Quote from dawesdust_12 :

Maybe it's all Vic's fault. He receives the patches in the mail, uses the envelopes for rolling papers and forgets about the patches. Maybe there's 100 USB keys at Vic's place with S3 on them

That could be the case...but we'll never know since we're kept in the dark about everything.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Scawen stopped giving us updates because of abuse by a few.

To this I say, toughen up.

Because silence has cost him his livelihood.

All game devs have experience of this, you get flak mixed in with the good, but you get flak by saying nothing too. Scawen saw this as lose lose and decided not to bother, but that just alienates the supporters. It was win lose, and silence is what has killed off the community.

It's amazing how little it will take to undo the damage. But he'll need thicker skin.

What you call 'abuse' anyone could simply call 'typical internet troll times'...or like I mentioned, just people who are critical of the development process and progress because they love LFS so much they can't get enough and want more, more, and more.

To let a minority of users ruin everything for everyone doesn't make sense..it's borderline childish, imo.

"Wahh User A, B and C criticized my work so User D though Z can **** off."

Quote from Bob Smith :

The join date refers to when you created your account on lfs.net; the forum join date is not displayed. You could not create account until Jan 2003, hence everyone who was active for the six months prior to this typically has a Jan 03 join date.


Fordie, they shot themselves in the foot here. The devs take their product too much to heart, and didn't like to read negative things that were posted in reaction to their progress statements, or patch release dates (and their slipping). So they said less and less, which made debate on what was said that much more intense, that the vicious circle reached silence. Little and often would have been much better, and with broad shoulders. You have to understand that their will be users that will rant and rave; the only solution is to basically ignore them, and only listen to the well written criticisms.



Things may have changed in the past couple of years but last I heard, this was their only work (Vic excluded).

That said, it has now reached the point where I would be very surprised if this was still the case. Scawen repeatedly says there will only be news when there is something of newsworthy to say, and refuses to mention anything that may get scrapped (again, due to prior user backlash). It has been so long since we saw evidence of meaningful progress, that they cannot be spending near the same hours working as they once did (assuming that progress would eventually be reported).

Scawen has proved himself a good programmer but community management has not been his forte on this project, and he has stated he intentionally does not run LFS as a business, which I think worked ok to begin with but, as we have evidenced, is not a model that is working in the long term, sadly.

If actions speak louder than words...? I guess there would have to be action.

Just my opinion...but if they take their product 'too much to heart' then you think they would be attempting to keep some of the buzz going...instead the faucet is almost shut off from our prospective.

Complete silence and zero transparency isn't a way to separate people from their money, and that's really the bottom line here. Hard to recommend a this to others in it's current development state because it's stagnant. When I do, people judge LFS by its cover, and it's cover has become dated. Yes, graphics aren't everything...but when you compare it to other offerings that have become available, LFS sucks. The only thing LFS has going for it right now, again this is my opinion, is its physics.

I could go into the simple things that were talked about ages ago but never implemented, but that's a dead horse.

Anyone who's been around since RSC remembers the 'energy' that once was this place...that's long gone.

There's quite a few who eagerly await the next big update...me being one of them...but it's becoming more difficult to be excited. Just feels like I'm getting my hopes up at this point.

Backlash shouldn't scare developers off, it should drive them...only people who get upset about stuff are those who are passionate about something. To have that kind of user base that wants LFS to be THE BEST is pretty awesome...and instead of coddling the community that pays/payed their bills it seems like they just shit on it by playing the 'silent game'...

They way the devs have started to handle PR is silly and confusing. They would probably benefit from someone handling their PR for them since Scawen isn't that great at it...it's a pretty big turn off.

my ride made 327hp on the stock fuel pump/returnless system before running out of fuel...going to fix it

engine ran out of fuel at 7-8psi...time to ditch the stock returnless setup and go return...hooray

Quote from Scrabby :

What power does it make? My eye has spotted turbo

I don't know yet...made 140hp at 35% throttle around 3000rpm while I was getting the ve tables dialed in enough so I could drive it home. I'll be shifting at 6500..

I'll post numbers when I get em...been busy with work and haven't had time to wire the wide bands 5v out so I can actually log at wot.

Quote from logitekg25 :

amps to power that are very expensive, especially ones that are slim/efficient.

battery

big 3 (and other 0 gauge needed)

digital wiring cant be cheap

sound deadening/dynomat etc

it adds up, but 10k might be a slight exxageration
the cost of the speakers isn't even half of it.

you have no idea what you are talking about...zero

Quote from Victor :

I didn't expect this to be an issue at all :/

When there isn't much to blow out of proportion...it's the little things, lol.

Quote from Intrepid :

I don't like innovation, product advancements are stupid.

That's what you just said....but with different words.

Quote from Victor :

I wasn't thinking of a 486 or PIII when I wrote that, but something more realistic like my own E8400 that still runs everything I need to and more. I have no desire to upgrade it any time soon.

Thank you for clarifying.

I've been around since you guys were still on RSC...I don't race online much but I have countless hours playing by myself...LFS is my 'Solitaire'.

Last thing I want to see is LFS being limited by old hardware...that alone would put it behind the curve compared to what else is already on the market.

Quote from Intrepid :

words

it's obvious you're a fanboy, and that's fine...

also obvious you like to stifle innovation...because that's what's being done by pandering to old legacy hardware...

Quote :

Driving simulation games are only now really coming into fashion

yeah, no...try again.

