Hello, my friend Alexey
1. All LFS default cars(except FBM, RAC and BF1 i guess) were made from scratch to suit the tyre physics parameters which are not obvious for people who has no degree in vehicle dynamics. As far as i understand, LFS vehicles are all about tyres they need to utilize. Weight balance, engine, suspension geometry, driver position, default setup values and all kind of stuff is strictly balanced by Scawen himself. We still have some good tools like Bob Smith's VHPA to dig into this mess, but VHPA has nothing to do with suspension geometry so thats not enough to be fair. Also, most valueable things related to tyres u can see in Editor are SA/SR and thats all.
2. 90% of real competitive drift vehicles are using so called "wisefab kits", so the suspension geometry and handling balance of these cars are far from what was done by car manufacturer and engineers. I'd rather say the "real" conditions u are talking about, well, its all about vehicles which just suck in handling the tyres in a right way. Im absolutely sure here, maybe except some cars like z05 which was engineered to utilize 18-19 diameter rims with wide tyres. As far as i can judge, in RU pro drift scene we have all kinds of japanese and european FR cars but the way those cars were "tuned" is just to add wide "grippy" tyres. Those kind of adjustments makes some drivers struggle when they are behind the wheel.
So, until we get more suspension info in LFS Editor + new VHPA in new patch and/or people who are interested to dig into physics part more than, lets say adding triangles into a wheel 3d mesh, u gotta enjoy your drift mods tuned by all kinds of teenager players
P.S. Houssem mods are not bad in terms of physics, gotta admit that. Much respect
Last edited by paket42x, .
I had a look and I don't know a way to fix it while using compressed textures. It is 16 bit colour banding due to the conversion to DDS. You can see it in the editor too if you switch on compressed textures.
I have a few too many things to do, so can't really investigate further at the moment. I'm not sure but maybe it could be better to go for a plain colour as the best compromise within the current system.
I have a few too many things to do, so can't really investigate further at the moment. I'm not sure but maybe it could be better to go for a plain colour as the best compromise within the current system.
I feel like I'm in those games where you need to find a difference between two pictures and not see anything
Are you talking about shading and reflections? If so, isn't this due to the new LFS lighting method that the Editor is using? It's still not available in-game, this will be in the upcoming future update.
I'm wondering, in the LFS editor PNG the texture looks good, but when testing in the game, the gradient looks stepped, is it possible to fix this so that it looks the same as in the LFS editor?
Semi-trailers and trailers for towing purposes
Wikipedia states that a trailer is an unpowered vehicle towed by a powered vehicle.
I've been away from LFS and the forums when the mods were released, so I'm not sure if this topic was discussed (I searched, but didn't come across anything?).
Currently is there any possibility of coupling car with a trailer, providing that the necessary parts are designed on both the car and the trailer? Similarly, can a truck couple with a semi-trailer?
As per my understanding, with "fixed" parts this would not work. However, I see that some vehicles have movable parts (pop-up headlights, movable dump box, street sweeper attachments etc.). Along the same lines, if the tow ball attachment can be deployed and retracted, would that be able to attach to a suitably designed trailer coupler? Similarly, if the coupling on the semi-trailer truck can be deployed and retracted, would it be able to couple with a semi-trailer?
Would this work if the truck and the trailer were suitably designed in the LFS editor? Or would Scawen need to make some changes (to the collision model?) for it work? Or is this impossible?
I've been away from LFS and the forums when the mods were released, so I'm not sure if this topic was discussed (I searched, but didn't come across anything?).
Currently is there any possibility of coupling car with a trailer, providing that the necessary parts are designed on both the car and the trailer? Similarly, can a truck couple with a semi-trailer?
As per my understanding, with "fixed" parts this would not work. However, I see that some vehicles have movable parts (pop-up headlights, movable dump box, street sweeper attachments etc.). Along the same lines, if the tow ball attachment can be deployed and retracted, would that be able to attach to a suitably designed trailer coupler? Similarly, if the coupling on the semi-trailer truck can be deployed and retracted, would it be able to couple with a semi-trailer?
