Sorry that I'm not actually reading the entire thread, but I noticed people mistaking something for drifting A LOT just by page 4. Fast drivers in rwd cars do push their rear ends out a little through the corner, but the tires aren't actually sliding. What they're doing is maximizing the slip angle of the rear tires in order to obtain maximum grip. (The more slip angle you can obtain, the more grip you'll get from that tire.) And slip != slide, the slip angle is the angle the tire patch is actually pointing at relative to the centerline of the wheel, an effect created by the flexing of the sidewall and the deformation of the tire's rubber as the wheel rolls along the ground. AKA if you can actually manage to turn through the corner and you're on a solid surface, grip is always faster than drift.

And I started out with drifting in LFS back in the s1 demo days but got bored after a while. It can be fun, but I found I prefer the competition and the "high speed chess game" you play while battling with traffic. I'll still occasionally go on a drift server every couple months, but for me now it's when I want to relax compared to racing.

Last edited by rcpilot, Mon 20 Nov 2006, 06:57.

I also drove the wheel view for probably the first year I played LFS, just one day decided to try in-car and realized I could still judge the car's dimensions well. Also people give you less of a 'wtf' look if they see you playing and it's a car's cabin instead of a couple of wheels floating on the road.

Quote from richo :

To my mind it has to be a better option of using your superior car speed to overtake them after the corner rather than trying to stuff in the inside ,alot of ppl (Me too) get quite nervy about being overtaken by the faster guys, like trying to stay out of the way to the extreme and making it worse.

The other fact is that were all racing and nobody like to concede a possy just cos your clearly faster doesnt mean its a given that you should get an easy pass,if its a blue flag situation then thats completely different but if not than i,m afraid you will have to work to get by..

One last point unless your driving from the cockpit veiw you only have one virtual mirror so its not as easy as you think,thats not to say that i cant hear someone close by.

I do see the nerviness a lot, tend to see people go flying off the road after a pass even giving them maximum room to play with by staying completely to the inside/outside. Usually happens though if you make the pass at the entrance to a set of corners, forget that the person might not have the abilities to drive close together side by side through a set of sweepers and squeeze them more than they're comfortable with.

Quote from Tweaker :

Come on, is this just so Core can have good chart results in the LOTA league??? eughhhhh

Eh, I think this means there are now 8 core drivers in the LOTA league and only 5 are allowed per a team, so I think starry and I will just be racing as individuals.

Quote from banshee56 :

You do have a repretoire of sarcastic comments, don't you? If so, you're good.

Eh, at certain points about 75% of what comes out of my mouth is sarcastic.

Interesting to finally be on a team, hope to have some fun.

Not trying to toot my own horn, but often when you're lapping someone you're coming up on them REALLY fast. So it's either you sit behind them for a corner and drive slowly to gauge how they corner after rushing up on them, or you attempt a pass move and hope that he realizes that you can easily pass him through the next corner. I don't think anyone in real racing would be forced to slow down when they see a possible passing maneuver on a lapped car, it's on the lapped car to give up the corner once a pass is started.

And having a yellow with someone spun out on a track is perfectly ok, the OP was complaining about people rejoining/moving their car across the track after spinning out with traffic coming. Really aggravating to see a hole and try to drive through it and then the spun out car starts moving into your hole. I'm not asking anyone to do anymore than what I'd do, last league race I went off and waited for a gap in the pack to show up and gave up 7 positions, when if I felt like being annoying I could've tried to merge right away with traffic coming.

Last edited by rcpilot, Wed 25 Oct 2006, 19:31.

I use a joystick most of the time and I do fine. :P There isn't a specific set for a joystick considering you have the same amount of control with a joystick as a wheel. I'd recommend setting your x-axis to steer, back on the y axis to brake, and the throttle for well, throttle.

The main issue you're probably having is you're trying to steer full lock most of the time, LFS is set by default to a 1:1 steering ratio. Meaning if you tilt the joystick half way you're at half lock, so you really have to control your steering input. AKA, would you take a normal corner in your car irl with your steering wheel turned all the way over?

Last edited by rcpilot, Tue 24 Oct 2006, 19:38.

Going to end up with the first LFS related deaths. :P

"An avid online sim player died earlier this morning from a heart attack after racing for over 96 hours straight, it is believed the death was caused by overdosing on amphetamines in order to gain a competitive advantage."

Quote from wheel4hummer :

Do you drive formula cars alot? Your average fuel economy is 5.3598566666666666666666666666666666666666666667 MPG!

