Quote from DaveWS :

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Since people wanted some videos to compare, here are some:

Patch U sounds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68-3Ugw7cwM
Patch V sounds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zXG2TJQgsoE
Patch W sounds (mine :P): http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3140969976597379310

I know they still sound crap, but I have many ideas for Scawen to try out when he is ready.

P.S. You can find some updates to the BF1, FZR and FZ5 HERE. However don't expect a miracle. Also, the post below mine in that thread, the FZ5 sound, is actually quite good. I may ask him if I can develop that further.

P.P.S How about if people try making the sounds better themselves if they don't like them? Everyone has the same tools available to them as I did.

I appreciate your hard work and effort but to me Patch W killed a bit of LFS fun due to the sound. Patch V sounds much deeper and smooth. W sound just sounds like it's trying too hard. Now i understand there are clipping limits, etc so this is certainly not negative feedback to you.
I just thought that V sound was as good as it gets for LFS's current sound engine.

With so few odd combos on PUB servers, racing with AI seems the only way to get to know certain tracks in certain cars (other than cruising alone) so I do agree that AI needs work.

I just don't think it needs as much detail as some wish for.
All you need is an AI that can keep up with you using your set so that you can gain some experience racing against them.
Currently this is not the case.
At the danger of being flamed, I'm gonna use the rF AI as an example.
They are decent for learning how to race clean and fast but can not replace real online people.

What track? Nuburing is unfamiliar to me.
Unless of course he meant Nürburgring.

Quote from mrodgers :

I worked in quality control for 7 years, and now in the Engineering department (not as an engineer, I don't get paid enough if I was) and never do you base something on maximum. Statistically, you base it on averages. Basing the points system on any of the servers on the best time is just wrong. It needs to be based on the average of that particular tier of drivers.

If your world class F1 drivers would drive in the lesser classes of racing, would you expect everyone in that lesser class of racing to now compare to the F1 racers? Statistically, you throw the higher numbers away as they are based on random error, and you use the rest. If you want to pit copper/bronze racers against copper/bronze racers, then you need to base them racing against copper/bronze times, not against the best in LFS. It's not fair to beginner racers that they have to be near record times to get anywhere on a beginner's server.

The gaining of points is what progresses the racers not only in points toward their next license, but toward a better skill level as well. It shouldn't be that you need to have the skills of Silver to progress and gain points on Bronze. You need to have the skills of Silver to race on Silver. Low skills on bronze will have low points on record. As their skill increases, the points they gain and the points on record increase until they have reached the level of the next license. As it is now, you have to have an extremely high skill level, before you are ever able to progress towards the next level. If you already have that skill level to progress as it is now, what's the point in it all?

When I was very small, I learned to crawl, then walk, then run. I did not need to be able to move at a running pace before I was able to learn how to crawl.

The average of 1st tier racers need to be calculated disregarding the higher license racer's times logged on the server, then the time requirement based on a percentage of that average. It doesn't have to be the average time, I could be that you need a time of 90% of the average or something. For 2nd tier server, calculate the average time of silver licensed racers at the track (they could be either server, just a track record, not track in Silver server record if need be). Make the requirement a % over that average to progress in the 2nd tier license. Same with all the other licenses, I don't know how many there are.

I state Bronze, Silver, etc, only because I race the tin tops and am using those names in general for all the types of systems, tin tops, SS, and GTRS.

I agree with you 100%. Initially I though CTRA used a RL club system of points as in a league but was quickly disapointed for receiving 0 pts on a packed server coming in 2nd. Winner got 3 measly points.
Things like this shouldn't happen. I understand that people are worried about someone coming on when no one is there and racking up points, but Im pretty sure it'd be easy to code the system so it doesnt give out points unless there are at least, lets say, 5 racers. Voila, problem solved.
Another issue is packed servers. It's extremly hard driving consistant fast laps during rush hour due to the massive amoung of players all over the track. Expecting someone to hit the fast persons benchmark to receive points is absurd. It's much easier to get a hotlap with 10ish people on then to be in top 3 on a packed server.

Quote from Gentlefoot :

Just wondering why you say the FOX has a lack of mechanical grip? Are you refering to weight? I wonder if that is mechanical grip or downforce

Remove all downforce and do a lap on SO (any track) and you'll see what I mean. By nature all open wheelers/single seaters rely almost exclusively on downforce rather them mechanical grip due to weight and space limits. As such, these cars become very unreliable at low speeds even with their low horsepower and very low weight. Their balance is set through downforce rather then weight balance hence why you see this problem. (the majority of the weight is on the real axle.)
The reason why Monaco and Macau are few of the hardest tracks in the Formula world is not just the tarmac but the low speed nature of the track. And the fact that Macau is bloody narrow as it gets

As you know, the faster you push the FOX the better it grips. I quite often find myself going faster just to make a corner. Funky but it works.