Would this work if the truck and the trailer were suitably designed in the LFS editor? Or would Scawen need to make some changes (to the collision model?) for it work? Or is this impossible?
That kind of argument is pretty much invalid. Sounds like all vehicles should stick whatever transmission LFS offers now just because you race? What is the "sry" for? What you are apologizing? Perhaps for your own comment yes.
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But yeah, back on topic. If we are looking from Scawen's perspective about this thread. And about what LFS Editor can offer... and looking real life vehicles as today, it is quite understandable about not taking this improvement suggestion as a high priority.
There can be so many different engines, transmissions and chassis layouts that it simply requires vastly to improve generally speaking, little bit everything and beyond. Furthermore, we are not have seen yet the announced things, which contains definitely a various things to modify with LFS Editor as well. ( Assuming, that those options are available as well. )
What I think most of this suggestion, is simply about fulfilling people's creativeness. As in history has shown, people tend to try and create what inmost craziest concepts, unique designs, "lightbulb moments" or even just plain blueprint ideas, regardless of it's practical use or not. LFS Editor as being a software, simply helps people to craft virtually basically whatever they want to. For example, I tried to make a monocycle back then and some other various things. Unfortunately I encountered some... "limits" and ultimately noticed some issues between realism and virtualism... and on top of that, my skill level reached it's limit, as well as my time.
Peugeot 207 rc 2006-2009
Hello guys
I had shared an hb vehicle before and I wanted to make a new hb vehicle, I wanted it to be a little strong, and I decided to model a 207rc because I thought it was a pretty enjoyable vehicle.
i've been working on just the editor for this car mode for about 1 month and I've decided to share this with you because I've made a lot of progress.
I had shared an hb vehicle before and I wanted to make a new hb vehicle, I wanted it to be a little strong, and I decided to model a 207rc because I thought it was a pretty enjoyable vehicle.
i've been working on just the editor for this car mode for about 1 month and I've decided to share this with you because I've made a lot of progress.
The best idea that I currently have is that all options are be available and the user can pick up the best suitable for him for the exact situation, but if that's not the case - then I have no clue.
"Choose the New Subobject location"
- Default position 0 X/Z/Y
- Closest point to the center of X
- Middle of all selected points
- Last selected point
For me, the best is always the middle between the selected points, but maybe that depends on the situation. My 3D experience started when you published the Mod Editor, so I have very little experience. Others more experienced as Eric could give their opinion. Overall it's not that hard to move the points in the proper location afterwards.
Ummm When u say race cars, are u meaning factory race cars that dont have road examples ? Or track breed only type?
Imo if it can switch between automatic and tiptronic its an automatic. And if its a sports car or production mid sport/high performance car, it can be street raced or track raced
heres just a few production cars with automatic transmissions that are performance cars as well:
GTR35
Mustangs with the 6peed automatics
Mercedes 63's or any AMG from 2016
Cant forget theres a automatic transmission for every manual transmission production car,
their called "options" or "trims" in my country
Porsches, Lamborghinis, even alfa romeo guilias and jaguars F types and ferraris and BMW M4 M5 M3 M6 are all automatics with DCT or tiptronic(2008-present) u can find manual M3 or M4 to be fair
Audi quattro and all RS models all have either automatic 7speeds or 6 speed manuals, their all offered as options
Camaro SS from 2016-now is fitted with either 10 speed auto or manual 6 speed and its a track bread car
Theres even air shifting now in drag racing
Pressing buttons on the back of the steering wheel wins races. And theres no shortage if automatic race cars out here
I mean lets be real, in a drag race or street the automatic will outshift the manual and allows the driver to focus on the driving rather than driving + transmission operating.
