argh, yes inertia.. i was thinking that and writing friction, friction is pretty constant (heat and tollerances taken into consideration).
that's what i ment, when you look at racers in T1 for example u can tell apart the ones that are braking properly cause the nose doesnt rise while blipping, but nosedives are there when a driver doesnt blip (i.e. uses the "engine braking") and he hasnt been using the brakes at 100 % before that.
ofcourse it can, i never said it couldnt be used - but u missunderstood, in icy conditions when u touch the brakes just slightly they will lock almost right away, and if you just put it in 1st gear and drop the clutch they will slow down but you will have some steering control. in the dry conditions you are already using the brakes, that's why i said there's no reason to do it in the dry - cause brakes can be used to their limits
i also tought that thing with the intake valves not opening was silly but i've read and seen somewhere that camshafts can move out of position (to some extent that's how VTEC works).. but i guess that would be a bit idiotic.. apologize for that
but i was concentrating too much on the fact that i was sure it wasnt the compression that is the cause of engine braking 
i dont think so.. when the engine is coasting there is almost no compression beeing made, cylinders are running almost on vacuum with intake vales beeing steady and exhaust valves opening slightly. what you are using to slow down is: let's say you're on 6000 rpm in 6th gear, start braking and downshift without a throttle blip, the engine has already started to slow down - it had some kinetic energy on 6000 rpm, and that energy is going down, also taking into consideration the rotating mass of the flywheel and the clutch assembly.. when the clutch reingages it will spin that mass once again, and the thing that opposes you is friction, not compression.. because there is almost no mixture in the cylinders it's just like in idle operation, ECU recognizes that, and it will not add any gas mixture when the engine starts reving up. ofcourse some compression will occur but that will be minimal, not 12 or 13.5:1 like it usually is. so, the actuall spin up of all the moving engine parts will cause the kinetic energy from the driven wheels to be dissapated in friction and following heat..
yea, i use it on some tracks around hairpins and such, aston national with fzr for example, the downshift from 3rd to 2nd gear is done without the pause and the rear wheels actually start to slip to some degree, making the car oversteery but just slightly and still keeping control.. but that's all in the timing and it takes some laps to get it down.. but from any other gear it's pointless (like from on braking and downshifting from 6th to 5th to 4th.. then it's just unstable).
omg. i love when people start talking about stuff that they have no clue about. do you even know what a gearbox is or what the purpose of it is? if there was not engine on the other end, your "fast downshifting" would get u nowhere. it's the ratio of the transmission (size of one gear in regeards to the other) that will in fact transmit the torque from the rotating wheels to the engine - engine not liking that, will rise in rpm but unnaturally. so you are using the wheels to rotate the engine parts. the transmission/gearbox losses are minimal. so it's engine braking. plz dont use argument fallacies, it only shows your level of knowlege. also if you read anything i wrote above you would know, IF u are braking at 100 % there is ABSOLUTLEY NO ROOM for any more speed retardation, and braking at 100 % is the only way to brake.
and about your "try braking without downshifting argument", i actually did that to prove another person who was arguing the same crap wrong. i placed cones at the ends of my braking lines in a quater mile drag race, the fastest way to stop is clutch + brake with no engine friction added, but that is not usefull in racing since you have to have the power for the exit (but it's the fastest way to bring a car to a full stop. clutch + brake - used for panic stops in real world). next fastest way of stopping was proper downshifting with blips, then it was just leaving the car in gear, and then it was engine braking with car sliding all around trying to brake loose. the differences were 1-3 m all in all, but going 3 m deeper into a corner on a race track makes the difference.
plz dont argue just for the sake of arguing, you will not prove me wrong because i think i'm right, it is because that is the factual state of things - either learn how to brake properly or live in an illusion of "engine is helping me to stop".
and about your "try braking without downshifting argument", i actually did that to prove another person who was arguing the same crap wrong. i placed cones at the ends of my braking lines in a quater mile drag race, the fastest way to stop is clutch + brake with no engine friction added, but that is not usefull in racing since you have to have the power for the exit (but it's the fastest way to bring a car to a full stop. clutch + brake - used for panic stops in real world). next fastest way of stopping was proper downshifting with blips, then it was just leaving the car in gear, and then it was engine braking with car sliding all around trying to brake loose. the differences were 1-3 m all in all, but going 3 m deeper into a corner on a race track makes the difference.
plz dont argue just for the sake of arguing, you will not prove me wrong because i think i'm right, it is because that is the factual state of things - either learn how to brake properly or live in an illusion of "engine is helping me to stop".
