Quote from Funnybear :

If all you can resort to, Blowtard, is cras generalizations then it suprises me not that Scavier won't 'bow' to public pressure in the rebalancing issue. In fact I am sure he has already made his feelings known on the matter before and I know he's not prone to repeating himself. I find your repsonse insulting to say the least. I have done nothing but explore the topic and give reasoned, if alternative, views on the subject matter.

Sorry if I got too personal - just felt like you were trying to crap on folk from a great height with your 'this is how it's meant to be, how dare you suggest Scavier hasn't got it entirely right, any difference in lap times is just your driving' type stuff... the number of people who feel strongly about this issue would tend to reassure me that I'm not going crazy when I know that even though I hate driving the fzr, I can still lap signifigantly quicker with it. If Scavier had no interest in class balance then why the slight tweaking of the demo and tbo class through numerous patches previously?

HDR would round s2 off nicely imho right after decent sounds, balanced classes, and semi realistic collisions...

it's nice to dream.

hp/cc is far easier and cheaper to get per cc for smaller displacements - you can't just take a 5cc, 40zillion rpm engine and extrapolate away to prove how brilliant VTEC is or anything

Quote from Funnybear :

Thats fair enough, but in league racing people generally know what they are doing and wouldn't be trying to run an FXR anyway.

The cars we got are the cars we got. You balance the cars in what ever way other than a real world solution, ballast etc., then you have destroyed that car.

Why has it destroyed the car? An xrr with a slight power increase is still going to drive very much like an xrr - ie front engined, nicely balanced, not as much grip under acceleration as rear engine. The benefit would be you could run a successful multi-make series or race. You've proposed no benefit for 'unbalanced' car classes other than 'this is the way God / Scavier intended' which is just sycophantic bollocks, imho.

less locking on the power side of the dif will get you through there and still be able to run less downforce, which is faster.

Jamexing, check out the following.

Monday Night Racing - http://www.mondaynightracing.com
(40 racers, sprint racing, reverse grid, not so serious)

Australasion League - http://www.australasianleague.com/
(40-70 racers, endurance racing, hotlap qualify, as serious as Aussie's manage to get)

ARSE Forums (Australian Racing Simulation Enthusiasts) - http://arse.norbtech.com/phpBB/

Quote from Funnybear :

I was expecting that.

The FZR is the faster car. Scawen even promotes the fact that it is the faster car. But, In the general racing melee that 1 second difference (And we're including the FXO here) effectily boils down to nothing. It means that you can race the FXO competativly against most FZR drivers. If you can't then you know your up against a truly well setup and raced car.

These cars require work to get the best from them. And I stand by my comment that I will point the fingure at the drivers thant he actual cars for any pronounced discrepancy between cars . . . .

all of this is likely very valid on public servers - it doesn't hold up for league racing in the slightest.

I like the idea.

Quote from Funnybear :

In my eyes the margins are close enough to say that they are pretty much perfectly balanced.

a second of difference and you try to defend the 'balance' of the cars? illepall

Quote from Funnybear :

Hell. Who are we to question the maker.

Why do you bother coming into this section of the forum...?

Quote from Becky Rose :

I do agree generally speaking BUT, the LFS team are taking their time on this game, nothing is happening quickly, so we're stuck with an imbalanced car class month on month, and from what i've read, it's been this way since the beginning a few years back.

Sure they dont want to have to repeat work, but it does not take long to make a few changes to the FXO, 20 minutes work, then include that in the next compatable patch - then let the community say "nah you took too much off, up it a little again for the next patch please".

Instead what we have is the subject being deffered until later and general silence on the issue, and that is frustrating.

I'm sure I've agreed with and said very similar in the past, but I'm going to do it again because I too think it's important and easily fixed.

I agree!

Quote from XCNuse :

well.. when people refer to the STi, they mean the newest ones; the older STi's aren't exactly known

yes, because we all live in the U.S...