just wanted to point that out. But i get where u coming from when u said "race cars arent automatic" hehe
Normally the mass production road versions debut first then the racing versions are made, unless theres an instance where thats not the case and we got race car first then production car after
After driving automatics for years i wouldnt expect Scawen to even attempt to incorporate automatic operations in the game, the automatic transmission is a really complex system tbf and if adding more gears is that technical, imagine making a automatic ECU operations in the game, since u can kinda trick the SHIFT + G into thinking 3500-4000RPMS is redline for now i think thats the way to go but the downshifting area in the tachometer would be nice to manipulate like the redline slider in engine editor so it doesn't aggressively downshifts into oblivion lmao
Automatic gearboxes would be so damn fun to race with because adds more realism. LFS claims its a racing simulator so it needs the automatic gearbox. And most people with S3 license cruise more than race. By automatics i would mean that you need to change into automatic in LFS EDITOR so certain cars have that feature and certain cars dont.
The NCL can only have an effect when used within the same smoothing group. In that case it will give a higher weighting to the triangles with the higher number. So it affects only the normals at the boundary between two normal contribution levels, within the same smoothing group. But across smoothing group boundaries, separate triangles do not contribute to the same normal anyway so then it has no effect.
But I wondered about the slight shading errors, and had a look in game and in editor. I tried "flat" view mode, because flat shading shows a good representation of the triangle normals, that produce the raw data for the vertex normals.
As you can see in flat shaded view, there is a sort of dent here (attached image). Because of how LFS works, that dent is the cause for the undesirable normals at that location.
I forgot to mention flat shaded mode. That is another thing that Eric uses a lot. I think that by moving vertices around a few mm here or there, the flat shaded model can display more consistent lighting and that will affect the vertex normals in a good way. I don't know if you can use the same thing in blender (I know blender supports non-triangle polygons so I don't know).
EDIT: I just remembered, sometimes triangle rotations can also have a quite a noticeable effect on the normals. I mean rotating two triangles within a quad (select 1 triangle, SHIFT+click the adjacent triangle). The LFS importer doesn't always make the best choice of triangle rotation when creating two triangles from a quad in the imported obj file.
Last edited by Scawen, .
Wow I didn't know about ncl, I tried it now, I made a high value of normals in the places I needed where there are visual artifacts, maybe I need to do something differently but either I don't understand how it works, or it doesn't have a significant effect. (pic 1-5)
I was just saying that the shadings in blender, LFS Editor and the game are different. (pic 6-7-8)
By the way is it possible to make blender shading support? In blender there are various ways to manipulate shading that conveniently to work. And while exporting obj there is a checkbox to export shading, but I understand now it doesn't work for LFS in the form of modifier WeightedNormal, which improves the appearance of the model. (pic 9-10)
Thanks a lot, this was exactly, what I was looking for
Did not know that weighting can be adjusted in the editor.My answer on the topic from mod review https://www.lfs.net/forum/post/2086322#post2086322
About the bumper, its hard to say exactly why this happens, but the shading algorithm is clearly involved. There shouldn't be any problems in the mesh itself. Regarding the space on the rear bumper, I suspect a strange operation of the normals. And of course it is quite problematic that LFS does not support custom normals because the shading algorithm always sets its own direction of normals. And it doesn't always look good. And I don't know how to deal with it. In blender the shading looks different than in LFS Editor, and in LFS game it is even more different. I gave examples of pictures and there is no such problems.
About the mirror mount, it apparently happens when the meshes are too close to each other, I'll try to fix it in the next version.
- There is 1515mm front track width and 1532 rear track width for 2016 Porsche 718 Cayman which I sized up when make the suspension, but I'm not sure what dimensions I found when making the model.
- Got it
-- Yes, I know, a lot has not been done yet, the dashboard will also change, just first vers in wip.
