Quote from filur :

FFB is poor, it does give the feeling that you're somehow connected to the car, but not that the steering wheel is in any way connected to the wheels.

theres a value in your .plr file which changes this to some degree
the comment about it says something about how much you feel the front tyres grip through the ffb (cant be bothered to look it up atm)
according to some post at rsc if you set it to 1 the ffb will come solely from the fron wheels if you set it to 0 solely from the rear wheels ... defaul is at .6 iirc

crappy canned ffb ? hell yeah

Some people are having problems, but so far the demo has worked smoothly for me. The UI is similar to GTR, and I've clicked through the menus quite quickly without glitch. I really like the simplistic approach taken by LFS, but GTR2 isn't bad. I find it easier to navigate than rFactor.

Setup took about 2 minutes, selecting my controller buttons, switching it to simulation mode, turning the mirrors on and turning all help off (except for auto clutch). Beyond the GTR2 configuration utility and an nVidia sli profile, I haven't played with video settings.

The frame rate performance is actually, for me, similar to LFS and with a grid of cars, slightly better. At 1920x1200 and Vsynced to 60, I get a solid 60 in single car time trials. This is with DX9 or DX8 and with AA set to level 4. I've not tried the rain extensively, although it did slow a little. As I wasn't impressed (beyond a few pretty effects when watching the replays) by the rain implementation, I can imagine I'll stay away from that option anyway.

With DX8 and a grid of 15, starting from the back, I had about 50-55 fps until the grid spaced out a bit. With DX9, it dropped to about 40 at the start, but was still running smooth. This fairs favourably with LFS, which can dip into the 30s at the start. I'd probably stick to DX8, as it looked fine, and I'm not in huge need for the extra lighting effects.

GTR2 may be making more of my hardware than LFS - I didn't see a huge improvement in LFS when I switched from an Athlon 3200+ with Radeon 9700pro to an Athlon64 4400 X2 with 2x geforce 78000GTX sli. Most other games run way better on my newer system, and LFS probably gained the least. This might just show how well LFS runs (and is optimised?) on lower end systems.

Apparantley ua7service.exe is part of Securom. I normally end it and anything else I don't want before opening games. Is my computer being locked up deliberatley by the copy protection? May explain my sudden freezes on the meu screen. As retarded as GTL demo shutting the computer down.

Quote from Rob76 :

Some people are having problems, but so far the demo has worked smoothly for me. The UI is similar to GTR, and I've clicked through the menus quite quickly without glitch.

ive clicked on exit about a hundred times expecting that it will take me back to the main menue instead of back to windows
might just be a problem for players used to lfs though

Quote from ajp71 :

Apparantley ua7service.exe is part of Securom. I normally end it and anything else I don't want before opening games. Is my computer being locked up deliberatley by the copy protection? May explain my sudden freezes on the meu screen. As retarded as GTL demo shutting the computer down.

i havent got a ua7 running atm so my guess is its on your pc because of another programm not because of gtr2

I will add something as well.
The graphic with which they were teasing so much is not as impressive as I was expecting.It run smooth on my system at 1024*768 with full details,DX9(what kind of effect of DX9 GTR2 actually using thats a mystemry to me as I saw some nie DX9 effects already in other games),and 8xAA+16AF.I think they could qwork with Dx9 much better.

The cars moving on track a bit weird nothing as realistic as LFS.I would say its far from perfect.I like however moving of the car when you are in the cockipt.Seems quite realistic in this area.

FF - someone might like it but I hate it.I dont fee like in LFS that the car has actually some grip on track.Its sometimes like moving on "ice".With LFS I feel like every kg of the car. The FF in GTR2 demo is more like effects then actual input from car.
I like the menu music and also the sound of the cars.In some situation a bit of lack of turgue feeling but not as bad as I was expecting.

Adding 2 quick screenshots:-)

Quote from Shotglass :

ive clicked on exit about a hundred times expecting that it will take me back to the main menue instead of back to windows
might just be a problem for players used to lfs though

I thought it was pretty much the same as LFS. Click Exit in GTR2, and it asks something along the lines of whether you want to exit to Windows. Click exit in LFS and it also asks if you want to exit the program.

