in phisics by definition pressure is only for gases/fluids it has the metric of force/area but its measured in pascal (and it is defined as "the air pressure at sea level"), for gases has no meaning talking about force, only pressure.
about your hands you simply apply a "force per area" (that is also not uniform), but that cannot be called pressure by definition
maybe now i understand your whole question...well the F9 readings i think are the contact area of the tire, in the entire discussion we used those readings to see how the weight (load) of the car distibutes over the tire regions
pressure is by definition a gas/fluid thing, on tarmac there is "force" not pressure...well there is the pressure of air, but i don't think that's what he intended
EDIT: he inverted the force and pressure concepts (using force for internal air, pressure for tire against tarmac), so the reasoning should be the exact opposite as he did
i totally agree!!!
nobody expected that the patch was perfect, if something has to be fixed it's better now that hotlaps are just started, than erasing them after that many people spent many efforts in hotlapping challenges
i mean that from graphics it seems to me (i can be plain wrong) that the contact part is stratching, like if the outer part disappears
i meant: outer load > central load >> innner load (considering high deformation/displacement)
if you ever "played" with a tire out of its rim you could have experienced that the contact part is very hard to deform, the sidewall is very easy
yes, i considered, but i think i should repeat tests being sure to avoid these effects to have a more objective result
actually it is, but could also be easy modeled with a fictional incremental tire pressure that varies with speed...imho its irrelevant to our discussion
having only 3 sections is not an issue to me, more will only mean more accuracy,what i say is taht it seems to me that the functions behind the three sections are wrong or wrongly tuned.
about sidewall effect on tire load, that is what it is wrong, it's definately excessive, especially for a wheel with small rims like the xfg
what can i say evidently some people live for charts/stats, i agree it's no fun or honor to win like that, i always preferred an enjoyable close clean fight, rather than a lonely victory, also following a faster racer teaches a lot of things, while waiting behind a slower one on a difficult to pass track teached me a lot on how to prepare a safe pass...i guess those people don't even know how much fun they are NOT having
my concerns are that if this is true int lfs tire model (as it seems to be) its sadly wrong, because even at very low pressures (let's say 1.6 or 1.7 bars) those effects, must not show at all, but it must rather be "simply" pressure/compression problem
your considerations about shift-l data and guesses, seem to confirm a graphical thing: the tire seems not to displace, but rather stretch...if it really so (in lfs) then the problem could be that the inner part is not deforming, while in RL the displacement of inner part makes the inner part "lift" even at very low pressures...considering that the central part of a real tire is the biggest and the least deformable, it always have much more load than the inner part (let's remeber -> when cornering...)
the point is that when cornering even at quite low pressures (let's say 1.6 bar) the normal situation is (A) with the new patch at almost every tire pressure the tire load while cornering is (B), which is phisically impossible.
and please consider that (B) into lfs is much more exaggerated, here i made it small for clear purposes.
also if you put much negative camber and do some fast laps you will see that is not the left part that heats up but only the right one and that's another very odd thing because of a bad discrepancy inside the lfs tire model (that wasn't so with the previous patch)
it's "just" (mainly) the biasing of the function that relates pressure to tire load; in previous patch was almost correct, now it's always working as the tire had a very very very low pressure.
what makes it really odd is that the function grip/pressure has totally opposite bias comparing to reality, so basically it is no longer possible to find even fictional settings in lfs to make the car behave like in real life
"interesting" that you say i'm wrong about lfs tire phisics because i'm not in the top charts of formula cars...moreover, fast has nothing to do with phisic knowledge (strange that nobody asked me to prove i'm fast when i graduated as engineer or when i passed the exams for inscription at the professional engineer's book...), moreover "easy" not = "fast", moreover i'm talking about xfg, moreover if you see my old stats, you will see that 50% of races i was on the podium...i think it's not that bad for a girl like me who spend only few hours per week at lfs...
if you can prove that i'm wrong please humor me...
sometimes i saw three guys doing a dirty team tactic:
the first go faster as he can alone, the second and the third crash everyone's trying to pass and on straights they put one behind the other using slipstream BUT the third instead of passing the second it bumps him to get both higher speed, but as i said if someone is fast enough to catch them they will crash you, each race they switch roles...
thank you for taking the time to actual test it and answer honestly.
actually recommended pressure for an xfg like car is 2.0 bars, 2.2 is the maximum recommended.
this patch feel much more unrealistic on road tires because this huge problem with the new deformation model joint with previous problems (unrealistic maximum grip at very low pressures + unrealistic temperature/grip model for road tires) make this patch very weird and this only problem of deformation cancels the others huge improvements of this patch.
i really hope scawen talks a bit more about the tire model, so that feedbacks can be more precise and constructive and better let's all hope that the recent agreement with intel/sauber/bmw/michelin opens the doors of more technical data to lfs also for road tires.
it happens at very low pressures when pressure is comparable with other forces and the tire model is much more complex and as i said that's not the case i'm talikng about, even at slighly low presures it must not happen
i'm talking about road tires not slicks, i precised it from the beginning
infact i repeated many times that my guesses came from the F9 info wich are representation of the dynamic tire phisic model of lfs
from the inclination of cars on screenshots it seems that they were taken at high lateral G
i believe that when you drive into traffic you and other people are not driving at maximum G, compare your usual driving with a similar riding into lfs and watch replay with F9 info
you are right! the pressure/grip relationship is still as before or even worse (with road tires), what has become even worse is the new deformation model that requires the maximum tire pressure lfs allows to get phisics behave less unrealistic, put also that the temperature/grip relationship on road tires is still wrong and you got this ugly unrealistic patch.
for slick tires it all seems good (but i dont have real experience with slicks) and i guess it because of BF1 (i assume michelin gave the devs the telemetry data for slick tires)
if you read my posts or even just one of them you will see that i already doen the tests you suggest, how funny that everyone's says i'm wrong but nobody dare to take some test and discuss about the results, moreover none seems to take care of the real screenshots posted above, all real picture show evidently even at the most first view, how the lfs deformation is wrong -> causing huge phisic unrealism.
i'm not sure i understood well what you say, but as i said in the other thread: take xfg put 2.2 bar and 3.5 camber (in RL you would never do such much) and drive around BL or SO at 50 kmh with F9 info and tell me if it is absurd or not
actually is the contrary: it always show up too evidently in normal conditions, that's why i'm spending so much words, everyone is caught by the "BF1 fever" and nobody is testing the slower cars...the few glitches in tire phisics are ruining this patch wich is at 90% a huge improvement