About the bumper, its hard to say exactly why this happens, but the shading algorithm is clearly involved. There shouldn't be any problems in the mesh itself. Regarding the space on the rear bumper, I suspect a strange operation of the normals. And of course it is quite problematic that LFS does not support custom normals because the shading algorithm always sets its own direction of normals. And it doesn't always look good. And I don't know how to deal with it. In blender the shading looks different than in LFS Editor, and in LFS game it is even more different. I gave examples of pictures and there is no such problems.
About the mirror mount, it apparently happens when the meshes are too close to each other, I'll try to fix it in the next version.
- There is 1515mm front track width and 1532 rear track width for 2016 Porsche 718 Cayman which I sized up when make the suspension, but I'm not sure what dimensions I found when making the model.
- Got it
-- Yes, I know, a lot has not been done yet, the dashboard will also change, just first vers in wip.
Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, .
number of gears in a transmission can be "racing things" too
Ford put 10 of them behind a 4cyl engine
Surely adding 2 more gears to LFS wouldnt take 3 months to add and honestly its a suggestion with actual irl applications, just cause its a racing simulator doesnt mean it should only have racing car gearboxes only, .. i mean we have pickup trucks, semi's, busses and WW|| tanks so coding a lil string from 1~7 to 1~9 wouldnt hurt anyone right? and also make it lock the amount from inside editor
Btw theres street car mods everywhere in the game. Not sure what u meant by those are all street cars when LFS has a ton of street cars proving my point if they in LFS why not allow more gears for them and future mods that may carry more than 7 speeds, i cant be demanding too much... am i?
Some of these suggestions are now done in Editor E7, including the new line guide as described.
Also a step towards being able to transfer selected triangles between subobjects. You can now merge a subobject into another subobject. So you could break off triangles from one subobject, into a temporary subobject, then merge that one into another subobject. I realise that sounds laborious but in some situations it could be more convenient than merging everything back to main object and breaking off again. Also, the eventual function to transfer triangles might well use an intermediate subobject invisibly, using this new function as part of the operation.
So I think it's an important new function and seems to work well as far as I have tested, but would like to hear if it works as expected for you.
Editor Patch E7:
Drag selection box:
Function to make drag box from points now available in points mode
Scale / rotate / shear axes are now hidden while making a drag box
Grey button shows drag info to avoid left buttons moving around
Typing individual values to align points:
ALT + click r/f/u numbers to set all selected points to same value
- relative values compared with last selected point not preserved
New modeller line guide:
Set up a trace then click "guide" to create a line guide
- the guide is visible in most editor modes and all views
- options to hide/show the guide or draw it open/closed
Merging subobjects:
You can now merge a subobject fully into another subobject
- this is a step towards moving a selection between subobjects
- triangles can now be transferred via an intermediate subobject
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/106792
Also a step towards being able to transfer selected triangles between subobjects. You can now merge a subobject into another subobject. So you could break off triangles from one subobject, into a temporary subobject, then merge that one into another subobject. I realise that sounds laborious but in some situations it could be more convenient than merging everything back to main object and breaking off again. Also, the eventual function to transfer triangles might well use an intermediate subobject invisibly, using this new function as part of the operation.
So I think it's an important new function and seems to work well as far as I have tested, but would like to hear if it works as expected for you.