Quote :

i havent got a ua7 running atm so my guess is its on your pc because of another programm not because of gtr2

Me neither - I wouldn't be impressed if it left something running all the time....

Quote from DEVIL 007 :

....
The cars moving on track a bit weird nothing as realistic as LFS.I would say its far from perfect.I like however moving of the car when you are in the cockipt.Seems quite realistic in this area.

FF - someone might like it but I hate it.I dont fee like in LFS that the car has actually some grip on track.Its sometimes like moving on "ice".With LFS I feel like every kg of the car. The FF in GTR2 demo is more like effects then actual input from car.
....

I agree - I've never really liked how any of the Simbin or ISI cars have appeared to move on the track. They just don't really look like they're in contact or interacting with the ground. I think this is where LFS is one of the strongest sims - GPL also looked pretty good in this area.

In car, GTR/GTR2 always felt pretty good in terms of how the cockpit looks and moves. I don't like the limited look left/right actions, but otherwise the feeling of being in the cockpit is very good.

The FFB and the actual feel of the car is, I think, quite good compared to other ISI based sims, especially rF. GTR was quite good, but had the odd seemingly random spin factor built in. GTL was also quite good. It felt quite 'floaty' but that might have been the older car's handling. It still is not close to LFS in terms of being able to perceive the car you're supposed to be driving. In this sense, LFS is again one of the strongest sims. nKp also has good potential here, but has a few querks that hopefully will be ironed out if the dev didn't run with the money.

Quote from DEVIL 007 :

The FF in GTR2 demo is more like effects then actual input from car.

thats because it is all effects
isi games calculate whats happening to the car at a given moment in time
rear sa >> front sa => play the oversteer effect
front sa >> rear sa => play the understeer effect
etc

btw concerning those effects first thing you should do in any isi game is open the .plr file and set anything that sound remotely like engine and vibration to 0

Quote from Rob76 :

I thought it was pretty much the same as LFS. Click Exit in GTR2, and it asks something along the lines of whether you want to exit to Windows. Click exit in LFS and it also asks if you want to exit the program.

so far so good but if you move down the menue tree in lfs the exit button changes to a back button which it doesnt in gtr
i much prefer those tree based approaches to the same level approach of gtr

Quote from filur :

http://youtube.com/watch?v=dWyyHGMJ6mc

o rly?

Yes really As I said cars fly strange in both games. In LFS aswell as in GTR2. But I didn't see a car fly away crashing with 3 kph into a wall ...

But this really isn't the point. The point that really really hurts for something called simulation is :
if you crash with over 100 kph or even over 200 kph hard into a wall in lfs, you just drive to your box and in a few seconds your car is again ready to race.
In some cases you need to push space to magically get your car back on the tyres.

And this is really bad for a simulation in my oppinion. Completly realistic kind of flying is more kind of a graphical gimmick and very very hard to achieve ...
And it would be sooo damn easy to implement it. Just do the same to the car as if no fuel left, if it crashes with a certain speed into something. Easy to do and would do the trick until the damage system is better ...
It would add a lot of realism just like free starts would ...

Quote from Shotglass :

so far so good but if you move down the menue tree in lfs the exit button changes to a back button which it doesnt in gtr
i much prefer those tree based approaches to the same level approach of gtr

I see what you mean, the buttons for options, control, etc. display items in the same level as the main menu's window and the Exit is still available. The 'exit' only becomes 'back' once you select a game mode.

I guess I didn't notice as it didn't catch me out. I set my options in the first few minutes of running GTR2 and hadn't needed to look at them again (yet).

in the demo is it possible to get rid of the ugly jet black color?

Quote from Rappa Z :

in the demo is it possible to get rid of the ugly jet black color?

?

My cars show up completely black. What do your cars look like?

Quote from Rappa Z :

in the demo is it possible to get rid of the ugly jet black color?

Do you meant the track? It is quite dark, especially when using DX8.

[edit] Nevermind, I see you mean the cars. I don't have that problem.

