Quote from Scawen :

I am currently coding for a limit of 65535 triangles, or 65535 vertices, in the combined output model, including all subobjects.

This is massively higher than any official LFS car at the moment, so should be fine if people adopt the right approach. You need to make a 'game quality' mesh rather than a 'film quality' mesh, if you see what I mean. There are technical reasons to stay below 65536.

To change the code to overcome these technical reasons would be quite a change and, although possible, doesn't seem a good idea at this time. The fact that you can already make models hugely more detailed than any LFS model, seems more than enough for now.

I'm already concerned, with this high number, that we will get a glitch when you leave the pits and your car is generated, and also each time your vehicle is damaged, the vertices must be sent to the graphics card again. But this change is all about allowing people to be creative so I'm trying not to get in the way of that!

I think this limit is totally fine for the time being , it will force to make use of textures for fine details instead of meshes.

Speaking of textures, I just really hope that you could implement importing UV maps/textures with the base mesh.

Quote from MacedoSTI :

yes i see on video is possible export in obj xD

now just wait for the update

about a authorization to get a real names for mods? like subaru/volkswagen/toyota... how it will works?

No you can't use real brand names without an authorization ( from the manufacturer or the license holder ).

And to get that authorization, it means that you are ready to buy a license that will probably cost you +50 000 $ for one vehicle (if they accept to negotiate with you in the first place), there is some exceptions but this is how things work.

So you should always make slight modifications to your subaru or toyota model to make them not as similar as the original model, and of course make sure to use a fictional brand.

Last edited by lfsrm, Mon, 1 Nov 2021 14:58.

Quote from MacedoSTI :

I hope is possible use other 3d applications, like 3dsmax... blender is...

Any 3D app with an OBJ exporter should work for the base mesh,

and nothing wrong with blender .

I only wish that we could make the texturing part in Blender too, because from what I saw, everythings except the base mesh should be done in the editor.

I mean planar projection isn't very practical especially for complex shapes.

Allowing for UVs export is something that maybe you should consider in the future.

WOW! plus the top notch integration !

Thank you Scavier !

Quote from Eclipsed :

Few messages and the speculations circus begins...
What's the point worrying so much? LFS still works very well and when something get's updated,it will be fun to enjoy it. Until then let's just have fun with racing or have other hobbies.

Let's not be harsh with how other people perceive the thing, I must admit that with the usual quality of Scavier work it's hard to contain the excitement about an incoming update .

At this point any discussion (within the rules) in this forum is a happy event in my book, it shows that there is still an active small community that cares about the game.

That's good to read ! maybe mods support with an editor for imports/exports ?

I am pretty sure that Scawen is the first to admit LFS needs better presentation (graphics), that's why they are putting much efforts into modernizing the core graphic engine.

I could add one or two pretty neat features (important one IMO) which is ingame integration with modern social/streaming platforms, an ingame hub with realtime spectating and news about the game itself, leagues or other organizational events, pretty much like what other massive multiplayer games are doing (like Dota or CS), no other simulations are doing this right.

I think this could make LFS the true and the most modern multiplayer platform for simracing

Automation and BeamNG is very similar (but more complete) to the LFS and tweak combo, I wish LFS devs could implement something equivalent with better and seamless integration to the probable modding tool, this could open endless possibilities.

Always happy to hear some news from LFS devs, the new south city is truly becoming an "open world" map. cruisers, racers, and layout makers should be happy about that!

I think releasing the patch without Fernbay is a good decision, we should have plenty of content to play with in the first version until further improvements or new track/cars.

If it means the beginning of some sort of integrated "tweak" into LFS, where we could customize every aspect of the car (tyres, engine, suspension etc..), I can only agree with this approach.

Last edited by lfsrm, Sat, 9 Jan 2021 13:12.

It will be so much more easy for Eric if LFS supported multi-layers textures, because as of now he needs to add some sort of "floating" geometry with alpha textures if he wants to add tags or other type of imperfections, which will of course make the scene heavier on the hardware.

Personally I am not that bothered with a "too clean" environment for the time being, those kind of things can be easily updated after the public release, I am pretty sure that even after the final release Scawen will continue to update the graphic engine.

Quote from nacim :

Hello !
Nice type of update, feels like dev notes, really makes me discover the complexity of the engine and tool set, love it !

On a more artistic note, Eric you are rocking it ! Your texturing work is impressive !
I feel like you are using hard edges everywhere though, any reasons you don't have some nice bevels on the edges of buildings or sidewalks for example ? I feel like it would create a better surface for the lighting to "catch on", and create a smoother, less video gamey feeling
Also like three_jump said just above, I really feel like everything is just too clean, older building could benefit having some grime and dirt applied on them

I guess Eric is more concerned about polycounts, Bevel can easily double or triple them depending on the complexity of the object.

There are some techniques to fake them without affecting the base geometry (bevel shader ?), but I never saw this kind of shaders in a video game.

Quote :

I found two small things in a screenshot, see the attachements, it looks like the occlusion is a bit too strong, maybe it isn't aware that the mesh for the fence is transparent and creates and occlusion like an opaque mesh ?
And a small shadow light leak, like you already fixed tons of already

Anyway, as usual, keep it up guys!

Same with the image I linked bellow, but I prefer a bugy vertex AO over floating objects.

Anyway @Scawen it's always good to read your progress reports, thanks for keeping us updated! and I hope 2021 is the year for us to try all those goodies !!

