way up that's how keen I am

I'll deffo ask race teams as it'll be an actual real answer and not what people on here think when they probably haven't tried...

I've read the success stories people have had doing just these courses I'm doing and they have got into btcc/wrc/ff/f3/gp2 etc...

So it can't be crap and pointless what you people are making it out to be

Quote from P5YcHoM4N :

You're under the illusion that a course means it'll do what it says on the tin.

Do you think doing a degree in The History of Ideas would get you anywhere in life? No is the answer to that question, yet people still apply for the course.

It is a Mickey Mouse degree for kids who aren't smart enough to do Mechanic Engineering and the like.

Finally you answered my question on how to get to f1.

The car question was just something to start off as track days as I'll need it to get around in also. Nothing to do with helping me get a job or progress through the course with. Just something to do in spare time.

Trying to get things through some of you is like getting blood out of a stone lmao

Quote from P5YcHoM4N :

You're under the illusion that a course means it'll do what it says on the tin.

Do you think doing a degree in The History of Ideas would get you anywhere in life? No is the answer to that question, yet people still apply for the course.

It is a Mickey Mouse degree for kids who aren't smart enough to do Mechanic Engineering and the like.

You can be smart but shit at the job. I'm not very smart but will be better than the smart twats. I hate people who use the stereotype you have just used.

I'll get there and I ****ing will.

Ffs instead of asking you lot I'll go to the actual race teams and ask.

I'll do the foundation course where I'm going which will be in 3 yrs and then take me 2yrs to complete after that I'll go to Brunel well try... Or try to get in after doing a national diploma in motorsport.

I want to be assembling and setting up the cars with a bit of development. So I think what I'm planning on doing is the right path.

I wouldn't mind having my own company doing bespoke car tuning. So of I can't get into a racing team that's what I would do.

Tristan, you're making it out what I'm doing will get me no where, if it didn't get you no where no one will be applying for the course

Tristan I said I learnt from my mistakes and like I said won't piss abot no more.

My bestway of knowing what I need is to contact these teams tbh

I'm wanting to design the car/engine but yes I am also a hands on person as I'm also good with my hands.

I'm asking what qualifications I need to do the things I listed to get an idea what I need. I know what I want to do... Design and build the parts of the car with maybe the oppurtunity to be a mechanic on a race weekend as I'm sure all the people there in f1 in the pits working on the car are engineers and during the week some of em work on making the car better.

So yeah, I want to design and build the race cars

Quote from DevilDare :

It all depends on what you really want to do (Specifically. Not eitehr that, that or that). At the moment it just sounds like you want to work in GP2/F1 just because, well because its F1, which is not a very good mindset.

No I wont to hit the best career I can. I've been interested in cars all my life. And want to build and design race cars. It's my dream, not just because it's F1. It's like promitions in work, you attempt to reach the best position you can!

Quote from tristancliffe :

Oh... you want to BUILD cars? As in become a motorsport grease monkey? Yeah, a diploma or BSc in anything vaguely engineering based will be enough up to around GP2 level. But you said you wanted to design/make racing cars, and that's a much grander profession with much much higher requirements. Lazy or thick people need not apply (I haven't for instance).

And a crap car can win championships 3 years in a row - against other crap cars. It's not Formula Student (you said Formula Ford), but it won't be in British or Club Formula Ford either.... Is it one of the Combe Championships that the rest of the world doesn't bother paying attention to?

I dont know what championship they enter.

What qualifications will allow me to work in F1 either setting up the cars, repairing them and designing building em. I imagine would need a BEng in Motorsport Engineering then, which I Would get from Bath Uni?

Quote from DevilDare :

If you like it, you do it. Something I have learnt myself is to never follow your friends and most of the time ignore what others are saying about your path. If it drives you, you go for it. Simple as.

Also, you're a perfect example of dicking in school. Yes you had a good time and a laugh in school and ignored the lessons and all that, but look now how you have to pay for it. If only you knew, eh?

I'm going to follow what I want to do.

Yes I did mess about in school... Got kicked out of one school is year 7 and was never one to listen. Always having a laugh and getting into a bit of trouble for fighting. But learnt from my mistakes and now paying for it having to take the long route. Going to make sure I revise now though when comes to exams as I never have done before lol.

Even if I manage to get into a race team and they go bust... Set up own company tuning cars etc...