Asymmetric uprights for double wishbone
I noticed something while trying to replace measurements i took from a real suspension in the LFS editor.
I dont know if this is a technical limitation of some sort to do with stability of the physics engine. Or if it simply is a feature that so far have not been needed.
Basically, currently you can only adjust 'half upright' which results in an even distribution of length above and below the hub line.
Many production cars with double wishbone suspension have a significantly longer upper portion.
I don't think there is an optimal way currently to replicate these suspensions
You could elongate the upper control arm but this results in a different camber curve.
You could also lower the upper and lower pivot points to compensate for the difference in hub height, but this results in a different roll center.
Would be a neat improvement to be able to adjust the upper and lower portion independently
I dont know if this is a technical limitation of some sort to do with stability of the physics engine. Or if it simply is a feature that so far have not been needed.
Basically, currently you can only adjust 'half upright' which results in an even distribution of length above and below the hub line.
Many production cars with double wishbone suspension have a significantly longer upper portion.
I don't think there is an optimal way currently to replicate these suspensions
You could elongate the upper control arm but this results in a different camber curve.
You could also lower the upper and lower pivot points to compensate for the difference in hub height, but this results in a different roll center.
Would be a neat improvement to be able to adjust the upper and lower portion independently
BeamNG generates sounds trough a blend of a series of sound samples. I think it's similar to how rFactor does it.
There are 4 different samples sequences used at various RPMs. So one for intake onload, one for intake offload, one for exhaust onload and one for exhaust offload.
LFS does something more similar to the engine simulator where it synthesize a waveform in realtime based on an engine simulation. Although LFS engine simulation is not as advanced as that in the engine simulator program.
I think LFS is already on the right track for making realtime engine sounds. You'd have to simplify the engine simulator quite a bit to get it fast enough to intergrate in a game. But of course there is always room for improvement with more drone resonance and valvetrain noises and such.
Last edited by pärtan, .
This is definitely very impressive. But there are a couple of things to consider here.
This program runs on a 10khz rigidbody system and more importantly an 80khz fluid simulation which means it's a quite resource heavy synthesizer to run in the background while also running the LFS itself efficiently.
In a way it is similar to the engine sound generation system in LFS. The difference is that LFS spams pulse samples with processing applied, while this system generate a sound wave trough the resource heavy fluid simulation.
Bottom line is that it's quite heavy on the CPU
You do realize that this post makes you look like the child.
LFS Editor: Moving bearing objects in Suspension Diagram view.
Hello. Just a little idea I thought would be useful for those of us who are struggling with getting real suspension geometry with the LFS Editor.
It can be finnicky to go back and forth between special draw and suspension diagram.
What about the ability to move the bearing objects in 2D (x and z) directly from the suspension diagram view?
It would be more intuitive and easier to make better quality suspension geometry.
Edit:
Another idea is to display more information about the suspension geometry in the suspension diagram (ingame). Measurements of the crossmember width, control arm lengths and strut tower distances. This would allow the LFS modding community to check an LFS car easier and contribute towards better cars if someone sit on better information on how to improve a mod.
It can be finnicky to go back and forth between special draw and suspension diagram.
What about the ability to move the bearing objects in 2D (x and z) directly from the suspension diagram view?
It would be more intuitive and easier to make better quality suspension geometry.
Edit:
Another idea is to display more information about the suspension geometry in the suspension diagram (ingame). Measurements of the crossmember width, control arm lengths and strut tower distances. This would allow the LFS modding community to check an LFS car easier and contribute towards better cars if someone sit on better information on how to improve a mod.
Last edited by pärtan, .
Suspension mods are very much possible currently.
You can do:
Coilovers (change the spring rate, damping rate, rebound damping rate, height reduction)
Swaybar upgrades (stiffer front and back)
Steering geometry: Change ackerman from stock to parallel. + Change the steering angle limit.
You can also tweak alignment like camber, caster and toe.
LFS cars already have really high chassi rigidity. So no point in rigifying chassi upgrades really.