Editor Patch E7:
Drag selection box:
Function to make drag box from points now available in points mode
Scale / rotate / shear axes are now hidden while making a drag box
Grey button shows drag info to avoid left buttons moving around
Typing individual values to align points:
ALT + click r/f/u numbers to set all selected points to same value
- relative values compared with last selected point not preserved
New modeller line guide:
Set up a trace then click "guide" to create a line guide
- the guide is visible in most editor modes and all views
- options to hide/show the guide or draw it open/closed
Merging subobjects:
You can now merge a subobject fully into another subobject
- this is a step towards moving a selection between subobjects
- triangles can now be transferred via an intermediate subobject
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/106792
Editor Patch E7:
Drag selection box:
Function to make drag box from points now available in points mode
Scale / rotate / shear axes are now hidden while making a drag box
Grey button shows drag info to avoid left buttons moving around
Typing individual values to align points:
ALT + click r/f/u numbers to set all selected points to same value
- relative values compared with last selected point not preserved
New modeller line guide:
Set up a trace then click "guide" to create a line guide
- the guide is visible in most editor modes and all views
- options to hide/show the guide or draw it open/closed
Merging subobjects:
You can now merge a subobject fully into another subobject
- this is a step towards moving a selection between subobjects
- triangles can now be transferred via an intermediate subobject
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/106792
Drag selection box:
Function to make drag box from points now available in points mode
Scale / rotate / shear axes are now hidden while making a drag box
Grey button shows drag info to avoid left buttons moving around
Typing individual values to align points:
ALT + click r/f/u numbers to set all selected points to same value
- relative values compared with last selected point not preserved
New modeller line guide:
Set up a trace then click "guide" to create a line guide
- the guide is visible in most editor modes and all views
- options to hide/show the guide or draw it open/closed
Merging subobjects:
You can now merge a subobject fully into another subobject
- this is a step towards moving a selection between subobjects
- triangles can now be transferred via an intermediate subobject
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/106792
I want to have a day on the editor tomorrow.
I am a bit tired now, but I'll ask you to make this clearer for me to understand.
Is it really something that behaves like the 2D drag box, only it is separate from that and doesn't select points? Can you write a bit more description and a couple of use cases so I can visualise it better?
I think I thought of something like this before, but more related to typing in a number for X, Y or Z. But instead of preserving all the points value relative to the green selected point, it would set all of those points to that exact value that you typed in.
If that makes sense, would it achieve what you are suggesting? I think your description is what I've said but you type in '0'.
I am a bit tired now, but I'll ask you to make this clearer for me to understand.
Is it really something that behaves like the 2D drag box, only it is separate from that and doesn't select points? Can you write a bit more description and a couple of use cases so I can visualise it better?
I think I thought of something like this before, but more related to typing in a number for X, Y or Z. But instead of preserving all the points value relative to the green selected point, it would set all of those points to that exact value that you typed in.
If that makes sense, would it achieve what you are suggesting? I think your description is what I've said but you type in '0'.
I think Track Editor is not planned anytime soon or at all.
There was a screenshot that showed the editor but with an explanation that it is only usable for internal use.
I do not remember any posts about dynamic weather or rain.
Day/Night cycle is planned but iirc no weather.
By my reading, LFS is currently developed in two separate versions.
One version with the big changes, and one version that we are currently playing. Both get developed in parallel.
Sometimes changes from the "new" version seem to bleed over into the "public" version, for example the moving subojects. (pop-up headlights etc) or changes to dust effect. However the big plan is to combine into one version.
That version includes changes like:
-new tire physics
-new graphics systems:
--less stutter, especially in VR, by better syncing physics and graphics updates at 1000Hz (or something like that)
--day/night, dynamic lights
-new objects (signs with editable letters, more chalk marks, curbs etc)
Other updates in progress are:
-overhaul existing tracks
-larger area for South City
-two new tracks (Airfield Racetrack & Testing Ground)
-higher resolution for analog input
There was a screenshot that showed the editor but with an explanation that it is only usable for internal use.
I do not remember any posts about dynamic weather or rain.
Day/Night cycle is planned but iirc no weather.
By my reading, LFS is currently developed in two separate versions.
One version with the big changes, and one version that we are currently playing. Both get developed in parallel.
Sometimes changes from the "new" version seem to bleed over into the "public" version, for example the moving subojects. (pop-up headlights etc) or changes to dust effect. However the big plan is to combine into one version.