See attached for how it looks using DX9 AAx4 (haven't played with in game video settings)

I don't have that problem I do have a problem with the thing crashing on the menu screens. Got the 'ring working but with only 25 fps. Was starting to consider buying it again (or at least playing this demo offline with more cars + tracks ). 3 reboots later and I've decided (again) that if SimBin can't write a stable UI then I'm not interested in this.

I think i'll re-download the demo, in the meantime, is there another reason for this?

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f392/11011/blackout.jpg

P.S.- the glass is also missing.

Propably old drivers.
[Edit] GFX-card drivers, that is.

Vain

god, everything is fine but the dam skin. Oh well, time to delete GTR2.

Tried different Dx versions?

Not really worth the hastle anyway

I really really do not like to have to say this but...


... why are you troubleshooting GTR2 problems on the LFS forums?

btw does anybody else but me find the graphics rather underwhelming ?
the track has very little detail the textures arent particularly high res and the rain effect seem like its exaggerated a lot
it does look better than lfs but nowhere near as good as youd expect it to
one thing is better than lfs though is that the graphics doen suffer as much at low aa settings than lfs does

Quote from RIP2004 :

if you crash with over 100 kph or even over 200 kph hard into a wall in lfs, you just drive to your box and in a few seconds your car is again ready to race.
In some cases you need to push space to magically get your car back on the tyres.

Simple answer to that is that because damage in LFS is unfinished. It's an excuse for it being crappy currently but also the truth. Though I agree that the sudden moonflights sometimes after a minor touch with other car should be fixed immediately no matter how unfinished the damage model is. Space button doesn't work practically... every online server has probably turned that option off.

Still downloading the demo but what the **** you're saying it looks cartoonish? Play LFS on some FE RallyX (I've always found FE to be kinda cartoonish looking track) server with 20 colourful and pinky UF1000s and think again which game looks more cartoonish? (for the record: I like LFS's rather realistic, not too overdone looking graphics and how it runs well even on my low-end system with FSAA turned on)

Just had a 20 lap race round Hockenheim 99 in a 550 and I gotta say I like this game.

The AI are decent too, they actually pass and block pretty well

After probably 5 or 6 hrs behind the wheel today, I've decided that I don't like it. Go into the .gdb file of Barcelona and change the DryGrip value to 0.9. It feels like the old GTR engine with a bit more low-speed grip, but still not qutie right. The new engine has more grip thrown in EVERYWHERE thrown in to mask its issues. The thing about LFS patch S/T/U, is that grip was thrown in in the right places. This isn't the case with GTR2. Ok, ok, maybe I'm being a bit harsh, it has improved with the low speed issues but the fact that GTR2 times are already 7s a lap faster than their RL counter-parts says something. And they'll probably drop another 2 or 3 seconds a lap.. GTR1 times were a bit slower than the times currently being done in GTR2 AFAIK, so that just shows they got somewhere with the engine, fixed it up to the extent that its low speed issues are sort of fixed up and realised that it's still not quite right. Then they threw more grip at it all round to mask it up.

That's what I think anyway... its an obsolete tyre physics engine.

Also, what's up with the suspension? It feels like the response is delayed or something... you expect something to happen as you do something and at first it doesn't happen (this a matter of a tenth of a second at max) and then all of a sudden it reacts more vicously than a bull. I think that'd be down to the frequency at which this data is analysed.

Well, it looks like a cartoon, feels like cardboard, and is generally crap in my opinion. The cars have almost no feel (which is more than GTR), so everytime you touch the throttle or a kerb it's random what happens. The cars don't slide realistically, and steering inputs are ignored unless you've been really nice to it and bought it flowers. The sound is good insomuch that I can't hear the missus talking to me (), but otherwise sounds the same as GTR/GTL/rF.

The wet weather just amplifies the lack of feel, and it quite simply awful.
The crashes are a joke - the cars just translate rather than move realistically.
The pitcrew are laughable - perhaps £3 was spent on the animations
The menus are crap.
The dirt on the windscreen is a selection of alpha images, and the change is sudden.

Sinbin won't be getting my money I can tell you that. Crap of the Year award goes to...