Quote from Flame CZE :

Valtteri Bottas aka Vale (F1)
Scott Andrews aka DuCK (IMSA)
Norbi Kiss aka Norbi (FIA European Truck Racing)
Teemu Suninen aka marakattimax (WRC)
Christian Krognes aka Chriskart (VLN/Nürburgring 24h)
Rudy van Buren, World's Fastest Gamer (Porsche Carrera Cup Germany)
Philip Ellis aka painster (various GT3 championships)
Christer Jöns (various GT3 championships)
Michael van der Mark aka michaelvdm (World Superbikes)
Nick Catsburg aka NickC

Sources:
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/95176
https://www.lfs.net/forum/thread/99297

Wow, thats interesting, i know about Valtteri Bottas, but other ones is new for me.

Since I am in the community of drifters in the LFS, I know many who have moved into real drift or come in LFS from real Drift. But I am also interested in players from other disciplines who participated in real competitions. If you know of any, please post it in this thread. It doesn't need to be big competitions, maybe on the local level, or even just some practics on amauter level.

Drift:

Name on eng (original name)
Nickname (titles)
links

Alex Golovnya (Алексей Головня)
4epa (Vice-Champion of the Vinnytsia drift Series VFDD 2011 Champion of the Vinnytsia Drift VFDD series 2012. 3rd place in the UDC Drift Championship of Ukraine 2012. 4th place in the EEDC Eastern European Championship 2012. 1st place in the Drift Championship of Ukraine 2013.3rd place in the EEDC Eastern European Championship 2013. 1st place in the Drift Championship of Ukraine 2015. 2nd place in the Russian Drift Championship 2016 Champion of the Russian Drift Championship 2020)
https://www.instagram.com/alexgolovnya/
https://vk.com/alexgolovnya
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCHOm1GyEErkO7_W2e8xIXOQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJdkLpOP2UI
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Damir Idiyatulin (Дамир Идиятулин)
Damiracer (https://drift.center/idiyatulin/. 3rd place in Russian Drift Championship 2022. 3rd place in Russian Drift Championship 2020, Winner of RDS Moscow cup 2020.)
https://www.instagram.com/damiracer/?hl=en
https://vk.com/damiracer
https://vdrifte.ru/pilots/167/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZxjTUnwlfe4
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Ekaterina Sedykh (Екатерина Седых)
ekaterina.drift (Vice Champion of Russian Drift Series East 2017, 2018. Champion Drift Street Legal 2019)
https://www.instagram.com/katedrift/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsXP0EVS8v8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EM3VzvxQ1fY
https://goo.gl/p2TYSY
https://vk.cc/6Ey4kg
https://vk.cc/6Ey4fX
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Aleksandr Grinchuk (Александр Гринчук)
GRINYA (Red Bull athlet for many years. Champion of turkicsh championship)
https://vk.com/grinchukdrift
https://facebook.com/grinchukdrift/
https://www.instagram.com/grinchukdrift/
https://goo.gl/G1NLyU (one of the org in LFS events)
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Ivan Bobrovsky (Иван Бавровский)
Godzilla (top 8 on 3rd round of RDS 2016)
https://vk.com/becausegodzilla
https://goo.gl/aPGibd
https://goo.gl/6iUhqZ
https://goo.gl/12Uhvy
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Maxim Miller (Максим Миллер)
Miller (Participant of Dmec 2021 and 2022. Creator and President of the Drift Federation of Ukraine.
Organizer of sports car competitions and events in Ukraine and Europe.
An international judge with Japanese accreditation DRIFT. Judged VS, DC, UDC, RDS GP, DRIFTING.HU, DRIFT ALLSTARS and others.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyoybbpTUVQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wN8KXJ6JplI
https://www.youtube.com/c/whoismiller
https://www.instagram.com/whoismiller
http://whoismiller.com/
https://vk.cc/6Ey42t
https://vk.cc/6Ey47R (one of the org in LFS events)
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Taylor Ray
tayloray
https://www.instagram.com/taylordrifts/
https://www.youtube.com/c/TaylorRayDrifts/videos
https://goo.gl/MUJWTL
https://goo.gl/xNuw5G
https://goo.gl/K5uxnv
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Pawel Trela
https://goo.gl/iMNRts
https://goo.gl/BhdhQR
https://goo.gl/E9EO45
https://goo.gl/IxznD8
And there are a lot more videos on YouTube

Alexey Katoliychuk (Алексей Католийчук)
-LSD-
https://goo.gl/TiLRYq

SKVGR team
https://vk.com/albums-100742272

Nick Makarov (Ник Макаров)
SKVGR n1x
https://goo.gl/Pf9q5m
https://vk.cc/6cgpWJ
https://vk.cc/66Ulv6
https://vk.cc/66UlCK
https://vk.cc/66UlLU
https://vk.cc/66UlWR
https://vk.cc/66Um1Z
https://goo.gl/KdolPl

Nikita Isaev (Никита Исаев)
SKVGR*DD
https://goo.gl/2wkkxc
https://goo.gl/lHjfMX
https://goo.gl/WjIu5R
https://goo.gl/p7abaf
https://vk.cc/6gzoZN
https://vk.cc/6gzpeh