I think it's perfectly douable for only one man to make the core physics engine, Stefano Casillo (ex Kunos physics/graphics main dev) is the perfect example for that, I guess even SMS and Iracing have only one or two guys working on such tasks.

Audio, networking API and graphics assets are the most dependent on staff numbers, sometimes specialized developers for specific domain like AI and VFX are often needed too.

South city becoming a true city ! I see why it took them more time than usual.

Hopefully the core graphics engine is near completion.

LFS suffer from the comparison with the larger scale simulations,we should take it as it is, means as a small scale indie project.

I guess Scavier know that and they are probably transitioning from the everythings in-house mindset, as it is impossible for them to compete directly with other simulations, I think they are slowly shifting LFS to a semi-customizable platform model, the modding discussion started by Scawen can prove that.

Quote from Racer Y :

"Environment design/building is definitively one of those area where you'd better work with a big team." Uh I'm involved in these things all the time at a certain level. I'm currently involved with a "big team"project. And it's a total cluster. And you could say the same thing about coding the car - this guy figuring out the torque and that one the window tint. I dunno. I'm inclined to think track too. But the intricacies of the car?I have no real clue whatsoever as to how they make either one.

I mean it's better if you have ten artists building assets at the same time than one, unless you are not constrained by deadlines, it doesn't have the same complex management as other area like core programming, which is a nightmare to coordinate.

I do agree about cars physics, it's generally a one person work if we only take into account the simracing genra, but it's totally possible to find persons who understand your work and know how to apply numbers ( well some actual physics devs started as modders ), I mean if you want to make a 200 cars racing sim you definitively don't want to work alone applying and testing data for all those cars.

Without taking into account the layout design, the amount of assets you have to model just to get close to modern standard make it a never ending project.

Environment design/building is definitively one of those area where you'd better work with a big team.

I was expecting a harsher review to be honest, thats really show how "clever" LFS was back then like he said.

To be honest LFS physics feels the best with low torque/low ends steering wheels, I guess the better your equipments the more you want to have a sophisticated simulation.

2005, I used my father office pc to download LFS demo, because well, home internet wasn't a thing back then in my country.

And how I found about the game ? I was searching for an startup error/crash I had with NFS hot porsuit ( it was finally an incompatibility with the useless SIS integrated graphics chipset ).

while searching I stumbled by chance on a download link for LFS via google search ( I thought it was a click bait name ), and when I tried it I was so happy about a car game finally running on my computer even tho I didn't manage to finish one clean lap for some times...

It's always nice to see some progress, thanks for the report !

Well you know, it's probably not ready yet.

Quote from JohnT2005 :

I feel like Asseto Corsa has more refined force feed back. You can feel what the car is doing, when it is oversteeing, understanding and an all round better detail than LFS. Same goes for AC physics, however AC has come to the end of its development. Unlike LFS.

But LFS still has many upsides, I think it does a lot of stuff better than other Sims. For example I think it has the best multiplayer layout when choosing a server, one of the most accessible forums and most importantly a friendly community that are just as passionate about racing just as much as you are.(not to mention that the developers interact with the people in the forum's, which makes you know about about them, so you want to support what there doing)

But unlike other Sims you can tell that the LFS developers have put passion and enjoyment into the simulator, not saying that this isn't the case about other Sims, but there's something about LFS that translates that emotion into actual gameplay.

Which is why I actually enjoy playing LFS more than AC, shore LFS is getting a little bit old, but this new update should modernize it keep up with AC and iracing, but despite this still find it the enjoyable to play.(could be because this was the first game I ever bought)

(mind you this is my appinion and you might agree or disagree, it's just and appinion)

LFS still has superior low speed physics, but I mostly agree with you, there is more things going under the hood with AC physics, but surprisingly they aren't that far from each others in term of general feeling if we compare directly similar spec'ed cars.

I always thought that AC is what LFS should've have been if the development goes as they planned, but of cours with LFS solid and accessible multiplayer.

Quote from Sponge :

That’s a bit unknown at the moment, but from some of the research I’ve done, somewhere between €500 and €700 should get me something decent, but obviously I’d prefer to spend as little as possible

- AMD Ryzen 5 1600 AF Wraith Stealth Edition (3.2 GHz / 3.6 Ghz) 119€94 ( 6C/12t, this can last you for some times )
- ASRock B450M Steel Legend 109€94
- ASUS GeForce GTX 1650 TUF-GTX1650-4G-GAMING 169€94 ( Maybe you can find a better alternative second hand, like an Nvidia GTX 1060 or a AMD Radeaon RX580 )
- SanDisk SSD PLUS TLC 240 Go 54€95
- Toshiba P300 1 To (Bulk) 49€94 ( or any Hitashi/seagate/westerndigital HDD )
- Cooler Master MasterBox K500L 54€95 ( front mesh case for decent airflow )
- Seasonic S12III-500 80+ 80PLUS Bronze 59€95 ( always consider a certified PSU "80Plus" )
- HyperX Fury 8 Go (2 x 4 Go) DDR4 3200 MHz CL16 59€95 ( for Ryzen processors, they perform the best with dual channel (kit of 2 RAM), high speed and tight timing (tho CL14 kit are out of your budget))

Total : 679€56

You can go Lower if you search for a used video card, but in any case you should consider atm the AMD platform because it offer you the best upgrade possibilities compared to intel, you can pretty much upgrade everything without changing the motherboard.

Budget ?