What 'mega' pc's are you talking about? I can build a dual core system with 4GB of RAM a "decent" video card for ~$400...

I can find similar systems at big box stores all day long for the same price...and sometimes cheaper...

Example: http://www.bestbuy.com/site/De ... 5323144&skuId=4673045

Last edited by Homeless_Drunk, Thu, 22 Mar 2012 21:09.

Quote from cargame.nl :

And.. I have the idea that even if everybody has new machines it still stays a challenge.

I'm not going to disagree with that...it would still be a challenge...but...there would be less limitations to deal with and more room to play with...

After what Victor said my expectations for S3 were just lowered...

Quote from Intrepid :

I might be being bold here and presumptious, but one of LFS's major selling points is its amazing ability to run on low-spec computers. Many a time has LFS come to the rescue when I have installed sims on people's computers.

Now, you may think it's business sense to basically narrow your customer base so much you might go out-of-business, but I don't think Scavier are that ... in your words.... 'dumb'.

Welcome to technology. It advances. They already got their money for S1 and S2, if someone has to upgrade their computer to run S3...big deal. That's the way PC gaming/simulations work.

Should I be mad if X-Plane 10 doesn't run on my PIII 450Mhz? No...because that's just how things are...

In the back of my head, I knew that's what a lot of the hold-up was...and Victor just confirmed it...that's comical.

Quote from Victor :

I'd like to insert an actual fact into this thread : http://www.lfs.net/?page=rockingham

As you seem fairly misinformed about what we do, here's a summary :
-LFS is not a normal business. We are 3 people who went away from normal business to do things our way.
-We don't have deadlines. Things are finished when they are finished.
-This indeed leads to long development processes some times. This wasn't always the case - you should've been here in the earlier years ago when there was a stream of updates every year.
-But now LFS has developed and matured a lot - it has many many features that people asked for and honestly aside from modding, what is there you cannot do with LFS now? I'm just saying Scawen has worked his nuts off to accomodate everyone. (still feel like we owe you anything? What more does 24GBP buy you these days? Honestly?)
-Now we want to take LFS to the next level by upgrading the physics. I guarantee you, you have no idea of how difficult this is. Give everyone a giant CPU and GPU and sure it's fairly easy to develop a super accurate racing sim. But you know, it doesn't work like that. LFS needs to run on slower machines as well. So shortcuts to better physics need to be found, without producing weird side effects. You go and try that. I wish you all the luck in the world.
-Now the question remains, couldn't we have released the scirocco and rockingham anyway? I guess that was possible. In hindsight at least. If we would have known it would take so long in advance .. but we didn't. There still would have been a big delay in new releases then though, while physics were worked on, so the question remains : what would people be asking for now, if sci and rock where already released 4 years ago.
There is no use in releasing them sooner now though, because Scawen IS working on the new physics and him taking a break to work on releasing new content will only delay the physics .. again. That stuff needs to be done. It needs to get out of the way. Scawen needs to be able to tick that off his list. Then that incredibly difficult part of LFS development is done and "simple" stuff can be worked on again. We can't wait to get on with regular development. There are still so many things we want to do!

Yeah, that bold part sucks. If someone is pissed that a game developed to today's standards doesn't run on their 486/33, tough shit.

So everyone who can't afford a computer that has hardware that's circa-2008 is holding back development?

Multi-Core is a standard today.
2GB of RAM is a standard.

That's just silly. So the part of community that doesn't want to upgrade their stuff, or can't afford to...is making development painfully slow...that's what you said...and that's dumb on many levels.

Quote from Tomba(FIN) :

post your boot thread

My truck doesn't have boots.

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

Everything except for the turbine you mean?

lol, you mean i need more than just that?????!!!!

I had a .63 a/r...wasn't big enough so I upgraded to .82

welp now i have everything...i excite

Quote from RiseAgainstMe! :

I still prefer something that can be controlled to some degree by the governemnt, rather than by the rate of gold production and how much people want something shiny, which are mostly random.

...by control you mean...continue to print more and dilute the **** out of it's value till it's valueless? yeah...sound pretty awesome.

Quote from logitekg25 :

in person it must not be too bad because everyone i ask says it looks 'professional' whatever that means..before i do that, there are a few places the RCA cables are running too close to wires with alot of power through them making a faint whine that goes away when i wiggle it in a few places. fine tuning then making it pretty..

it looks far from professional...

there's no wire organization outside of an abundance of zipties...

if an accident were to happen that thin piece your amps are sitting on won't hold the force and everything in your truck will be a jumbled mess...not to mention your trunk is useless now with those amps sprawled out...good use of space, lol.

did you secure your boxes or are they just resting in there?

you didn't even trim your speaker wire so it's the correct length...it's an eyesore to see the excess zipped in loops...

do yourself a favor, take a weekend, and re-do it correctly...because you'd win no prizes for that mess...

Quote from Nathan_French_14 :

Neat car, but please sort out your wiring for the subs and amps. Theres not much worse than messy wiring!

yop

Quote from Mustangman759 :

durp lol

...thing is, it's not really funny. it's a serious state of affairs.

Quote from Scrabby :

to maintain some kind of back pressure.

...pretty neat.

"stupid air, stay in my engine"

I love our country, but fear our government.

What a disgusting group of people.

Sickening...

Let the rest of the world laugh at us some more as politics dig our own grave...

So tired of this "republican" vs "democrat" bull shit. No one cares what's right for the people anymore, only about what's right for their political party and their own best interests...seee-yuh freedom.