Nick Makarov and Nikita Isaev (Ник Макаров и Никита Исаев)
SKVGR n1x - SKVGR DD
https://vk.cc/6gzoHV
https://vk.cc/6gzoMp
https://vk.cc/6gzoRd
https://goo.gl/RDxvLY
https://goo.gl/LXpe6O
https://goo.gl/p8IVKz

Konstantin Ivanov (Константин Иванов)
SKVGR.Ikostya
https://vk.cc/6B41kC
https://vk.cc/6B41gg (s14)

Denis Morozov (Денис Морозов)
SKVGR.xNASTYx
https://vk.cc/6B41oG

Javier Dopazo
SKVGR.Mad Dope
https://goo.gl/ZqyDcw

Tot Igor (Тот Игорь)
Maxxis Divan
https://vk.cc/6VNDjY
https://vk.cc/6VND9c
https://vk.cc/6VND6i
https://vk.cc/6VND2b
https://vk.cc/6VNCYJ
https://goo.gl/SqbVgT
https://vk.cc/6VNDv7

Artur Toyotik (Артур Тойотик)
Toyotik
https://goo.gl/KKPbuI

Kirill belyaikin (Кирилл Беляйкин)
GTRzavr
https://goo.gl/jmYoS8
https://goo.gl/JDe94L
https://goo.gl/NH8l1N
https://goo.gl/Y3zUSs
https://goo.gl/EP7W3n

Evgeny Rybinsky (Евгений Рыбинский)
Yjin
https://goo.gl/4TS8pV
https://goo.gl/ykTg68

Alexandr Savelev (Александр Савельев)
Fatalskid
https://vk.cc/60TaP8
https://goo.gl/t24QKe

Anton Zaharov (Антон Захаров)
[VDT] Raptor
https://vk.cc/60Ta8E
https://vk.cc/60Tagp
https://vk.cc/60Tank
https://vk.cc/60TatU
https://vk.cc/60TaBj

Artyem Shabanov (Артём Шабанов)
shabanovartem77 (2 - time champion of ZheZhe Ice Matsuri, 1st place at #MoscowWinterDriftSession)
https://vk.cc/7kY0Ty
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdY9aG458YQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQcZ8_0oAho

Danil Machkarin (Данил Мачкарин)
Failcew Love (winner of the open winter drift championship of the Urals 2019)
https://vk.cc/6gzo6U
https://vk.cc/6gzojL
https://vk.cc/6gzouN
https://vk.com/wall-21931081_64820
https://vk.com/wall-21931081_57428

Evgeny Pakhomov (Евгений Пахомов)
R.D.C Pahom24rus (Top 16 of Water Pump Cup)
https://vk.cc/6gzq3V
https://youtu.be/e-23n-dKwbY?t=19511

Artyem Nekorkin (Артем Некоркин)
R.D.C Drift52 (1st place on OPEN SUMMER FEST 2018)
https://vk.com/lislon?w=wall-21931081_60531
https://goo.gl/amNvO7
https://vk.cc/6gzr3c
https://goo.gl/Xu3CCJ

Sega Lapshin
seroff
https://vk.cc/6QGM7o

Kirill Loginov
k1ruxa
https://goo.gl/ODZ0ia

Igor Cherny (Игорь Черный)
IgorCherny
https://goo.gl/GMls79

Anton Petrov (Антон Петров)
A.Petrov
https://goo.gl/o68YZV

Alexander Medvedev (Саша Медведев)
ZONDAX
https://vk.cc/6Qr50D
https://vk.cc/6QrzY0
https://vk.com/wall-21931081_57428

Nikita Maximov (Никита Максимов)
STaRK
https://vk.cc/6QruBe
https://vk.cc/6QrBbY
https://vk.com/wall-21931081_57428


----- Amatuers-----

Mikhail Molodkin (Михаил Молодкин)
VENOMDASTER
https://goo.gl/ynLSkw
https://vk.cc/6QrCJg

Danil Kubasov (Данил Кубасов)
DOCrip
https://goo.gl/AbNLru
https://goo.gl/122Y8P

Mark Shinkarev (Марк Шинкарев)
mark174
https://vk.cc/6QucB9

Anatoly Orlov (Анатолий Орлов)
KOT200sx
https://goo.gl/9BsG47
https://goo.gl/ce7zK6
https://goo.gl/6u6gz1

Andrey Kadyshev (Андрей Кадышев)
D.project Iandex
https://vk.cc/6QtIxB

Dmitry Gusarov (Дмитрий Гусаров)
ччД
https://vk.cc/77MABg

Alexey Soldatov (Алексей Солдатов)
Lacki
https://goo.gl/FGHWYr
https://vk.cc/66UoJ8

Egor Egorov (Егор Егоров)
Maxxis"Fazer
https://vk.cc/6QtJIY
https://vk.cc/6B46Vr

Vladimir Badagov (Владимир Бадагов)
Suba
https://goo.gl/KVpA92

Vadim Kiselyov (Вадим Киселёв)
R.D.C Chansonje
https://vk.cc/6B470V

Kirill Solomatin (Кирилл Саломатин)
R.D.C Axwell
https://vk.cc/6ERGXY

Alexander Andreev (Александр Андреев)
NARA☆Nakamura
https://goo.gl/hnWrCz

Vladislav Puito (Владислав Пуито)
NARA☆S1gal
https://goo.gl/8x5ucQ
https://goo.gl/TJl9qR