(Speaking of which, MAN I really wanna drive a F3 in LFS. Just imagine the fun)

Last edited by gohfeld23, Sun 29 Jul 2007, 08:06.

Quote from Moonchild LT :

Dude AI's werent improved since S1 as he said (i think) its nae fair to forget that there are people who likes to practise offline - without getting wrecked cause of others. Or internet reasons ;] and others too ! it would be useful to practise offline if AIs were good enough

Please reread my post.
I said that AI DOES need improvement. It just doesn't need special tricks such as secret selfdeveloped sets, etc. They need to be able to go fast, pit and race clean. If they can do this, they are already better then 60% of people playing LFS currently.

in LFS, go to options, control, axis. Hit the recalibrate button and make sure you press trottle 100, then brake then turn the wheel lock to lock. This informs the game of the range, etc.
In profiler, make sure you have seperate axis on both the LFS setting and the global setting. Do the same in LFS.

Also, with your PC on, disconnect your wheel from power anbd unplug USB. Then reconnect again. This should recalibrate the wheel hardware internally.

If all else fails, you might have a faulty wheel with mechanical issues or a short. I hope that's not the case.
Good luck.

While I agree that AI needs improvement in terms of awareness and speed, I don't think we need a complicated setup as suggested in post 1.
LFS shines online. IMO, spending too much time on AI is better used to improve other things such as tracks, car modeling, scawen's physics changes, etc.

Here's a simple and quick tip to FOX beginners.
If you think you are driving at the limit of the FOX, PUSH HARDER! As many seasoned FOX racers will confirm, the faster you drive the FOX, the smoother it goes and more grip it has.
Due to the weight, lack of great mechanical grip and balance, FOX doesn't like going slow. You have to enter corners with trottle on and try no to brake too long as you would in TBO's.
When you brake, brake while keeping the car streight, release brake THEN turn in and gun it. The weight shift will allow you to position your car into the apex while the trottle will increase your speed, shift weight to rear, effectivly increasing mechanical and aero grip.

The only time you should ever spin the FOX is if your pushing extremly hard exiting and touch a patch of grass or racing with fried tires.

Good luck getting there.

Watching a replay before reporting is really a great idea.
I reported a poor dude who I thought wrecked me out of the race by smashing me twice in T1 then T2, ending my race. After I reported him, I watched the mpr and realized 2 things.
First, I reported the wrong bloody guy!
Second, the guy that did "wreck" me actually only touched me ever so slightly. LFS coalision and lag did the rest.
In hindsight, I really regret reporting him. Thankfully, CTRA dismissed the report so all is good.
In other words, do watch the replay before reporting as when you really see what happened, you might change your mind.

Great system though and great tracks. Some of the combos I haven't raced in a long time as no servers run it.
And since the tracks change quite often (18 races?) nobody gets the super godly lap times using the perfect set so everyone has a chance.

Thanks once again X team. You've brought back life into LFS for me.

Tracks in LFS are really not challanging nor logical, especially considering the beautiful physics we have. There are too many flat out curves, not enough corners and the streights are way too long.
BL rev is one of my fav tracks ingame, along with ASclub, and all Fernbay. However, they are all to short (FE Black is nice and long and I love it with passion).
Also, I prefer all these tracks in non GTR cars as they seem to be made for non GTR. WE has potential to be a great GTR track but it lacks quantity of curves and corners. (GTR track are meant to be high speed, just not as simple and easy as AS)

Ever since I started playing LFS, I hoped for an editor so I could convert the dirt part of BL into tarmac, even it out a bit and connect it to the rest of the track by taking out the long streight. Now imagine the LX, FOX or anything on it for that matter.

As someone who's native language appears to be English, your writing is bad. It took me a while to even grasp your topic.

AFAIK, there are no variations of glass opacity possible but I might be wrong.
I have yet to notice any difference so it hasn't caught my eye.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, please.

Any decent wheel is great, G25 being the best from the consumer bunch. It really lets the game shine IMO. What's funny, I've found myself drive the more "difficult" cars since I got mine (DFP) and I'm having a blast with them. (LX, Rac, XRT etc)
I have to admit though, I've gotten slower in the GTR's and Fox. Go figure

Congrats on getting your G25.

I wasn't trying to be mean when I said fanboys. FFS I'm one of them. I'm just one of those who believe that LFS can be so much more then it is already.

Apologies if I sounded insulting.

And I completely agree with the modding fall-down of rF. But as already mentioned, GPL was really hard to mod that all the mods are quality add-ons that took quite a bit of ingenuity to make. And it really shows.
I'm either hoping for something like this or official expansion of the game. I guess it'll take waiting a few years for S3 to finalize.

Quote from MAGGOT :

Mosport.

Track Map
Turn 5
Downright Diabolical in the wet
Headed into Turn2

Obviously not going to happen.. but still.

Westhill is the same style track IMO.
It's a very simple track with no real challenges (compared to other RL competition tracks).