Last edited by scipy, .
that's right. as i've said, if you are on the limit while braking THEN engine braking is pointless. btw to comment on that part "when you lift you are engine braking" - not really, you are coasting, and yes it will slow the car down more because of the added engine friction and rotation of the gearbox parts etc - but (at least in croatia) that is not defined as engine braking.. engine braking here is to shift down a gear and slowly "drop" the clutch so that the car nosedives and slows down more obviously - and sadly it's actually MANDATORY to do it in driving schools and on the national driving license test.. so even i did it 3 times during the test (3 times is the minimum or u fail). as soon as i got to my car, heel and toe downshifts all the way.
to comment on the "upsetting the balance", if u squeeze the brakes on hard, on the G-meter circle the ball would go all the way forwards, and there it should stay until the time for turn in. now, if you are at the edge of the circle (say 1.15 G for street tires) and u use the engine braking, the wheels are gonna start locking up - doesnt mean huge lockup and slide - just locking up slightly (obviously by how much rpm u missmatched) - and that will cause the imbalance, weight is gonna shift forward, car will nosedive, there will be no weight at the rear (which can be a really bad thing if ur already at the turn in point). on the other hand, if you are braking @ 0.9 G and then add engine braking, ok... in that moment ur gonna experience maximum retardation of 1.15 G, but that only means u werent braking on the limit before.
one more thing about brake temps and taking care of them. there is no reason to use engine braking for that. IRL race cars, u pick the brake pads and the discs that can handle the temperatures. so if you are on a track with elevations and many slow corners with a lot of braking - harder and more fade resistant pads. also on a proper race car, you should read out your brake temperatures and then set the brake cooling duct to the size that will keep those temps in the optimum range (let' say not let them cool down below 350°C). once again, engine has nothing to do with it. engine is for the opposite G on the circle, the one for positive acceleration.
please people. dont be stupid. lfs is a sim and u cant break the gearbox per say, but that's no reason to use it for slowing the car down, btw you're not actually using the gearbox, it's the engine friction (and not engine compressions as it's popullary belived).
what you are actually doing (if you are using the engine for braking) is hindering accurate brake modulation and balance - i.e. ur not braking properly or on the limit. IF you are braking on the limit, adding the engine friction will only cause u to lock up and lose traction - not a desired effect. the reason for rapid downshifting is the sequential gear change (u have to go trough all the gears from 6th to 2nd), if you are in your real life car, ideally u would shift maybe 2 gears down or even 3 at a time, but not like 6th to 2nd or 1st (well shifting to 1st is best done from a gear not requireing a cross-gate shift - but that's just due to gearbox design). the reason for downshifting is just so that u can be in a proper gear for the corner exist (in the ideal rpm range for max torque bla bla).
next time u use the engine for slowing the car down, remember u are beeing stupid and scipy said so. you are only upsetting the balance of the whole car and not using the brakes effectivley. btw when u downshift u better be blipping the throttle to match the engine rpm with the gearbox rpm - so the car doesnt nosedive - if you are doing that, then ask yourself why to **** would u be doing that if u wanted to use the engine for braking. i am sick and tired of stupid and ignorant people: this actually include real life car mechanics, real life race drivers, my dad, his dad, my friends, their dads, many "street races" i know and most of the sim world. i am also sick and tired of false arguments that my dad gives me: "i've been driving for almost 30 years and i've been doing it like this". <- THAT DOES NOT MEAN U ARE DOING IT RIGHT. the whole car industry prays on stupid people who are braking their engines and clutches by using them for what they have not been constructed.
p.s. i am studying to be a mechanical engineer (2nd year now)
p.s.s. engine braking can be used in snow or ice conditions to make the tire rorational speed lower then the relative speed of the car so that u can keep some kind of control over steering.