Alexander Shavyrin (Александр Шавырин)
13N.Silvia
https://vk.cc/6SVEQw

Ruslan Murtuzaliev (Руслан Муртузалиев)
NARA☆nb|x
https://vk.cc/60T8SU
https://vk.cc/60T8Ib

Nikita Veretelnik (Никита Веретельник)
Ник
https://vk.cc/6Sr8FN

Semyon Vasiliev (Семён Васильев)
CAPS™ Steve
https://vk.cc/6QAv33

Vladislav Batalov (Владислав Баталов)
Batalov
https://goo.gl/b7xDZu

Ivan Pavlov (Иван Павлов)
29 Павлов
https://vk.cc/6gzqlW

Vitaly Polyakov (Виталий Поляков)
VITALYA
https://goo.gl/eTQHPM

Evgeny Kapustin (Евгений Капустин)
アムビにしす
https://goo.gl/seHpL4


I probably forgot to mention many people I know and it's been a long time since this list was compiled, so the merits of many pilots may be incomplete too, sorry for that. I just can't know everything. Since the half Internet is blocked in Russia, I can't enter on Instagram or Facebook. So I lost a lot of links..
These are the only ones I know from drifting who played LFS. Please write who do you know from the disciplines of motorsport who played LFS.

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Wed, 9 Nov 2022 09:48.

In order to have argumentative discussions, I decided to make a series of threads on philosophical issues. The first question is whether it is possible to kill criminals, for example, as a state execution, for serious crimes (for example, murder). It is not so much your position on this issue that is important, as the reasoning behind which you adhere to this position. If there is some feedback on this thread, then I will probably open other threads on other philosophical issues.

To simplify the dialogue, you can give examples from popular culture or literature, Rodion Raskolnikov from the Crime and Punishment of Dostoevsky. The Punisher from the movies\show. Kira from the Death Note. (Kira found a notebook that gave the power to kill anyone who would be write in it. And Kira decided to kill all criminals, I will describe some questions on this example)

I will express some theses with which I met, my accompanying questions. And I will describe my position at the end.

"moral views.. killing is bad"
- Morality varies from country to country, from culture to culture, from one time to another time. human has been killing human throughout history. Then what is morality in general? What are you appealing to? Why exactly is "morality" a factor in this question? Well, a human will kill a human.. and? What's next? Will he go to hell, or what? And there is a clear contradiction with the fact that throughout history a person constantly kills a person and this is morally justified as something right.. for example, in wars or executions, this is morally justified.
That is, public morality says killing a person is bad, and at the same time killing a person is good.. It's like a contradiction..
And in general, what is morality for you? Is it float somewhere in the air? Can you point your finger at it? No? Well, according to the scientific method, what cannot be viewed materially this does not exist. There is no morality, it is a social construct that has been imposed on everyone. Helpful rhetoric? Perhaps..An individual can adhere to any ethical position, for example - "human life has no value like other animals, the one who killed - won, who was killed - lost" And death is much more objective than some thought up morality. And that's what's really important.

"Human life is priceless. There is a commandment "thou shalt not kill" You are not God to take a person's life"
- What kind of god are we talking about? There are just a lot of stories in the Bible with justifications for murders.. The plot of Abraham and Isaac, the hardening of Pharaoh's heart and the murder of the Bethlehem babies, Moses' speech to the judges of Israel, Deuteronomy and so on, so on. There is too much to list. As in Judaism, Islam, and many other religions. So what? What does God have to do with it? Why is this relevant? How can a Christian god be a repeater of absolute public morality when he himself justified the murder and rape of women and children? "Human life is priceless" - Why? What about the life of a man who killed and raped children, it priceless too?
Lets assume there is no God. What's next? So in your opinion, if there is no god, then it is possible to take a person's life? Why not? The law? The law changes from time to time. When it's legal to kill others, when it's not. If you are in power and you have separated yourself on some basis from others, then you can kill others. Even quite recently in the 20th century, it was in Soviet times with the kulaks, the clergy, the party nomenclature. In Nazi Germany with Jews. It was all legal. If you appeal to the law, then you appeal to this laws too. And today, similar things are still happening, albeit on a smaller scale. For example, with oppositionists in authoritarian states.

"Kira can start killing less and less guilty ones"
- And if not? Then you'll be on Kira's side? Think of it then as an execution from the state. There is a chance to execute an innocent person, and the more authoritarian the state becomes, the more likely it is that the innocent will be executed. Again, think of Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union during Stalin's time. But these states had such moral strength to do it. After all, according to supporters of natural human rights, morality spreads through the state and its law. It turns out that if they are consistent in this, they believe that the USSR and the Nazis did nothing wrong.
I believe that morality and the law as a consequence of morality in the state are just a social construct that can be convenient at one time, but disastrous at another. Then why is Kira worse?

And here's my simple argument, let's imagine a simple thought experiment:
Consider the example of murders.
We have 2 worlds.
Our world: where innocent people are killed every day. (according to the statistics of murders ~437,000 per year \ ~1200 per day) Where there is a place for wars, genocides, repression of the innocent and other similar things..
And Kira's world: A world in which the level of murders and other serious crimes is maximally reduced due to the fact that almost all criminals are killed by an invisible force, and the rest are afraid to commit any crime, and there are very few murders and other crimes in this world. So much so that even if we count the murder of all criminals by Kira + the murders from the remaining crimes, the number will be thousands of times less than in the first world.
The question is, which world will you choose? And why?