You can do:
Coilovers (change the spring rate, damping rate, rebound damping rate, height reduction)
Swaybar upgrades (stiffer front and back)
Steering geometry: Change ackerman from stock to parallel. + Change the steering angle limit.
You can also tweak alignment like camber, caster and toe.
LFS cars already have really high chassi rigidity. So no point in rigifying chassi upgrades really.
This would be nice. But I think really it would be sufficient with whatever the devs use currently to create the tracks and having it be model based. For smaller download size it could also be limited to existing ingame textures which can be repurpused for new tracks. There is a bit of a variety in the textures already. The main difficulty apart from 3d modelling the maps would be to struggle with the lfs texture mapping
but maybe uv support could be implemented.The main thing would be the physics. Especially compared to Assetto Corsa which gets so much praise.
Having tried to make my own little crappy car game, I've at least picked up on a few things about car physics programming. And there are some things about Assetto Corsa that are questionable. For example. There is no potential energy in the flywheel (Just one easy example). Programming wise I understand why that is. Chain reactions are hard to wrap your head around.
However, chain reactions are important to make a realistic simulation. And LFS nail them down so well. Anything from drivetrain to suspension and tires are executed perfectly, and they work together with no shortcuts to be found. That is the thing LFS have which most other sims don't have. At least in the case of Assetto Corsa, many shortcuts have been taken.
On top of this, LFS have been this good for 15 years.
But as others have pointed out, I also like the idea of the generated engine sounds which naturally conform to the engine configuration.
I like the idea of a personalized livery database.
I like the server system. It has that sort of classic online game feeling to it, with the green chat text. Reminds me of games like Quake Live.
Having tried to make my own little crappy car game, I've at least picked up on a few things about car physics programming. And there are some things about Assetto Corsa that are questionable. For example. There is no potential energy in the flywheel (Just one easy example). Programming wise I understand why that is. Chain reactions are hard to wrap your head around.
However, chain reactions are important to make a realistic simulation. And LFS nail them down so well. Anything from drivetrain to suspension and tires are executed perfectly, and they work together with no shortcuts to be found. That is the thing LFS have which most other sims don't have. At least in the case of Assetto Corsa, many shortcuts have been taken.
On top of this, LFS have been this good for 15 years.
But as others have pointed out, I also like the idea of the generated engine sounds which naturally conform to the engine configuration.
I like the idea of a personalized livery database.
I like the server system. It has that sort of classic online game feeling to it, with the green chat text. Reminds me of games like Quake Live.
I'm not saying it's not hard
And yea, I've tried the LFS editor briefly. And at some point I'm gonna try to learn it properly. I've done a bit of modding for BeamNG where a similar mindset of getting good suspension geometry and stuff is also important. The thing I find most difficult with LFS is the texture mapping since it doesn't use UV maps which is what I'm used to. But I'm gonna give it a good shot.
Well. Now I feel stupid
Alot of mod cars are probably inaccurate / not great. But it only takes a few good mods for it to be worth it imo.
I for sure think there are people with the talent to make good cars.
If you for example take the time to measure suspension geometry from a real counter part: Say for example a mac-pherson suspension: Crossmember width, strut tower width, kingpin inclination, scrub radius and caster.
That mod would be very interesting. Of course things like the cars moment of inertia is harder to nail down, and would often be approximated. With that being said, LFS mostly use fictional cars currently. So inaccuracy isn't really a huge concern.
Another thing to point out is that there are certain things about certain standard LFS cars which are "unrealistic". The XR which use a macpherson suspension in the rear is something I haven't seen in a real car.
I don't want to discredit Scawen or Eric, but I don't think the skill of making cars given the right tools is unattainable.
My take on mod support in general is that LFS ever since 2007 or whatever have the most sophisticated physics simulation to date. It's unrivaled. Even the hyped up Assetto Corsa doesn't come close when you really examine it up close. There simply isn't another game which mimics real driving as good as LFS. Whether you use it for racing, drifting or cruising, LFS have the most potential. The thing Assetto Corsa have which LFS doesn't (or didn't) is modding support and graphics. But I think with the graphics update (maybe even further improved later on with normal maps, UV map support and maybe later full PBR support) and also track mod support. LFS can take back the flag from Assetto and become the market favorite go-to sim.