Quote from sinbad :

Anyway, this is my last post in this thread. I've said all I have to say, and to conclude, I'm disappointed that people don't seem to enjoy the game as a whole. Do people really hate the simple act of driving the cars so much that they are not prepared to drive them for a lap from the pitlane to heat the tyres up in preparation for a hotlap? Just because shortcuts are possible in a game, doesn't mean we should be obliged to take them because they save time. In "The Perfect Sim" (indistinguishable from reality) would we really be asking to teleport 3/4 of the way round a track?

This concept of a 'perfect sim' baffles me. The whole idea of a sim is that you simulate various elements of real life as closely as possible, while removing many of the time, money, and danger barriers / hassles / elements associated with that activity. Where would you stop in your perfect sim? Would you have to drive your car across the country in a truck?

Quote from tristancliffe :

Hotlap in S1 when tyre temps aren't a problem then - problem solved. S2 has tyre temps and of course it's going to affect your lap times and driving - why shouldn't it?

It's great that tyre temps affect lap times and driving. But what's the point of starting them pre-heated to an arbitrary amount below optimum? Surely as a race car driver, if I have tyre warming equipment that can heat r2's to 70 degrees, those same tyre warmers could also manage to heat r1's to 70, instead of 60? Surely as a big fan of 'realism' you can see that if warmers are being used, it's more realistic to be able to set them as you will?

Quote from tristancliffe :

When I start hotlapping my tyres are warm - i.e. only 20 degrees below optimum. As everyone is the same I think it's not too much of a problem. if they started cold, i.e. ambient, then I could understand that complaint.

there is clearly the ability to heat them to different levels - if you want to go straight out there and hotlap, why wouldn't you heat them to optimum, or 5 degrees below (to allow for heating over the lap)
I think they should either start dead cold (which would probably require more realism from the temp model) or should be pre-heated to what ever temp you want. This arbitrary heating seems a little odd and unrealistic to me.

expansion chambers hanging out the side of an f1 car? one can only dream :woohoo:

I find the dfp way too small to swing from lock to lock without getting horribly lost. I set it to 360 degrees and run ffb at a level that feels like reasonable power steering.

we had a fairly extended discussion of abs pretty recently in this thread here if interested
http://www.lfsforum.net/showthread.php?t=9929&page=2

continually pointing out the same flaws, that have been pointed out over and over before you arrived, does get a little repetitive

it's the lack of lighting I imagine

Quote from Lible :

Nope, alt+tab is a no-no for LFS.

works great for me.


The original suggestion is simple and bears merit - whether the devs choose to implement is clearly up to them, but why this insatiable need to tear down suggestions?

I doubt there'd be hostility if the devs wanted to release it - I think it's more the random, grandiose ideas that do not fit with the current style of game and are clearly not just 'improvement suggestions', but 'complete re-design of game world because this is how I'd like it' suggestions, that people get a little sick of.

Quote from Jamexing :

I've seen tha there is quite a bit of sentiment against the RA. It may not be my favourite car, but to kill one RL car after another will eventually rlegate LFS to non-sim status. Why call it a sim if it has absolutely NO real cars?

Why is a name so important? All of the cars in lfs are much more like real cars than anything in nfs, gran turismo, etc. All those cars have going for them is a name and a shell.

I guess the fact that they are deleted is a start / acknowledgement of this problem. Still don't like it

Sorry, not sure whether I should be posting this here or not. Seems more like a bug than an improvement suggestion.
It seems that the positioning of barrier tyres on the track (ie, after someone hits them, or your client thinks they've been hit) is not a server side thing, but client side yeah? I just suffered a bit of a loss in my Monday league race, chasing down 1st and I spear a tyre in the middle of a chicane. Of the 2 replays shown so far, the tyre is not there, I just spin violently off. I forgot to save my replay

Seems a little unfair if some players do not have tyres on the track at the same time as others do...

Never really got a response to the query of 'where do you start, how do you get in the ballpark' etc, for damping. Anyone got any suggestions? I have good feel for tweaking transition balance with the dampers, but in general I just seem to like quite fast (low damping) weight transfer, so start with lowish settings (rebound slightly more damped than bump, this is normal yeah?) and go from there. Suspension frequency and notions of 'under or overdamped' never really seemed to work for me when I tried in the past.

Last edited by Blowtus, Sun 20 Aug 2006, 14:42.