I prefer a world with fewer murders, if only purely out of rational selfishness. Because I want there to be as little chance as possible that I would be killed. A person first of all values his life. Since he can only be aware of himself, because he looks from himself in the first person. He cannot think for everyone, the life (subjective experience) of other people is unprovable. Morality exists as combinations of opinions a particular society on a particular issue. But there are no moral facts. We cannot know the truth or falsity of moral arguments.
For me, the one who chooses a world with a lot of murders is clearly wrong. For this reason, I support the execution of the state. But on condition that it is a state that values human life and human freedoms. And no matter what it changes, it would be good if there were a law on the free carrying of weapons.

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Tue, 8 Nov 2022 05:21.

Quote from LUNDQUIST MOTORSPORT :

a few years laet here tho but would it be impssible to make other surfaces for concreat slabs? so we atleast can make decent looking irl tracks

Yes, but Scawen has been talking more often in the last year about the possibility of making a Track Editor, and if they do it like a mod system it will be great. We do not know plans of developers for the next updates after the release of graphics on all tracks, nights and physics. It is likely that after these updates, developers can take up a new Track Editor system, since this is the most anticipated feature by most of players according to the poll.

Quote from superlame :

I have really missed all of the things you wrote ( if they really happend ) Where was it mentioned there will be.. track editor.. and plans of splitting the update?

No, I didn't say that they would add a trackeditor. (it would be awesome if they do that, but i dont say that)

Trackeditor is just an option in the voting in the thread, thats it, (Sсawen once talked about it, but i dont say that in my comment, so they have it in their plans, but probably not for the next updates)

I was asked why I didn't include update official tracks options in the voting. And I was responding to that.

Quote from superlame :

and plans of splitting the update

Maybe here I remember incorrectly, but there is a possibility that the Scawen mentioned that physics will be released first, and then graphics, or night, or new tracks with a separate update. Maybe I'm wrong. Or they changed plans. Anyway, it seems like it was a year or two ago. Lately I have found only this, (in Graphics Progress Report: South City - part 3) see the picture.

Quote from johneysvk :

More and/or updated official tracks and environments would be better imo, but that was not an option in the poll

Somereason forgot answer on that

All tracks will be updated in the upcoming update with new graphics and physics. (if the plan for splitting updates has not remained the same) And there will be new tracks in the new update. In addition, the trackeditor option replaces all new requests for adding new tracks. Because in trackeditor players can make any tracks themselves.

What is going on here? its ddos or what?

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Please try to study European history to understand whats happening today.

who are you talking to?

Quote from swaggerguy :

no beef so no

If there's something to say, it's never too late to start

I am in favor of arguing with argument and grounding.

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Tue, 25 Oct 2022 08:29.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

YES !!!

What you say here is correct, the same as what I have said many times. ( And I'm an insane conspiracy theorist who is hated by most people here, welcome to my world...)

I haven't seen a single one conspiracy theory from you yet. I understand everything you write about. And George Carlin is classic but the only thing I would advise when explaining your thoughts is not to communicate using links. 90% of people do not open them. And probably they doesn't understand your point cuz of that. It is better to summarize the meaning of these links in the text. And if there is a dispute about the facts started, then it is necessary to give links. And then they will be read.

In my opinion Left-liberal propaganda plays a big role here. And about "Land of the Free, Home of the Brave" It is easier for such people to take left-wing positions. When I watch western YouTube. I see how these ordinary people, reasoning their positions. (well, maybe a little smarter since they were able to create a channel, set up the camera and upload the video to YouTube) They don't understand much about history, geopolitics, logic. But they are already trying to talk about who is right and who is to blame. they also often talk about the oppression of minorities in their countries, about cultural appropriation, about the canceling of those or others for the words they spoke. (and it doesn't matter if it's a joke or irony) They do not understand anything, bow down to people of another race, kiss their feet, arrange pogroms in cities, want to make communism.. (yes, I understand, this is an extreme example, but there are such) And I don't see a dispute with these people in the left wing. It feels like everyone agrees.. And it's scary. If something like this starts, it could be the beginning of the end. Russia was destroyed by leftist ideas. And the Russian Federation still cannot wash away the consequences of this tragedy.

And I'm not saying that I'm an expert in history, geopolitics and philosophy, but I have at least some knowledge, and I'm ready to accept the inconsistency of my opinion if there are stronger arguments against my position.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Global Politic's is very complicated with layer over layer parts of the game.

I have the advantage of studying this since the 1980's, this is simply the latest stage of the game.

In your case, yes. But this is not a universal rule. I'm only 30 years old. And I'm just trying to figure in the way the world works order without falling under anyone's propaganda. I don't know if I'm doing it, but I'm just trying. Now there are even more opportunities to study this with the help of the Internet. And it's even more likely that you'll end up on the wrong sites with wrong ideas. Where will you be in a world of shit with takes from multiculturalism and gender studies, Marx's Das Kapital, meinkampf, or the fourth political theory. Twitter people who are not able to accept large volumes of text, find it difficult to abandon the simple ideas that are embedded there in order to indoctrinate them with propaganda. Someone will probably read the originals, and a few will be able to figure out and understand that in practice this leads into shit.