I'm not an expert, but I don't think you have access to existing mods. Just the vanilla cars.
But with that being said, you do have access to the suspension geometry diagrams in the setup menu where you can mimic the SAI, scrub radius, caster, track width and all that stuff.
But it would be even cooler if you get accurate volvo 240 suspension geometry on there
And btw, make sure the model is creative commons, or you get permission to use it so that it can become an approved mod.
But with that being said, you do have access to the suspension geometry diagrams in the setup menu where you can mimic the SAI, scrub radius, caster, track width and all that stuff.
But it would be even cooler if you get accurate volvo 240 suspension geometry on there
And btw, make sure the model is creative commons, or you get permission to use it so that it can become an approved mod.
Last edited by pärtan, .
We've all drifted the XRG with 36 degrees all these years which is just enough.
Now you even get a generous 45 degrees which is more than enough for the low powered XRG. If that isn't enough, idk what to tell you. You need more practice.
Now you even get a generous 45 degrees which is more than enough for the low powered XRG. If that isn't enough, idk what to tell you. You need more practice.
This isn't really a problem because server chat history as well as all users are all saved if you simply press 2 and save the multiplayer replay (.mpr file)
XSG XST XSR XSD (or better naming scheme suggestion)
I figure this model out of my collection would make a good first LFS project, so this is what I'm going to start working on.
Suspension geometry will hopefully come from an S13, if I can get the measurements needed.
MacPherson front and double wishbone rear.
So far it's only exterior. It also has a unibody model because it was originally intended for another game. But I will scrap that for the sake of performance.
Naming scheme I'm thinking XS (a play on SX combined with the XR naming scheme) but open for suggestions.
Suspension geometry will hopefully come from an S13, if I can get the measurements needed.
MacPherson front and double wishbone rear.
So far it's only exterior. It also has a unibody model because it was originally intended for another game. But I will scrap that for the sake of performance.
Naming scheme I'm thinking XS (a play on SX combined with the XR naming scheme) but open for suggestions.
This is an ongoing problem with modding in other games. For example BNG.
It's easy to make a request, but it's time consuming to make a mod which is essentially free labour.
Basically, for those who will put time into modding, ideas of what to make will most likely not be an obstacle as it is.
Requests will probably get old, fast. But if we keep it in one thread it'll be fine I suppose.
It's easy to make a request, but it's time consuming to make a mod which is essentially free labour.
Basically, for those who will put time into modding, ideas of what to make will most likely not be an obstacle as it is.
Requests will probably get old, fast. But if we keep it in one thread it'll be fine I suppose.
I now get an "incorrect password" message when trying to select a car from the mod browser / joining servers.
In the server it says something like incorrect mod password.
Awesome! Works now. Thanks
I get this when loading the mod browser.
Same error shows up when joining a server. and no cars are being downloaded.
This occurs on a fresh 6v3 install with the v to w43 patch
Same error shows up when joining a server. and no cars are being downloaded.
This occurs on a fresh 6v3 install with the v to w43 patch
Last edited by pärtan, .
Yes. although the screenshot provided was not from LFS. If you have 71k quads in the 3d modelling software. It will read out 71k polygons. And when you export it and triangulate it, the model comes out to 140k tris.
The rule explicitly prohibits brand names and logos. Not cars modeled after real cars.
Last edited by pärtan, .
A polygon can be either a tris or a quad. 71k polys could be upward 140k tris.
Either way, 60k is by no means limiting.
Ooo. I was a bit concerned when I read limited triangle count at first, but 60k is plenty to work with. What about texture sizes? Will it go as high as 2048?
Either way, these are amazing news. Can't wait to try it out. I will be sure to make many mods!
From what I understand having tried making vob mods in the past, the texture projection is not based on UV maps, but is projected from various angles? Is this correct?
Also, I think normal maps are a great asset for making optimized and nice looking cars. Are there any plans to explore this?
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