Quote from Ball Bearing Turbo :

Afterall, why not put unprecedented amounts of investment into a racing sim. Better yet, spend that money on car/track model accuracy and proprietary tire testing to fool everyone... because we all know that the general public is just dying for the best racing simulation ever made! Yeah, it's all a "marketing gag", good call Kaemmer is a proven scoundrel anyway!

How much do you figure it's costing Polyphony/Sony to develop/market GT5?

I bet it's a lot more than iRacing. It looks better, more cars, licensing, still online. Yet GT5 it costs less to buy.

Yes GT5 will sell millions more copies, but perhaps iRacing can too, if they priced themselves lower.

I think a robotic arm would make the best platform for a motion sim. You could get over 1 G in any direction.

Robotic arm ride on Youtube

I have a similar problem as well.

It happens whenever I have to change the tracks, even in hotlapping mode. There's a slight frame rate drop and a very noticeable lag in the controls.

I always restart LFS for a track change.

Quote from danowat :

Lastly, physics, hmmm.........

Yes, I had all aids off and physics on professional, but I am using a pad.

Overall, it's a nice game, looks amazing, sound is ok, and physics (bearly) passable, but it's no sim, and certainly no Forza beater.

Lots of conflicting opinions when it comes to physics. Well, if it's any different with a wheel, feel free to tell us about it.

Thanks for the heads up.

I'm definitely trying this out. Being based on NKpro it's likely not to be the crap-fest that the M3 Test Drive thing was.

Quote from deggis :

vs.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=wz2-6v9-Ta0&fmt=18

.

Damn that looks like fun. Just look at how the car moves around.

For all the magic of the NKpro engine (I love how immersive the game is), the FF1600 doesn't really drive like that! Anyone else notice!? It doesn't really slide, but just lets go in a snap.

It's the best feeling sim I've ever driven, but is it correct?

Wow, that looks great! Realistic and plausible, almost like a rental kart track.

Will give a try sometime.

Quote from Technique :

Real? What is real? How do you define real? If you are talking about your senses, what you feel, taste, smell, or see, then all you're talking about are electrical signals interpreted by your brain.

Okay Morpheus, if I ever find myself bleeding after crashing into the wall, or my neck sore from constantly pulling G's, I'll concede your point.

Quote :

You can't simply say, "why pay for iracing if I can just do the real thing!?". The costs are nowhere near each other.

That's my point exactly. It's not iRacing vs. a Trackday, it's iRacing vs. LFS. Why pay 3,4,5 times more for iRacing when I'm already 90% of the way there with LFS?

And let's not get into the whole "they provide a league clean racing service" BS argument. That's just a secondary feature, and I can't it's the most often talked about topic over at RSC. They want this as an off season training tool, and they only way that's going to happen is with an outstanding physics/graphics engine. I assume LFS is 90% there (if not more) on that front.

Quote from Technique :

So.... i thought twice. And instead of spending my money on a single track day and equipment I bought some real quality sim racing hardware!

Maybe I just have a very unwilling suspension of disbelief, but how can you honestly treat a computer game as some sort of legitimate substitute for the real thing?

Even so, you need to compare apples to apples. iRacing is a game. Yes, game. Compare it to other games with similar specs. LFS, nKPro, NK2003.

Quote from DeMS :

Hum...

'Déjà vu' from the Malaysia GP :
Went in front of the TV, sat down on the sofa and saw the first lap.

Then woke up when there was 15 laps to go.

Then suddenly they were already on the podium.

Next thing I woke up on my bed.

And I swear I did not drink!

lol, that's about right.

Although I would still prefer trying to stay awake during some odd hour over having some gimmicky night time city race.

Quote from dawesdust_12 :

I totally would, if they weren't blackouted for TSN's broadcast, ...

SPEED isn't blacked out. Except maybe for Montreal, but then you can catch it on the re-run.

The Bahrain race was on 7am EST, just like advertised. I woke up for it, but passed out in from of the TV during the grid-walk and missed the whole race!

Congratulations!

Hmm, guess I'll have something interesting to experiment with next time I go for a bike ride.

Bicycles don't countersteer right?

If that's the case, then why not? Shouldn't a bicycle steer the same as a motorcycle?

And does the countersteering thing only apply to sports bikes, because that's the only context in which I see it discussed. What about mopeds? Trials bikes? Do they countersteer?

Quote from bbman :

and the Super Seven, especially that one:

lmao, that car is like an admission of defeat.

"It's a 7, I assure you it is! We're Donkevoort, we make 7's! ...oh alright... we admit that the Lotus 7 shape is old and crap when it comes to competing in this modern age of aerodynamics."

