Quote from franky500 :

would be nice. BUt im 99% sure it would be abused. There are the few that would be more than happy to mess it up for the many.

I absolutely agree with that

-1

Good to hear

However, imho obviously, the fact of keeping download dimension down will have sense only until LFS will not reach Final state.

The final pack should have all of these

Thanks again

However, the creation of lfsmanual domain should not go on liveforspeed.net main page news? (at least with next patch).

This is a thing that don't understand yet of LFS:

It has lot of features of possibilities, but for having some of them you have to search them by yourself (like LFS Join, SMX files for telemetry, LFS Music Addon files, lfs manual in that case, etc...). And that cause the lot of players that started playing during the lastest months does not know yet about these things.

Why dont include them directly in the LFS package?

Last edited by SpaceMarineITA, Mon 13 Nov 2006, 03:35.

Quote from Victor :

added both se. and it.lfsmanual.net (and some more - more coming)

lol thanks, really fast


But for having forgotten Italian in the first post now you should ban yourself for 30 seconds


edit: is it possible to invert the order of the words on the webpage title?
i mean changing from "LFS Manuale" to "Manuale LFS"

Last edited by SpaceMarineITA, Mon 13 Nov 2006, 03:15.

Quote from Victor :

I've added a bunch of subsites. These are all publically available so that anyone can just start a translation if they wanted to.

Currently available and editable LFS Manual subsites :

en.lfsmanual.net (English)
br.lfsmanual.net (Brazilian-Portuguese)
cz.lfsmanual.net (Czech)
de.lfsmanual.net (German)
es.lfsmanual.net (Spanish)
fi.lfsmanual.net (Finnish)
fr.lfsmanual.net (French)
ja.lfsmanual.net (Japanese)
no.lfsmanual.net (Norwegian)
pt.lfsmanual.net (Protuguese)

Where is Italian? illepall

South city long

Take a look to the track in that video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bd5ywJtuUG0&NR

That was the monza rally show 2005


It would be fun if we could have the ability of setting up an autocross (or track) layout with that double sided start line

It happened to me sometimes that at the end of the time of a qualification session someone was still making a valid lap, but people voted to start the race, ignoring that info.

Imho there should be some sort of message/advice after the end of qualifications which advice that all the people that was still doing a valid lap have completed that.

Last edited by SpaceMarineITA, Sun 12 Nov 2006, 03:23.

Maybe that trial check problem is a Scawen problem, not ours

He can do for example a check of some important part of PC, like a CPU serial or something like this, together with the check of Win serial.

Watching is not like driving

I think that it can be a good idea if done right.
However 14 days are far too much for a racing sim. Maybe max 5 or 7 days since trial activation, or 10 12 hours of playing.

And those players should be allowed to play on trial servers and to spectate on S1 and S2 servers.

Or maybe devs could allow trial players to play on S1 servers (for the trial period obviously), so S1 licenced will find someone for racing and devs does not need to code too much.
And noone need to host more servers then the actual ones.

Maybe devs can do this:

Demo => trial on S1 servers
S1 licenced => trial on S2 servers (s1 players can be tracked and are on lfsw, so are controllable)

Last edited by SpaceMarineITA, Fri 10 Nov 2006, 16:57.

3.5) cars that use 3 pedals and paddles?

(with clutch only for starts)

I have readed during lastest day that V patch will be a compatible one.

So all the things related to "Hardcore mode" that scawen said about 1 months ago will not be implemented onto V patch?

We could not have a more poly helmet, but at least more helmet models with the same polys

+1

A car with model and skin selectable by admin and drivable by admin, AI, or with a command for allowing a specific player to drive that car.

There should be some command for admins for calling it during races (drivable by AI), and these commands should be bindable.

+1

And a carmageddon mode too... lol

Quote from Bob Smith :

That makes no sense.


Bingo.

Why it doesn't show directly thousands of seconds?

I know that some drivers prefer to move their driving position to the internal side of track optimizing weight transfers, but onestly i dunno if in LFS there is a real concrete advantage on doing that. WRs doesn't seems to be influenced much by this thing.

+1
Imho is a good thing to add the ability of adding/removing ballast server side only.
Will be usefull for some championship.

Adding person to cars means adding too much weight, because those weight 80 kg, when ballast rarely goes more then 60

Quote from orangutan :

Because some of us may have to choose between one or the other. It could be
money, time, focus, whatever. In my case it is a choice for our league...we cannot
expect members to buy multiple sims and get familiar with them all.

So a choice sometimes has to be made.

As for our choice, we are undecided. We (organizing members) have been working
up a mod in rfactor that is just some tweaks to suit our league, but we have also
been working with LFS.

Our opinion so far...opinion. Again, opinion:

The funny thing is that we have the opposite opinion about some things than the
prevailing opinion here, for better or worse. For example, I think LFS sounds are
better than rFactor. Certainly they sound synthetic, but they also sound alive and
informative (although I have raced RL as well, and engines in RL are not always
so nicely informative). LFS wins sound.

LFS FF is unquestionably more immediate and real, but in a funny way is floatier
and less informative. The hackery in rFactor's FF does bridge the information gap
we have from not being in a real car. I'd have to call FF a draw, in spite of LFS's
clearly superior FF base. That extra rFactor information is worth something, and I
don;t mean the canned bumps, which I turn off. I means the hacks to convey loss
of front end, etc. Not strictly realistic, but in RL we get the information in other
ways...so overloading the FF with more info can be justified (same goes for
sound...which is why LFS wins sound).