My average mpg is 4.94 mpg, I really need to find some way to race a civic in LFS. Costing me mondo invisible dollars.

The reason that you're sliding in t1 is your downshift into 2nd and where it's placed. (That corner can be taken in 3rd in most setups I've tried anyway, same with the final chicane.) Besides that you really need to make everything a little more fluid, AKA what I'm seeing is brake, turn, accelerate, turn, accelerate, instead of one fluid mix of inputs throughout the corner. Another thing is when you're hitting curbs you want to be driving as straight as possible, this prevents the snap oversteer of riding up on the curb. I'm not saying that you should try to drive as straight into the curb as possible, but when you're actually riding over the curb the car's balance should be near neutral. Also on the final exit curb from the last chicane, you can eat as much of that curb as you want and just drive straight over it in this track/car combo. Finally, this would be the truly hard thing to do at this point, when exiting the high speed slalom you should be hugging the final apex and then go wide for the entrance to the chicane. I say this will be the hardest thing because you'll need to heavily manage your braking to make it into the entrance. What I do for that corner is aim for about the center of the track aiming for the outside curb when I start my braking, and then continue going towards that outside curb until I can turn right into the chicane, all this while under braking including the final turn in for the chicane. My PB on the track/car combo is 1:00.78 under race conditions with no draft, so I have a decent idea about the advice I'm giving.

Last edited by rcpilot, Thu 14 Sep 2006, 17:11.

If I join a race I'm in it to win it and I'm going to grab the fastest car possible, I'm overjoyed if there's a race for the win but I'm not going to cripple myself just to get a race.

Quote from Electrik Kar :

I'm trying to digest some basic rules of racing atm. Here's what the AAL (Australasian Leage) says about blue flag situation at the chicanes...




http://www.australasianleague.com/rules.html

I'm not sure if this is a universal racing rule (are there any universal racing rules? I'm seriously asking) but hopefully it can help your case a bit.

Anyway- try to have fun

That doesn't really make sense, if I'm in a race with someone and I see an opportunity to pass in a chicane, I'm going to do it, same with someone who's blue flagged to me. And if someone comes up on you and you're blue flagged before a chicane it's better for both of you if you get out of the way because you're only going to lose about half a second giving up the corner compared to both of you losing a second+ if he's close enough to make a move in the chicane. And I'm not about to lose easily a couple seconds to some people following behind them when they could've just let off the gas. I'm not saying that if someone's going to meet you at the exit of the chicane that you should let them by, but if they're right on your butt or even sometimes along side you they should be let through. Especially in situations when you see someone make up several car lengths on you in the last corner.

I'm not trying to be an ass about it, I'm only asking that other people show the same respect on the track that I do when under a blue flag situation. If I can potentially get in your way and I'm not in my own battle, I'm going to do everything I can to let you by without slowing you down.

/Edit - And please people, do NOT come out on track mid-race around other cars, whether from the pit lane or coming back on track from an accident. Especially from the pit lane, I'll stop and let a pack by at the pit lane exit even in situations that I know that I'm faster than most of them. Do you people who kamikaze out on the track not look both ways before crossing the street?

/Edit 2 - My final angst rant, if you're spun out on track at the exit of a blind corner with other cars coming and you don't have a way to drive off the track without driving across it, either stay put or shift+s back to the pits. Moving your car to a different position when the other driver has less than a second to respond to you is not a bright idea.

Last edited by rcpilot, Wed 13 Sep 2006, 19:42.

I'd have to say the chicane in south city, it's the one corner that will kill your race 90% of the time if you get it wrong while pushing it because you'll most likely end up going high speed into a wall with almost no room for correction. While you might say it's just a dangerous corner, I'd say it's tough because of the level of perfection you have to maintain to keep yourself safe while other dangerous corners you really have to screw up in order to take yourself out.

LFS definitely taught me a lot about driving, and I think helped a lot when I bought my first rwd car in the middle of winter when it came to keeping it on the road. I wouldn't say it's going to teach you how to go and do hotlaps the first time out in a race car, but the things it teaches you about handling the balance of a car definitely apply irl. Microsoft Flight Simulator 95 taught me how to fly r/c aircraft, LFS taught me how to drive.

/Edit - I did notice a version of the tendency that other people are noticing though. If someone's about to cut me off on the road in a way that's even close to racing aggression I'll have to quickly fight the urge to return racing style aggression. It doesn't help that I've done as many recorded miles in LFS as I've done in my current car.

Last edited by rcpilot, Wed 13 Sep 2006, 18:26.