Unfortunately the era of journalism is over. In my opinion, this the indicator of global authorization of power. Similar reasons force Western leaders to act as they act by spreading globalism through provoking wars in disputed territories of those who oppose this glabolism.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

And this is currently the US position...

Yes, it's funny that is a crazy grandpa there too. But the US has a system of checks and balances, high bureaucracy, and bipartisanship. All this helps a crazy leader not to start making idiotic decisions. He can do some things. But he does not have full power like Putin.

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Wed, 19 Oct 2022 11:47.

Quote from sarcus :

Харе позориться Infected is detected )

Why are you writing this? If you disagree with something, make arguments, I'm not interested in your unreasonable emotions. Since you are writing on an English-language forum, do it in English so that everyone understands.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Round here, USSR = Russia.
Yes, I'm aware of the difference, however don't expect that from most people commenting.

Ok, but that doesn't make sense to me. I will say more, Russian Federation ≠ Russia ≠ USSR. Russia ended in 1917. And difference between Russian Federationin and USSR in territories and ideologies. Politics, and attitude to people like cattle, (thanks to the West) remained similar. Now is Russian Federation is post Soviet country with many people who were born and raised in the Soviet Union. And the plan of the communist socialists was to grow a new kind of man. I won't explain it in a long text, but for short - in many ways they succeeded. In Russian Federation, there will be no changes for a long time until the infection indoctrinated into people's heads degenerates and die out.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Here, in the West, China and Russia are allied. Strange point of view as India and other countries are involved with the 'New Silk Road' but that is the Western opinion.

In simple words, yes. But there are nuances that I described above.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

IMHO, a F#@! stupid idea but the West seem's really clear that they believe this to be winnable.

There are no winners here, what they call winning is only the spread of their globalism and the weakening of the leadership of other countries through wars despite the fact that they themselves suffer losses through the supply of weapons and hydrocarbons prices. For those who seek to present themselves as the most civilized and correct, this is an extremely hypocritical thing.

I may call Putin crazy, but his speech about a multipolar world in 2007 is mostly correct. Although, since then, in some things he contradicts himself.

I absolutely agree, some people had doubts that the development on the LFS is in an active phase. This thread proves it. I read them all as soon as they come out, and looking forward to the next, although I don't understand everything there. Such threads are very necessary not only to show the current development progress, but also to keep people on their toes about the upcoming update and so that they don't forget about it and stay and monitor about the LFS.

Unfortunately, even so, some people use such threads to express their dissatisfaction and complains. Although it's obviously out of place there. Some do not understand that they can make their own thread in the off-topic section of the forum and communicate there with those who need it. Therefore, developers have to make these threads closed.

I am grateful to the developers for their work and writing progress posts about it, it's a bit sad that only 2 people are working on the game. But as we say in Russia - you go slower - you'll go further.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Lets try this conversation.

In general, this is correct, except for:

Quote from Racer X NZ :

The West has being trying to take out Russia since 1945, welcome to the Cold War.

Actually a Hot War..., see Malaya, Korea, Vietnam, Africa ( Insert every war here )

Not Russia, but USSR.
After the war, where the USSR showed itself better than all other countries against the Third Reich (if we do not take into account 1939-1941 USSR actions) And a question arose about which ideology is better, and which system is more suitable for people, socialist communism, or liberal capitalism. And according to history, the answer is obvious here.

Therefore, attacks on socialist countries friendly with the USSR were considered by the USSR as attacks on themselves, but a hot war between the USSR and America did not arise, and this is most likely due to nuclear weapons, but and the escalation grew, until the arrival of Gorbachev and the collapse of the USSR.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

China is threatening to take out Taiwan so attacking any possible allies of China is high on the US game plan, and Russia, to the US, is low hanging fruit.

It's true, in economic terms, China is catching up with the US, and the globalists can't stand the multi-partisan world that Putin talked about back in 2007. But I believe that China has no allies, strictly speaking. (like 5 eyes) Formally, we are in alliance with China. But the Chinese have a famous ideoma - everything is for China.

After the start of the war with Ukraine in the UN, Venezuela, Myanmar, Nicaragua, Syria, North Korea supported Russia and accused NATO of provoking the invasion.
Just yesterday, an anti-Russian resolution was passed at the UN
Russia, Belarus, North Korea, Nicaragua, and Syria voted against.

Of Russia's consistent allies, only North Korea and Syria are now. China abstained from voting.

China makes the most profitable decisions for itself, that's all. And so far he is acting rationally. That's why I think he won't attack Taiwan. The example of Russia has already shown that attacking neighbors is a bad idea. Even if the West provokes you. Whether it is the supply of weapons or the arrival of officials. As it was for Ukraine and Taiwan. Starting a war with Taiwan is not a rational decision.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

I just disagree with the way this is going, not being a fan of a nuclear apocalypse.

Yes, no one wants this, but what is the apocalypse? There will be no nuclear winter, there will be no total contamination of the earth with radiation. Destruction of all living things will not happen, this is a myth. But I agree that the use of nuclear weapons will lead to horrific consequences from which humanity can greatly reduce its population.