The physics is misleading. Drive one or two hours of both and you'll likely
agree that LFS has better physics. However, drive two weeks of both, and the
tables even out. Drive two months of both, and they both have irritating breaks
from reality. They clearly are both based on multibody time integrated dynamic
simulations. rFactor is NOT table based at its core, although it seems to have more
layers of something going on above this core...for better or worse. LFS has a
cleaner rawer feel, like GPL, and seems truer to its own
model, and breaks down only when the core model itself breaks down, which only
happens in subtle ways. rFactor, like with FF, seems to have more hackery atop of
its model, but often for the better. Any simulation model is just that, a model, a
simplification, and they all break down somehow somewhere. LFS gently just
seems to follow its math where ever it leads, always natural within its own reality.
rFactor on the other hand seems to explicitly make an effort to feel right, as in more
calibrated to reality in feel, within its sweet spot...which is normal driving within low
mistake slip angles. Within this window I have to say rfactor actually feels better.
However, when rfactor breaks downs it is jarring and unnatural, unlike LFS. Worst
case is pre-spin slip angles and angular momentum, where rFactor gets downright
whacky.

To summarize physics, if you want a full performance envelope that feels self
consistent and natural within its own approximation at all times, LFS wins. If you
want more RL realistic feel within nominal conditions, and can deal with odd
behavior and strange transitions in extreme conditions (like pre-spin), rFactor wins.
I think this is why the RL drivers in our league prefer rfactor physics (when you
don't make big mistakes, rfactor feels more real, and the rfactor junk you get when
you screw up serves you right ) while both the hardcore sim racers
and console migrants in our league prefer LFS physics (without RL experience there
is no 'real', and LFS is a tighter cleaner feel throughout the envelope).

Despite the two big preceding paragraphs on physics, both LFS and rFactor have
what I'd call state-of-the-art consumer grade physics. Hopefully, rF2, S3, DR, etc
will move the state-of-the-art itself forward.

Graphics engine, rFactor wins, no question. Pallette-wise, within the default content,
LFS makes some better choices...but rFactor has the better graphics.

Flexibity, results exposure, and all the other stuff that comes with modability, goes
to rFactor. What LFS does, it does right within it decisions, but it just doesn't do this
part (yet).

UI and setup, for our league, actually is better served by LFS. It is cleaner, tighter,
and just the right amount of setup parameters. rFactor can be overwhelming in
this respect to the console migrant and RL contingent (RL racers seem to have
simpler cars they tune themselves or have engineers for more complex cars).
rFactor's suspension can make even RL racers feel like they are doing more work
and less play. LFS also pops between screen much quicker and the whole
UI experience is quicker, cleaner, faster, and less frustrating. LFS wins UI and
garage, despite its seemingly arcadey approach to the matter.

AI. Bleck. They both suck to an embarassing level. This is like trying to decide
which sewage smells better. I'll actually give it to LFS for the humor vote. It is
still a riot watching untrained AI spin about just like human newbies.

So our league is undecided, and may come down to one last issue. Aids. Our
league trys to accomodate consolers, RLers, and hardcore simmers...which means
consolers need/want aids to play along with non-aid hardcores. RLers tend to
go in between, optimizing for for RL feel of their particular RL car. rFactor wins
in aids support. Still, lower powered cars don't need aids even for consolers, so
the decision is not made.

There are things that i don't agree, but i have to admit that this is a very very logical comparison.

About the rf and LFS comparison on normal and limit situations and on FF i think that you are right, and i think to have understood why:

atm lfs does not simulate ground effect and changing of wing's angle of attack.
When those 2 things will be introduced, imho that comparison will be changed

Quote from xaotik :

Like the introduction of ground effect for the racecars - that should change the whole aspect of setups alot. Although there appear to be alot of regulations on limitting the use of such IRL.

Right

Imho the introduction of the ground effect and of the effects caused by the variations on wing's angle of attack (braking, accelerating, bumps, sliding, on both horizontal and vertical direction, so that a slide in high velocity corner will cause a loss of downforce on rear wing too ) will add a lot of realism on lfs setups and will increase the "feel" of the track on the car, because u will need to learn the correct use of track surface for a better aerodinamic efficiency

Quote from Gunn :

+1 for blue flag or blue light

+1 for double waved yellows

+100 for animated flags, flag icons, or flag marshalls! That way we LFS could visually represent the differences between held and waved flags both blue and yellow.

Agreed on all!
+10^10

Search on the beta patch forum, or between the posts made by scawen

Ok, but split times need a place where to be visualized, and on real race cars this place is the hud

And however engine and brake temps can be seen in race cars onto the hud too.

I know atm lfs doesn't simulate brake and engine overheating, but when it will be, this will be usefull.

I know it will be harder to read infos, but real pilots does not have "helmet huds" xD , so if devs want to had realism, imho that modify is needed.

Obviously there will be some key for cycling between hud screens on cars like f08, fox or bf1 (or gtrs too).

Instead, street cars does not need modifications, because these doesn't have these sort of infos.



edit: obviously i'm speaking only of the hardcore mode.