Quote from dungbeetle :

In a way, I guess that's what they're trying to achieve. Keep the technological development in check, so it's mostly down to driver skill.

...
Do you want a manufacturer's technology race, so we can see who can produce the quickest car, or do you want drivers in equal machinery, so we can see who's the best driver?

But I think that's self defeating as well.

Consider that after qualifying we'll know who the fastest guy is. Then 10 laps into the race after the requisite T1 carnage, and after all the faster guys have passed all the slower ones, we've established qualifying order again, and we'll have a 50 lap hotlapping session to the checkers.

Seeing Hamilton struggling with Webber with Trulli hanging on was quite fun. If Lewis had passed Webber right away, then sure we could +1 that pass into the stats book, but then what? Webber wouldn't be challenging Hamilton again after that.

Quote from dungbeetle :

So, is it any wonder that there's not much overtaking going on, save for mechanical failure or driver error?

Or uneven driver skill. Or a mixed up qualifying grid.

I think it's in the nature of circuit racing that we won't get lots of passing. Perhaps we could devise a spec that would give us racing activity similar to Tour de France or something.

Heck LFS is the same way. Passing happens when someone crashes, or a faster guy is stuck behind someone slower. Once it all gets sorted out and the race establishes a sort of equilibrium, it's just hotlapping to the end.

Quote from Kalev EST :

Renault was a competitive car when he was there. Not yet a championship winning car but still good. And look how that ended up.

Good point...

I'm no fan of Toyota, but I can't help but be a fan of Trulli.

Great performance by him so far this season! I wonder how he would do in a more competitive car, because I believe there's a great deal of podium potential (if not for the Toyota that is...).

A lot of the drivers seem very equally matched. No one is running away with it yet. Very good indeed.

Quote from deggis :

F1 has become totally DORIFTO, I freakin' hate it







not really

I bet you wouldn't see this kind of sliding with proper slicks?

Oh my I think I shed a tear. This is going to be a great season. I feel a bit bad for Alonso though. Even worse for Kimi.

I love this topic, and it's because I would really like there to be some transfer of skills between real life and LFS. So I'm a bit biased as well.

Quote from SamH :

Testimony! It's here in this thread.

Here's my testimony: real life -> LFS

When I first got my G25, I found out I completely sucked at controlling oversteer in cars like the XRG/XRT, so back I went to driving around in the XFG (which I don't have any problem with.) After the winter I decided to give the XRG/XRT another try and BAM instant improvement. Drifting around slowly through snow in real life in a RWD helped my LFS. In real life, the G forces help you read the car, and by the time winter was over, the steering and gas pedal motions were almost muscle memory to the point that I didn't need (needed less) the G forces to guide me. True story.

Does LFS tend to be more multi-cultural than other games? It seems to be the case. I think it's great. With a relatively small community I guess people can't congregate into little groups. The most obvious cases are MMORPGs which separate servers by country. Steam offers server filtering by country.

Quote from Hankstar :

So you're saying Thailand is similar to Sydney ...

First thing that came to my mind: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_vs._Australia

CRAP!

How does a month pass by so quickly!?

Okay, I'll try and catch the next one. At least it was cloudy? Jertie, feel free to continue bumping!

Quote from andybarsblade :

ok i'll try to answer it but im no expert, abs is a very simple operation...
a simple on off switch like abs

Quote from andybarsblade :

what the geeks on here want to class as a computer and what i would class as a computer are clearly different things.

I think I understand what you're trying to say. Kind of like how carnivorous plants move to capture pray, but you can't consider them sentient life forms. And I was ready agree with you that ABS uses some simple logic that works on some kind of reflex (locked wheel = release then reapply) until I took a quick look at ABS on Wiki:

Quote from wiki :

...This is the obvious main task of the entire ABS-system. Apart from this, the software also needs to process the incoming information, e.g. the signals from the sensors.

^ So there is software in the ABS system, there is some algorithm and some computation involved, even if it doesn't pass through the ECU. It's not a simple logic reflex system, it's algorithmic logic, and I think that qualifies it as being some sort of computer.

Quote from the_angry_angel :

Another Tristan alt.?

There must be a correlation.

The same people that can look past the well groomed individual in the mirror and see the potential hardcore purity of an experience of the MX5 are the same people that can look past LFS' lack of bling and see it as the s-th-uper hardcore sim that it is.

Lots of MX5 drivers here. Michael Denham, Osco? http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?p=730886#post730886

Last edited by Mattesa, Sun, 9 Mar 2008 06:30.