In the worst case scenario, all countries with nuclear weapons will destroy each other. And then I don't think there are enough warheads to destroy all the settlements and cities. (there are more strategic goals for destruction) All these countries are located in the northern hemisphere the southern hemisphere will be untouched.In addition, the factor of extremely small nuclear weapons tests over the past decades is not taken into account. Perhaps some of the bombs will explode in the launch shafts. Perhaps the Americans are doing well with this. But knowing how things are done here, I would not count on all our nuclear bombs. All survivors will simply understand that nuclear weapons are not so terrible, the deterrent will disappear. And that is probably start for global world wars.

There were times when ordinary accidents which could easily lead to puch red button, such as a false alarm of Americans protective systems, or American ships lost connection during the Caribbean crisis that already thought that a nuclear war had begun and they wanted to attack the ships of the USSR. Or Kennedy's appeal to the USSR, where he threatened to sink Soviet ships with missiles that USSR wanted to deliver to Cuba under the joint agreement. Each of these things could have led to a nuclear war but did not.

And I try to be optimistic and believe that this will not happen either. Putin may not be acting rationally, but he is not a fool.

Quote from paket42x :

Провокатор - и точка.

Provocateur, full stop.

lol ok.

Quote from sarcus :

Aleksander 124 is the provocateur.Do not mind him.

What? And where did I provoke someone? only you?

Quote from Racer X NZ :

I have respect from anyone on this forum ???

I just noticed that people don't really like abstruse people who trumping links to long articles or write long texts to explain the reasons (like me) People like simple and short answers.

You have my respect. It is always nice to talk to a person who understands the historical process and looking at the bigger picture.

Quote from UnknownMaster21 :

you lost my respect of not able to get my joke .

I may not have understood it correctly either, but is it about the danger from joining NATO?

If this is so, then I do not think that this is a strong threat specifically from the of Finland government. Although this is certainly an escalation of the conflict.

Quote from NumberTwo :

No matter how many jokes you do, you cant erase a fact that in 2022, government russian people voted for is waging a war and invading countries.

I'll start from the end. (btw, point 1 and 2 basicly is same thing, but i get it, need more points..)

Voting... haha, you have jokes too..There is no voting in Russia, it is an authoritarian country, do you know what it is? Any numbers in "votings" that leaders need will appear here. Do you know something about the Belarusian protests 2020? It's the same thing.

I'm joking because its a pretty hilarious that just as I argued with a Russian with brainwashed of state propaganda on the one side, I will also argue with a European with brainwashed same way with left-liberal propaganda on another side. And these positions are equally ridiculous.
It's a pity, but for some reason people don't want to think with their own heads and compare different sources of media, but instead choose one and stop thinking.

Quote from NumberTwo :

we are talking about russian ukraine. Who invaded who? What does it matter the west?

Here is an example of falling under the influence of this propaganda.
You are retranslating an absolutely flat and simplified picture of the world, where there are no complications and reasons. This is an absolute misunderstanding of the situation and cause-and-effect relationships, as I said earlier. Putin has no excuses, but there are reasons to do what he does. These reasons are mostly related to the West. Not only me, but other users (no russians) have already discussed them in this topic. You may not know them, you may not accept them, but this does not cancel them, and the fact is that Putin is really motivated by these reasons.

Quote from NumberTwo :

Russians have all the power to stop Putin. They dont. Use the power ..he is nothing without peoplw. He is just a senile 70 year old grandpa...as you rightly agreed already. I dont agree with you in that people can't change leadership of country. People always did that... Russians just need to find bravery to do it. Government is a representative of a country, and i sure do hope all finns party and are as cool as ms. Marin...like her very much.

but i know the strength of humans when they are pushed to the edge. And i believe. If Russians would believe Putin can be disposed off, we wouldn't be talking here.

Another example of the same propaganda, "why don't the Russians hold rallies and overthrow the government? Let's give them more sanctions so that they better understand that Putin is bad and it is necessary to overthrow him..." It's so ridiculous..

I understand that this is the first thought that comes to the mind of a European who has democracy and liberal freedoms. Does this European know that there are other societies? Where is no democracy and liberal freedoms. Has he read George Orwell 1984?..
Has he ever wondered why there is no overthrow of power in North Korea or China? To answer this, you already need to think for more than 2 seconds..

Maybe because liberal democracy and authoritarian dictatorship are not the same thing? Maybe he will try to understand how state propaganda in Russia has been trying to play on people's emotions for decades and believe in what they should believe? All the votes are forged, everyone knows about it, about carousels with buses of state employees who need to put the right ticks, about stuffing the bills, about counterfeiting by the verification commission. many people in Russia know about this.. Maybe because as soon as people take to the streets, a huge numbers the "Rosgvardiya", the police and the riot police immediately arrive which , which does is beat and squeeze into many police buses everyone who is there. And people have been in prison for months just for being in that place at that time. And people gets in jail for several years for actions like - raised the visor on the helmet to a policeman, threw an empty plastic coffie cup, tried to get out from under the hands of the police when they were taking you to the bus.. These are all examples of actual cases. All official buildings are guarded by the military in huge numbers and special troops with weapons who are ready to use it if someone gets too close. In addition, no one knows the acual location of the top leaders of Russia, it is constantly classified if there are no official meetings. There are rumors that Putin hides in special bunkers during rallies. All that changes any protest in Russia is the occupancy rate of prisons. Protest leaders (even a small ones) are killed, forced out of the country, or jailed for long terms.
And if you think that in prisons in Russia prisoners are treated the same as you have in Europe, then this is not so. If the investigator, or the jailers, need information, or they need a confession that you didn't do, or they're just bored - Violence, torture, rape, is a common thing in our prisons. And not just with jailers, they use other prisoners for this, they create better conditions for them and do not subject them to violence, they are called "activists" and it often happens that for some prisoners, torturing and raping other people is the only way out not to be raped and tortured yourself.