END OF DISCUSSION
what you are actually doing (if you are using the engine for braking) is hindering accurate brake modulation and balance - i.e. ur not braking properly or on the limit. IF you are braking on the limit, adding the engine friction will only cause u to lock up and lose traction - not a desired effect. the reason for rapid downshifting is the sequential gear change (u have to go trough all the gears from 6th to 2nd), if you are in your real life car, ideally u would shift maybe 2 gears down or even 3 at a time, but not like 6th to 2nd or 1st (well shifting to 1st is best done from a gear not requireing a cross-gate shift - but that's just due to gearbox design). the reason for downshifting is just so that u can be in a proper gear for the corner exist (in the ideal rpm range for max torque bla bla).
next time u use the engine for slowing the car down, remember u are beeing stupid and scipy said so. you are only upsetting the balance of the whole car and not using the brakes effectivley. btw when u downshift u better be blipping the throttle to match the engine rpm with the gearbox rpm - so the car doesnt nosedive - if you are doing that, then ask yourself why to **** would u be doing that if u wanted to use the engine for braking. i am sick and tired of stupid and ignorant people: this actually include real life car mechanics, real life race drivers, my dad, his dad, my friends, their dads, many "street races" i know and most of the sim world. i am also sick and tired of false arguments that my dad gives me: "i've been driving for almost 30 years and i've been doing it like this". <- THAT DOES NOT MEAN U ARE DOING IT RIGHT. the whole car industry prays on stupid people who are braking their engines and clutches by using them for what they have not been constructed.
p.s. i am studying to be a mechanical engineer (2nd year now)
p.s.s. engine braking can be used in snow or ice conditions to make the tire rorational speed lower then the relative speed of the car so that u can keep some kind of control over steering.
END OF DISCUSSION
i watched the whole thing.. sorry now, 30 min i will never get back.. i mean the guys marriage fell apart because of sim racing? and if in 16 or so years u didnt make enough money to buy a N class car and race some events monthly.. u should really think again. and the "oh man, yea man feelz great man" comments.. omg. quit while ur ahead.
you should really make the limit a 1:43.00 lap (or lower) under old patch... imo.
hi, the program seems to have a problem with displaying central european characters like ć, č, š, ž etc.. if you could fix that or.. maybe i'm doing something wrong.. here's the example of what i get:
http://www.stovatelji-bicepsa. ... _0.30.8_results_race.html
first name on the list should be Miloš Miljković etc..
http://www.stovatelji-bicepsa. ... _0.30.8_results_race.html
first name on the list should be Miloš Miljković etc..
oh, sry 
i tried searching for "notifier" and simillar stuff but came up empty.. i'll check this one out
i tried searching for "notifier" and simillar stuff but came up empty.. i'll check this one outLFS Notifier (for Victor)
hi,
I had this idea for quite a while, reconsidered it many times, but i would still like to suggest it. What i think would be usefull is a LFS Notifier, if anyone ever used Gmail Notifier, u know what i'm talking about. Now, i know that there is Live Alerts in LFSW but that requires constant checking and u have to be in the browser window. What LFS Notifier would do is just put up a little popup from the system tray and tell u that one of your buddies is online and where (maybe give u an option to join via join2lfs). Another thing, i would like for the Notifier to have it's own buddy list and not the one from LFSW. In LFSW i have over 100 buddies in the list, most of them drive stuff i'm not interested in etc. So it would be great if u could add separate buddys in the notifier, and if the proggy could tell you which combo (car/track) they are currently driving online. Maybe even if you could limit the car class for which u are notified (classes from inside LFS), so you pick GTR and add some buddies.. if they are online driving GTR's u get a notification..
Tnx in advance, scipy.
I had this idea for quite a while, reconsidered it many times, but i would still like to suggest it. What i think would be usefull is a LFS Notifier, if anyone ever used Gmail Notifier, u know what i'm talking about. Now, i know that there is Live Alerts in LFSW but that requires constant checking and u have to be in the browser window. What LFS Notifier would do is just put up a little popup from the system tray and tell u that one of your buddies is online and where (maybe give u an option to join via join2lfs). Another thing, i would like for the Notifier to have it's own buddy list and not the one from LFSW. In LFSW i have over 100 buddies in the list, most of them drive stuff i'm not interested in etc. So it would be great if u could add separate buddys in the notifier, and if the proggy could tell you which combo (car/track) they are currently driving online. Maybe even if you could limit the car class for which u are notified (classes from inside LFS), so you pick GTR and add some buddies.. if they are online driving GTR's u get a notification..
Tnx in advance, scipy.
not to rain on everyone's parade.. but the global ballast system needs to be modified.. u need to be able to remove all the weight from fzr and xrr, otherwise.. all the current setups we have, can be pretty much thrown away. it needs to be made a server-side feature, so a league that runs all 3 gtrs can enable it, and maybe even put different weights (80 fzr, 30 xrr) etc, depending on which cars are running.. i dont know if this is possible already, but i havent seen it in server options..
scawen, i was just wondering, could u add another option to the "small map display", it really helps that cars behind u more then 1 lap are in grey, but for masters of endurance and such races, it would be nice to have a car that is more then 1 lap in front of you in let's say red, or which ever color... so if u are catching up (car in front is probably gonna pit or something, if it's slowed down) so u dont force an overtake.. just an idea.