Quote from Origamiboy :

.....Perhaps if we could get rFactor and LFS to mate, then the resulting offspring would be the zenith of sim racing?! ....

Nah, what we need is GTHD or GT5 to mate with LFS. Mother of all Gods of Sims.

To the OP. All topics regarding mods, tracks, cars or eye candy either fall on deaf ears or get flamed by fanboys convinced that LFS is perfect as it is.
Not much you can do there.

I clearly understand mods and cars issues when it comes to 3rd party product.
However, tracks don't fall into this category IMO.
Tracks can't brake the physics nor can they alter the game itself to worse.
I just think that we need a few more playgrounds to play on.
Also, I mean this in the least insulting way possible. I know quite a few mappers that can produce tracks that are many times more interesting then what we currently have. Track with all the real stuff such as elevation changes, realistic pits, etc.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I really don't see any draw backs from community tracks (crappy ones simply don't get used by the admins so quality control takes a natural path)

As for those claiming that mods kill games, what's your stand on the CTRA-X system?
That's a mod in my book.

I've always wished for community cars but more so, TRACKS.
Let's face it, most of the track in LFS are rather plain and boring with no real racing feel. I'm sure there are quite a lot of talented people who could help in this department and make the game even more popular to the rather small sim community.
With physics being as great as they are, it all falls short on the current tracks, IMO.
And with only track mods, there's no fear of a mod exploiting the game, ruining it, etc. Server admins will simply choose what they think is of quality.
Sadly, this topic has been raised ever since I've been a part of LFS and so far, the devs don't seem to give a flying poop about any of it.
Shame.

Great simple skin. One suggestion would be to work a bit with shading to get a better effect, especially around the front grille and the air intakes by the back wheels, etc.

I'm a mid pack racer most of the time so I'd really enjoy something like this.
Also, I believe the LX cars are great for competitive, non hotlap driving so I think one of the city runs should be done with them.
Good luck with this. I hope it turns into a more frequent thing.

Server 1 is as clean as LFS gets. Just amazing. However, me disliking the low class, I tend to join the fox server and man its way different.
Way too many new players not knowing the tracks, braking way early, slamming into walls, etc. And then theres the hotlappers, smashing into your rear just because you're not taking the corner full trottle. (if you're running 2 secs faster per lap then 60% of the grid, what are the chances the guy infront is gonna take the corner the same speed as your fly ass?!!!

But I'm sure once the initial popularity wears off, it's gonna be a beaut. GJ X team. You've made an incredible addition to core LFS.

Quote from Electrik Kar :

Stupid photo mode. It probably looks ok in motion, but I haven't played this game. The bright areas 'burning' effect I see all the time on cars in the street, if it happens to be a very sunny day. Any highly reflective material will give an appearance like that if the light source is strong enough (ie, the sun), and it's reflecting right back at you. I actually think it looks quite tastefully done on that screenshot, anyway it's leagues away from the mega saturated hdr look of a game like Dirt (which I haven't played either ).

Megghh. Enough talk of graphics. I'm going to go and have some beans.

With GT HD simply being a concept of what's to come in the next GT, which includes real car cockpits for every car (and they are trying to get the license to do damage modeling) as well as their proposed move from arcade-ish play to a pro mode (LFS if not better equivalent in physics, tire wear, engine damage, etc), GT5 will most likely give all other sims a run for their money. If it only was available for PC

For those saying that GT HD looks fake, have you been outside lately?
Sun and light reflect, the road blurs in heat at a distance, cars get dirty, etc. Anyone claiming that LFS looks realistic needs to visit an eye doctor...pronto.

Nice.
Get a high res from Electric Kar (sp?) and it'll look even better.

BTW, nice reflection mod :P

If you can get 100+ FPS with everything on, I'd say run with everything on and as much AF and AA as your card can handle.

Quote from ajp71 :

^^ Who cares about RL touring cars anyway? The problem with modern touring cars, apart from the ridiculous amounts of contact and appalling driving standards is they are far too highly modified, they should be kept simple and near to the production cars as possible, what advantage do they gain from running slicks, sequential boxes, massive brakes and carbon fibre bodywork apart from incurring costs high enough to put off works teams.

What we already have in LFS is what touring cars should be, the TBO class and the XFR/UFR combo make good fun racing to I don't see the need to add a BTCC car.

You must be joking!
You'd rather race with road cars not meant for racing then race ready touring cars?
That's like saying that one should snowboard with a skate board, to keep it real.

IMO, if you don't feel like racing, get out of your house a bit and have a cup of joe with someone.
If you feel like chatting, IRC, IM and chat rooms are great.

The only time I join those servers it to outrun cops with FZ5's with my stock UF1.
Also, I know people dislike drifters, for some weird reason, but at least they are doing something that requires skill. To top it off, a drift server doesn't prevent me from grip racing there. Many times, people will join you in the race. You can't do that in InSim cruise servers.