So..Imagine yourself in this situation and let's explain to me, a Russian under an authoritarian dictatorship, how to conduct protests in such an environment and how exactly and what exactly will they lead to?

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Sun, 9 Oct 2022 18:31.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

A suggested read for all parties

I completely agree with everything, it depends more on the United States and the West in general, what will happen next. This is if Putin does not use nuclear weapons first.

Quote from Racer X NZ :

Even if nuclear apocalypse is averted

With the exception of the term "Nuclear Apocalypse".
I think it's a myth, there will be no nuclear winter, and so on. the power of nuclear weapons is probably greatly exaggerated. And I have a greater fear that after the use of nuclear weapons NOT for lethality. Yes, there will be many deaths, but there will be no destruction of humanity. There will be an understanding of its power, and the deterrent factor disappears, and the age of the wars will begin, as it was before nuclear weapons and even more.

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Sat, 8 Oct 2022 09:17.

Quote from Bose321 :

So what will be left of Russia when all people that do not support the current regime are gone? It sounds like the percentage of Putin-supporters will only grow, giving him less resistance.

If you look at this, then there is some truth in it, but some actions like mobilization, or the loss of some territories, even the most brainwashed Z-patriots ask questions, and their support for Putin is falling. The mobilization is big of forces influenced this. Among the people leaving the country, there were even people who were queuing at the border to remove their Z logos from cars.

Quote from Bose321 :

I just think it's not our duty (people not directly involved) to judge and get involved with the other side. Although I honestly hope that the sanctions will give a big enough signal to Putin to stop.

How? Sanctions only affect the people, they do not affect Putin, some sanctions, like blocking a swift or blocking a visa and mastercard, help to keep the financial flow in Russia. Because banks and cards inside Russia continue to work as before, but not abroad. And it helps Putin. Why west did it? Who knows..

Quote from Bose321 :

But I think everyone knows that he will not and cannot stop. But I think it's also time he can't get away with shit like this and waging his wars with surrounding countries.

I don’t know, it’s quite possible that he will stop at capturing and holding the territories of the Donbass And a sluggish front line will form, as it was with the DPR and LPR in 2014-2022. Or he will capture Kyiv and all of Ukraine. Or Ukraine will launch an even more effective counter-offensive and he will have to make concessions, or a Nucliar world war will begin. No one knows.

Quote from Bose321 :

I'm not ignoring anything. I'm not saying Ukraine and the west are saints. There are plenty of wrong decisions being made on both sides. I just think there are slightly worse decisions being made on the side of Rusia every day. I mean, our leaders aren't perfect, but if the people are sick and tired of them, we can choose someone else and do something about it. Your failed dictatorship will not change until it has destroyed itself and others around it with a war. What for? Because Putin thinks he has a claim to some land? Is that worth it to send Russians further into poverty?

Yes, I completely agree with this.

Quote from Bose321 :

I mean you obviously can't normally talk with you about this topic because you get super defensive because for some reason you care so much for Putin. That's fine. We're not going to agree on this. I don't hate you. Couldn't really care less about Russians, as long as I don't meet them on holidays because they're not pleasant in general in my experience.
I honestly don't think it's worth the discussion on the internet because there are two sides, two stories, and apparently two truths.

Why not? You dont know me, and apparently you don't know my position. I'm not defending Putin.
On the contrary, I said above that this is a insane grandpa who has lost touch with reality.. How can this be his defense?

Quote from Bose321 :

worse decisions being made on the side of Rusia every day

Quote from Bose321 :

I hope you're right about no one remembering Russia

The problem is that for some reason you equate Russia with Putin. Russia is not Putin. Putin is anti-Russia. Russia as a state ended in 1917. This is too long a topic to explain to you. But there are russians who do not support this regime. And there are many of them, but they are leaving Russia more and more.

I'll say it again - The government is not equal to the country.
Сountry of Russia is a people.
The government of Russia it is a totalitarian power with a monopoly on violence.

You can say that one support another, this is not quite true, one brainwash another, and make them believe that they do it right, they do it quite professionally. In Russia, the practice of propaganda has been operating for more than 100 years, they have learned to do their job well, this is helped by the wrong actions of the West and Ukraine.

But many people still understand what is happening

Quote from Bose321 :

True. I find it interesting how these guys are still defending their country. Pretty much the only argument I now hear is 'but the west is also doing things wrong'. I would stop bothering, it's a waste of your time. I hope you're right about no one remembering Russia, but sadly dinosaur fuels are still so much needed. But I think once we find other sources of fuel, the primitive Russia will fall even more, not that there's much deeper to fall though.