That version includes changes like:
-new tire physics
-new graphics systems:
--less stutter, especially in VR, by better syncing physics and graphics updates at 1000Hz (or something like that)
--day/night, dynamic lights
-new objects (signs with editable letters, more chalk marks, curbs etc)
Other updates in progress are:
-overhaul existing tracks
-larger area for South City
-two new tracks (Airfield Racetrack & Testing Ground)
-higher resolution for analog input
Last edited by Gutholz, .
Rather than thinking what's next, I'd focus my attention to the updates that are already cooking in the pot. Scawen mentioned that after this last patch E9 he released today, he will work on tire physics, so we're closer than ever to the big one.
But if I had to play a fortune teller a bit, I have to say the next big thing would be track editor, not counting all sorts of small quality of life updates for LFS that will take place along side it. It's just a guess.
But if I had to play a fortune teller a bit, I have to say the next big thing would be track editor, not counting all sorts of small quality of life updates for LFS that will take place along side it. It's just a guess.
I can recover this from a search, and I clearly remember that Track Editor was leading the poll by a large margin.
I'm trying to improve one of my mods by adding real-life stuff only by using the Editor. I'm using BKG images as a reference, but I don't understand. Why BKG is limited to 1024/2048 resolution and PNG only? I guess that there is one written rule for this in the code and it's used in a few places in the Editor, so the code is more optimized and easy to deal with.
Should resolution size or image file extension matter in this case? I suggest adding more file formats (JPEG & BMP) and no restriction on the resolution size because BKG shouldn't affect the uploaded gameplay mod.
BTW. We all know how to make a 1024/2048 image, paste our original image, and save it as PNG. The question is why waste that energy and time on an image that is used only for reference?
Should resolution size or image file extension matter in this case? I suggest adding more file formats (JPEG & BMP) and no restriction on the resolution size because BKG shouldn't affect the uploaded gameplay mod.
BTW. We all know how to make a 1024/2048 image, paste our original image, and save it as PNG. The question is why waste that energy and time on an image that is used only for reference?
I also played many (10+) years of lfs and the main reason is the game physics. You dont basically have to learn the physics of the game because it feels natural and what a joy that it is!
I did start playing rFactor 2 about 2 years ago and find that they are doing also something right there. I did played alot of BTCC and GT3 cars because they felt kind of nice and the car behavior is good and realistic enough at least when you had some hours on them.
I did yesterday shocked really badly. When i did get used to the BTCC and GT3 cars and then i suddenly did drive rear wheel drive BMW M2 car. Then i was thinking that what a #ell... this car feels so FAKE how it drives. I was always thinked of the BTCC and GT3 cars that they feel some kind of way natural.. but not perfect. Now i get it that the game delevopers and modders have to tweak/mod the cars some ridiculous way to perform "realistic enough" because the basic physics sucks in the game and i think that every game has the same problem. iRacing, ac, acc, am2, rr and so on... that is the main reason why in the game is going on always some weird #hit what dont feel nice and strating to irritate badly.
I never felted in LFS when i changed a car that game physics are done badly, only the vehicle is #hit if it is. There is always commonsense in the physics while you drive the vehicle and how it drives. LFS is the only game what has done the basic physics right. That is the reason why i am playing still the game.
Next thing what im waiting for the game is the track editor. Also the new tyre physics are important and many many many many other little and big things. Still the most what i need is the track editor.
The model is finished, it will probably still require some finishing touches for shading in the editor. But overall the modelling process is complete.
Edit: Forgot to add that there is 61k triangles.
26k on body.
35k on interior.
Edit: Forgot to add that there is 61k triangles.
26k on body.
35k on interior.
Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, .
I absolutely agree with you, LFS is a great car raсing simulator, and it's good that the developers still support it, this allows the game to survive until now. I agree with you that the main thing that is missing now is a Track Editor. In my list it is also top priority, graphics and physics in second place (with the update we've all been waiting for), weather changes in third.
And Scawen once said he was planning to introduce a Track Editor. In my opinion it would be reasonable to do it after the main update with graphics and physics. But even if it does happen, who knows how many years it will take.
Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, .
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