It's a little tricky, considering at a certain point you're just being an ass by blocking on a straight. (You've just spun out and someone's closing on you by about 30 mph, seen that happen a lot.) But it can also be done as just simply a racing move, like tricking someone into going to the very edge of the track and getting in front of them at just the right point to force them to back off a little to keep position going into the next corner. Useful in situations where you know that someone's going challenge you no matter what, but using this you can at least keep them alongside you instead of letting them gain the advantage into the corner. Swerving and multiple blocks are a no-no though, and changing your line under braking is also usually considered bad.

Last edited by rcpilot, Sat 15 Jul 2006, 11:09.

It's all about working on your line like crazy until you've figured out a way to get those precious tenths, and then lapping over and over until you get that perfect lap. :P (Mostly just aggravating because you usually have to push so hard that you get rid of the safety buffer you normally use in a race so restarts are quite frequent.)

Something's definitely wrong with setup or driving style if you're burning the r3's up that fast. I haven't found a track yet that'll burn them up in anything other than a long stint. Just try to obtain as little lock-up as possible and try to manage the throttle well enough to use the TC as little as you can. And it's usually better to enter a corner a little too slow than too fast considering you can still get a decent launch out of the corner coming in too slow.

Crash.

Nah, they haven't covered it but I'm fully aware that this method of data collection isn't the best. I have varied my sources of responses a little bit, but considering each person only need 30 responses total, the accuracy of anyone's data for their paper is subpar at best. This basically comes back to the fact that the class is a GEC. Not sure if the term is the same for you guys, but a GEC is a general education course, aka you have to take a few of them to become a more well-rounded student, but they don't apply specifically to your major and aren't as serious/difficult as a necessary course.

/Edit - One more potentially serious problem with blanketing my normal forums is the fact that I had a total of 3 females respond to the survey, and one of those was one of my flatmates

Last edited by rcpilot, Thu 9 Mar 2006, 07:49.

Quote from hrtburnout :

I see, no-one has filled in one

Thank you I'm not trying to stir up a debate, I'm just trying to get some of these filled out so I can write my paper.

Eh, I had a choice of 3 topics and this was the only one that was interesting to me. Other 2 choices were connections between video game violence and real life violence (the dead horse that has been beaten to a bloody pulp) and opinions on a potential ban on smoking in public places in our state.

The paper is specifically on the topic of teaching intelligent design and/or evolution in schools. I'm just looking for correlations between being in favor/against the teaching of either and different groups of people. What I'm referring to in the question "Intelligent Design is creationism presented as science" is whether or not the person believes that intelligent design is an attempt by christianity to get creationism back in public schools. I've heard this viewpoint a few times and I figured that was the most objective way to
ask that question. Technically, yes, creationism covers many religions/beliefs, but what I'm specifically referring to is the christian idea of creation. It is a good point though, but I can't change it now because I already have some answers to the survey.

Nah, anyone can answer. Technically I could get by with just making up the responses and not get caught, so it's not that serious.

I'm collecting survey responses for a paper I'm writing in my sociology course. The class is just a GEC so the survey's not too long, and thanks in advance to anyone who responds.

1. What is your gender?
Female
Male

2. What is your age (in years)?

3. What if any is your political affiliation?
Democrat
Republican
Independent
Green
Other (please specify)

4. What, if any, is your religious affiliation?
No religious affiliation
Protestant
Catholic
Jewish
Muslim
Buddhist
Other, please specify

5. On a scale of 1 to 10, how religious do you think you are?
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
Not at all Religious Extremely Religious

6. What is your level of education?
Grade School
High School
Some College
College Degree
Graduate Degree
Other, please specify

7. Do you believe the theory of intelligent design correct?
Yes
No

8. Do you believe Darwin’s theory of evolution and natural selection correct?
Yes
No

9. Should both intelligent design and evolution should be taught in schools?
Yes
No

10. Do you think that only intelligent design should be taught in schools?
Yes
No

11. Do you think that only evolution should be taught in schools?
Yes
No

10. Intelligent Design is creationism presented as science.

Strongly Disagree Disagree Neutral Agree Strongly Agree

11. Evolution is flawed, and cannot be used to explain the varied life forms on our planet.

Strongly Disagree Disagree Neutral Agree Strongly Agree

12. Evolution only explains what happened after intelligent design took place, and as such the two can be taught together.

Strongly Disagree Disagree Neutral Agree Strongly Agree

13. What is your opinion on the scientific basis of intelligent design?

14. What is your opinion on the scientific basis of evolution?