I am quite experienced with windows and I did shut down all of the stuff in the applications list, including antivirus, yproxy etc.. only the internet connection "monitors" were left (and sound speaker icon).. i will try hackerx's idea and get back to you.. if that does not reveal the problem, I will post screenshots of the task manager.
did u not read my post? it still happens after all of the programs are shut down..
LFS keeps jumping to windows [NOT A BUG]
hey,
I have a problem, lfs keeps jumping to windows (desktop) when ever some program has a msg (like nod32 updated, torrent download complete, icq msg, gmail notifier, rasmaster reconnecting).. it's not that it jumps to window mode (like shift + f4) it just minimizes itself and I loose control over the car.. when i click the icon in the taskbar it goes back. Now, most of you would say that the logical soulution would be to shutdown all programs.. well I tried that, and when there is no apparent program that would cause this problem.. it still jumps to windows.. this can happen like every 10 min or every 30 min but it is ANNOYING (last lap.. 1st position and then i hit a wall cause of the stupid "jump to windows")..
if anyone has any idea how to make LFS "always on top" please help.. my friend had a similar problem, and next time he formated his hard drive it went away.. but i'm not formating so plz keep spining some solutions.. thanx.
p.s. (it's not just in online gaming, it happens in single player, even if i'm just in the menu..)
I have a problem, lfs keeps jumping to windows (desktop) when ever some program has a msg (like nod32 updated, torrent download complete, icq msg, gmail notifier, rasmaster reconnecting).. it's not that it jumps to window mode (like shift + f4) it just minimizes itself and I loose control over the car.. when i click the icon in the taskbar it goes back. Now, most of you would say that the logical soulution would be to shutdown all programs.. well I tried that, and when there is no apparent program that would cause this problem.. it still jumps to windows.. this can happen like every 10 min or every 30 min but it is ANNOYING (last lap.. 1st position and then i hit a wall cause of the stupid "jump to windows")..
if anyone has any idea how to make LFS "always on top" please help.. my friend had a similar problem, and next time he formated his hard drive it went away.. but i'm not formating so plz keep spining some solutions.. thanx.
p.s. (it's not just in online gaming, it happens in single player, even if i'm just in the menu..)
LFS keeps jumping to windows
hey,
I have a problem, lfs keeps jumping to windows (desktop) when ever some program has a msg (like nod32 updated, torrent download complete, icq msg, gmail notifier, rasmaster reconnecting).. it's not that it jumps to window mode (like shift + f4) it just minimizes itself and I loose control over the car.. when i click the icon in the taskbar it goes back. Now, most of you would say that the logical soulution would be to shutdown all programs.. well I tried that, and when there is no apparent program that would cause this problem.. it still jumps to windows.. this can happen like every 10 min or every 30 min but it is ANNOYING (last lap.. 1st position and then i hit a wall cause of the stupid "jump to windows")..
if anyone has any idea how to make LFS "always on top" please help.. my friend had a similar problem, and next time he formated his hard drive it went away.. but i'm not formating so plz keep spining some solutions.. thanx.
p.s. (it's not just in online gaming, it happens in single player, even if i'm just in the menu..)
I have a problem, lfs keeps jumping to windows (desktop) when ever some program has a msg (like nod32 updated, torrent download complete, icq msg, gmail notifier, rasmaster reconnecting).. it's not that it jumps to window mode (like shift + f4) it just minimizes itself and I loose control over the car.. when i click the icon in the taskbar it goes back. Now, most of you would say that the logical soulution would be to shutdown all programs.. well I tried that, and when there is no apparent program that would cause this problem.. it still jumps to windows.. this can happen like every 10 min or every 30 min but it is ANNOYING (last lap.. 1st position and then i hit a wall cause of the stupid "jump to windows")..
if anyone has any idea how to make LFS "always on top" please help.. my friend had a similar problem, and next time he formated his hard drive it went away.. but i'm not formating so plz keep spining some solutions.. thanx.
p.s. (it's not just in online gaming, it happens in single player, even if i'm just in the menu..)
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG