Quote from plehto :

Fuel consumption won't resolve the issue.
At least in the moe test race fzr was so much quicker that after less than 40minutes it had made a gap large enough to make a pitstop and still return to the lead.

And this is why i said limit maximum amount of Fuel it can take on board. What this should do is increase the amount of times the car would have to pit.

Quote from MAD3.0LT :

lol i dont know what car ur talking about but im running a T03 garret on a RB30ET and it has a stock wastegate and when i uped the boost it came on stronger and earlyer then when it was set to 7 now its set at 13 PSI

U can allso set boost to build differnlty with a good boost controler not a bleed valve like i use

there could be reasons for this.
wastegate tends to open a little before boost max boost is reached. if in your previous setup u were relying on the wastegate spring for boost settings and then switched to a manual boost controller, spool time would decrease becase MBC eliminate pre open.

Quote from MAD3.0LT :

i agree this would be a awesome idea but then u have to take into account of the car's spec's IE

with lets say 650cc injectors running on a TO3 garret HF'ed u will get 15/17 PSI befor the turbo OR injectors are maxed now if u can edit the boost where will the limit be? most stop turbo cars cant run more then 12/15 PSI on stock turbo's cause the turbo and fuel system wont cope with the extra load

and as for turning up boost = faster spool time ill give u a example

say u run ur car on 7 PSI and it hits that at around 6,000 RPM if u up the bost to 15 PSI its gonna hit 7 PSI way befor 6,000 RPM and 15 PSI at about 6,500 RPM so in a sence it spools up quicker but to get to its max power it will take longer but will have way more power in the end

what is the logic of the turbo all of sudden reaching 7 psi quicker. when u up the boost the only thing u are changine is when the wastegate opens

don't u just love when u hit post and it deletes what u wrote

i did a quick test in terms of fuel consuption.

the XRT with my current setup did 2.4%lap.
The Xrt at 19PSI did 2.7% a lap

Wider scope
Normal XRT 5 laps = 12%
XRT@19PSI 5 laps = 13.5%
Normal XRT 60 laps = 144%
XRT@19PSI 60 laps = 162%

Spool speed isnt determined by how much boost though.
Thats determined by how the turbo is engineered and camshaft timming

Quote :

I've always wondered why people would want to do this? Why wouldnt you have it running at maximum all the time?

I think what hes trying to say is he would like to change the aspect of the turbo that affects spool time.

Fuel Comsumption might go down.by what degree am not sure. i remember i used LFS tweak to see what the Difference is but i don't remember the results.

In the real world when turbos spool the boost increases exponentially. LFS dosent current model turbos right i think. If he increased it it could basically turn his throttle into a on off switch.

Its also a little tricky to to drive them. IE u lift off the throttle and all your boost goes bye bye. so unlike a NA where the engine response to slight touches of the pedal

after looking at the stats on that tracker the difference is clear.

what about the other things i suggested. it looks asthough the major advantage in terms of strategy that the FZR has is the fact its tire wear and fuel consuption are equal.

How do u see a rule like the FZR cannot have more than 65% or 50% Fuel affecting the situation.(I think this would give the slower cars the ability to get higher in the poles through the means of strategy) but i guess this number depends on the track.

For the record i did read the whole thread before.

the reason for me posting was to understand the situation more. i never intended for my opinions to be held over anyone with the full game.

As i said before my comments came from the fact i never saw any detailed discussion on setups on this site. And i concluded that there must be a particular advantage theyre not exploiting{setup wise}.

Has anyone tried making a setup thats main goal was conservation so to speak. Setting up the car to stay out as long as possible. they FZR times should slowly get worse as times goes on. thats what usually happens in real life. Just curious (not trying to be sarcastic) what was the result if anyone tried.
//clearly this would not work in a 5 lap race.

Maybe a change in the cars isnt needed. As the game continues to be developed(aerodyn), it might slowly even out. untill then maybe u guys should add your own retrictions.

Limit the amount of fuel the FZR can take.
Limit the final drive.
Limit tires to the ones with the least grip.
Limit tire preasure.
i don't think there would be anyway to enforce it online so i guess if there was a community based standard for slight retrictions. Everyone who wants a good race between the two cars could abide by it

Everyone just keep attacking the fact that i am a demo racer

well maybe innovation is too strong of a word in this situation.
basically i was just trying to say there isnt enough discussion on the developement of setups. Having someone send u a setup dosent count.

I personally dislike the sharing of setups its really pointless to me since not everyone is using the same wheels or configurations.

Quote :

From my experience I've noticed this: an FXR with the fastest setup possible for a particular track racing against an FZR (also with its own fastest possible setup) will lose to the FZR's superior speed and acceleration every time despite its own excellent grip and handling, assuming that each driver is equally skilled.

what kinda setup are thease. are they time attack(hotlap) setups?.

How does this situation pan out after serveral laps 40-50 in terms of fuel consuptions and tire wear.

i would imagine the FZR would eat its tires faster and slow down a bit and be more likely to spin.

how long does it take an fzr to lap fxr.

just curious, i can't imagine its as unbalanced as u guys make it seem.

the key word in that sentence was "seems" as u can see am demo racer so am just giving what it looks like from the outside world so to speak.

am sure the GTR in question has some sort of advantage that u guys could exploit.

Quote :

What we do want is cars that can compete with each other given a series of different races at different tracks. We want a situation in that car 1 is the fastest at track A, but slower than the others at track B and again a different situation at track C. That way we hope to see more of a variety of cars being used. And mind you, I don't give a damn about the usual punters running AS National with 5 lappers all day, I'm thinking organized events.

why not be faster in different sections of the track.

Quote :

I challenge your, or anyone for that matter to build setups for the FXR that gets it as quick as the FZR on any track (keeping WR time in mind). If you make it, I'll pay you 500,- EUR.

i guess it really depends on what type of race it is. From what i read on this forum, it seems the FzR seems to be powerfull 400+hp RWD and the other is awd not so fast. on a track with alot of complex turns the FXR should have more consistency, if u made a setup that exploits that should be able to win.

What i am getting at is, I havent seen any inovations in setups.

U guys are acting like babies. What is the point of having the cars if they same are all very similar. seems to me that as soon u loose a race u blame
it on the car being faster.

It seems to me you guys arent taking advantage of the specific advantages of each car. Only reason i say this is because, i never see any talk on setups on boards. Seems everyone just goes and downloads what they think is a fast setup.

instead of asking the devs to make u faster how about u learn to improve setups.

I like how all u guys get pissed off when he compares it to NFS. personally I don't think any racing games/sims are realistic.


They are a bunch of unrealistic things about LFS.
1.99% of the cars arent real
2.None of the tracks are real


Even if someone created an Xrt and blackwood you would be crazy if u think u could jump in the car and pull a 1:25.

Why must they be even. I think Each car should have its own specific aspect as which it excels at. Very even cars tend to make races very boring.

If it were up to me i would have a RB GTr and a rally one. i mean how long can it take make both versions.

Equal cars isnt gonna be the way u get Tight close racing everyone is looking for.

Why are u guys so keen on having the cars completly balanced

Quote from tristancliffe :

I've paid £36 to LFS.
I've paid, in total, about £200 for wheels (I broke lots in the 'early' days)
I've paid £250 for ECCI pedals
I plan to pay £60 for a DFP to replace my Momo but only when I can afford...
To buy a FREX kit for it, at around £100 but that needs me...
To buy a small racing wheel to mount, about £90 from Demon Tweeks.
Then I'll upgrade my PC a bit probably, but I won't count that as it's not only to do with LFS.

I think LFS has been worth it

damn lol, i just hacked a xbox mad catz stearing wheel
yea is good for u, just saying some people like my self don't feel its worth it yet. was almost convinced in buying it when the BF1 came out

Developers should be improving the game to the point where the game justifies the spending of the money. As of now i don't think LFS is at that level.

limiting the demo as means of getting people to buy it is the wroung way to go about it. Developers should be improving the game to get people to buy.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Scaleable tyre & fuel usage has been a feature of numerous games over the years but for some reason has never become a mainstay, which is a shame, as I for one have always enjoyed the ability to do a "quick" full length race.

Now that the single seaters can run for stupidly long stints without a pitstop it could be used to bring some strategy and fun back into the class. Over in the OWRL we do 1hr races and pit stop strategy used to be a major part of the race, now the thought of doing a pit stop in a race under 90 minutes is ludicrous - you only pit if you get damaged.

It's a shame, strategy is a fun and integral part of racing but LFS seems to have patched itself out of having any strategy.

I'd like to see scaleable tyre wear & fuel usage in the game, set at server side and announced in the F12 dialogue along with compulsory stops.

Failing that i'd at least like a gameplay concession in the Fox - nobody seriously races those things for 3hrs ... give us a 1,2 or 3 stop strategy decision on a 1hr event again please !

Everyone Seems to hate Strategy

i meant what is the logic that i am going to run the same setup as everyone else?

Quote from Gabkicks :

this is pretty much why because there's an "optimum" set for each track so most people would end up using the optimum settings anyways. so whats the pt?

where are u getting that
there isnt!!!!!!!!! its no different thatn suspension setups in that manner

it would be nice to know in what areas?

Quote :

For the record, a lot of people have actually suggested that the road cars shouldn't be as adjustable as they are and I agree with that. LFS road cars should have some adjustability (they never drive on actual roads after all), but the options available right now are just a tad excessive imho.

There is no reason why the shoulnt be ajustable

Quote :

here HAS to be a limit, otherwise people would run 1500 bhp UF1000s) and then the cars would be the same

??? are u familiar with the concept of reality?
ok lets say for second a 1500 Hp car was possible it would run out of fuel and eat up the tires and prob won't win the race.

the point is not too have free for all cars, its too have a variety.
Limits should not be placed by the game it self but by who ever is holding the race or league.

U cannot say o but formula ford has these retriction; they use the same engine. This isnt a formula ford game.

i don't see how u guys can be against engine yet pro Suspension
Suspension setups are just as much performance as engines.

Quote :

Maybe you too.

I actually DO race prepare engines for competition work in real life. And I have nothing against racing tuned cars, as long as the tuned cars are equal. With modding in LFS that wouldn't be the case. I think I'd have a reasonable advantage over the majoirty of people (including some of the chavvy 'I luv NOS' types on this forum who THINK they understand), and yet I still don't want tuning in LFS.

Obvisusly it dosent apply to people who already know.

Just curious as to what kind of Race engines u prepare, could u elaborate on your experience.

How would it not be equal with tunned cars in LFS. the person who is holding the race has to state some retrictions. Example
I might hold a race and put the only retriction as Normal Tires only or No more than 350HP.

Alot of people just like to say it won't add anything which is like the worst reason ever. You can't deny Drag,Drifting would benefit from it.

am starting to think some people think if it goes into the game a surge of "Rice people" would start playing it.
or they fear they will become slow.

I think people should read up on how engines work to give there opinoin validity.