It's ironic that you write this after my comment with a an answer on it, with arguments without any "but the west is also doing things wrong", and completly ignoring it.. It's like you're intentionally trying to contradict your words..and you did it. It becomes clear why you haven't seen any other arguments XD

Btw, on my comment I didn't get counterarguments. Why is that? Probably because there are no more arguments from the interlocutor..

And what "defending their country" means?
Creating arguments/counterarguments when a person is wrong is it defending the country? Ok.. then following this wierd logic, there is two options:

1) Are you too defending your country now. (Then how are you different?)
2) You have no arguments. (Then what the point of yuor message? Just sharing hate of russians? Maybe then you can describe your hatred in more detail and what it is based on?)

Quote from NumberTwo :

Its primitive and telling of a country.

Ah shit, here we go again. I see you don't burden yourself with complicated thoughts..
How does the politics of specific people speak about the whole country? What does all the individual peoples living in the country have to do with one grandfather who has lost touch with reality? According to this logic, does everyone in the USA suffer from insanity? Do the people of Finland like to have parties?
The government is not equal to the country.

Quote from NumberTwo :

Europe will go through it, there will be one or two rocky winters, but after that, only question will be "Russia who?". In end everyone except Russia will profit in long term.

Oh you can predict the future.. Cool. Who will win the Soccer World Cup and with what score?

Quote from NumberTwo :

This will just help eu politicians realize the wrongs of their politics considering energy and environment, so we will focus on nuclear power more, along with developing gas and oil trade routes from undeveloped markets to supplement Russian trade.

In your opinion, is this the only mistake that the West has made? Is it just bad Russia spoiling everyone's life and the West and Ukraine is doing everything right? If you have such a way of thinking, then everything is very bad.. in your head.

How funny it is that in the periud when the left-liberal agenda of anti-fascism is operating in the West, which leads to pogroms and fires in cities, the inadmissibility of cultural appropriation, cancell culture that impose bans on speech, break people's lives because of jokes or irony. And the film industry is already sliding into crisis. At the same time, they show bad Russians on TV in news, movies and shows. Just everywhere. After all, we need bad characters.. who should we portray as villains? Europeans? Noo, they're ours.. North Koreans? China? Black? it would be racism. Oh, yes, exactly! Russians. It's always the bad Russians who are to blame. And in all mass movies and TV series, bad Russians are to blame.. That's the kind of hypocrisy policy (In a broad sense) that gets into people's heads..

Yeah man, we're just bad Russians, don't think it could be anything more complicated.. We're just bad Russians who only know what to drink vodka and ride bears, playing the balalaika in one hand and shooting AK47 from the other

Last edited by Aleksandr_124rus, Mon, 3 Oct 2022 06:28.

Some interesting things have happened in the last few days, here are some of them.


• Armed Forces of Ukraine launched an effective counteroffensive.
In particular, Kupyansk and Izyum were recaptured in the Kharkiv region, the Armed Forces of Ukraine continue the offensive in other regions, in particular in the Kherson region.

• Russian leadership announced "partial mobilization" (although before that it was only about a military operation by contracted military forces and that there would be no mobilization of the reserve, another of many lies) In this connection, many Russians left Russia.

• Russian leadership announced the accession of Zaporozhye, Kherson region, LPR and DPR to Russia.
After that they obviously hope with the help of new mobilized forces, to take the uncontrolled areas of these regions for themselves.

Quote from cargame.nl :

It's a UK war (photo)journalist which was actually there (he is now back in London for the moment).

And? What does it change? Even if he was a Jabba the Hutt from Tattooine, this does not change my words.

Quote from cargame.nl :

So you call this propaganda, right, well... Thats your opinion then.

What an opinion? I gave the definition of propaganda above, I did not see that you or anyone else would dispute it and give out your own definition.And after that you throw off the source that directly falls under this definition. Becausee that source gives only one side, and is silent about the other.
Journalism - is about reporting facts on all sides, journalism does not give an opinion, does not show only one side. In case of conflicts between two or more sides. The journalist will show all these sides, show the facts that happened there. If he shows some kind of opinion of a person on one side, then he must show the opinion of a person on the other side. This is journalism.

Otherwise, it forms the consciousness of the reader\listener one-sidedly, this is already propaganda by definition. Its not in my opinion.

That's why I said before that there is no journalism anymore. All major media on all over the world is propaganda. There are only some small media that doing it in honor the duty of journalism.

Quote from cargame.nl :

Never mind, its the Totenkopf SS nazi symbol. => https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-62899474 (video)

If my Russian Internet would allow me to go to BBC.. But unfortunately many Western media sites are blocked in our country. I went with vpn and did not see any video there. Maybe the problem is in my vpn.

As I said earlier, both in Ukraine and in Russia there are some Nazis, (And in almost all countries) they are also in the military structures of Ukraine and Russia. But for some reason you are focusing only on Ukrainian... I find this very strange. This is just stange and wrong as some other person (who have heard enough left-liberal propaganda) that Russia is evil, that it uses Nazi symbols and Putin is almost the same like Hitler. And for some reason he is silent about other things.

There are at least 2 sides involved in the conflict, and if we take into account the West, then 3. All these sides are doing the wrong things. I don't understand why you focus on just one side that doing wrong things.

Quote from cargame.nl :

Good luck with focusing on some silly Z's.

I didn't bring up the Z subject. I tell you in response that you underestimate its importance in propaganda.