Thanks, I guess I should learn to read... 
That is just 45 minutes north of where I live. I have been meaning to get up there and rent a kart for a few hours.
Up here, there are not a lot of tracks to go to. There is Portland International Raceway (PIR) where a couple of his videos are shot, Pacific Raceway up near Seattle (Kent) (3.5 hour drive north) and Spokane Raceway in eastern Washington (~4.5 hour drive north east). Only PIR offers professional racing and the city is trying to shut it down. Not cool.
That is just 45 minutes north of where I live. I have been meaning to get up there and rent a kart for a few hours.
Up here, there are not a lot of tracks to go to. There is Portland International Raceway (PIR) where a couple of his videos are shot, Pacific Raceway up near Seattle (Kent) (3.5 hour drive north) and Spokane Raceway in eastern Washington (~4.5 hour drive north east). Only PIR offers professional racing and the city is trying to shut it down. Not cool.
Hey Dennis, great project you have going there. I would love to drive a copy in LFS... or real life
Is the "First Spin" video done at Pat's Acres in Canby?
Is the "First Spin" video done at Pat's Acres in Canby?
Well... he is shown as a developer for his login. Either it is a hack, or he has joined the team. Scaphlosier does not sound as good as Scavier.
Edit. LOL, 7 posts in under a minute
Edit. LOL, 7 posts in under a minute
With any simulation, there will generally be a point where the model you are using breaks down. I think that happens with LFS with lower tire pressures.
There are many systems in the world that depending on external conditions will change their behavior dramatically. A simple example is water. It is a liquid. Make it cold enough, it changes from a liquid to a solid. If you water simulator does not take that change into account, you will get some odd results.
I think that LFS models tires pretty darned well, but in certain cases, the model breaks down. I doubt there is much in the system about deformation due to low pressures, material flex, bead adhesion, etc. Plus, tires change how they react dramatically with pressure. It would be hard to completely model all of that realistically.
My suggestion for LFS is to limit the usable tire pressure range for each tire type. Then work on the heating algorithms a bit to tweak them in a bit better. That way, you wouldn't be able to use an unrealistic tire pressure to gain advantage and it would be the same for everybody. (Nobody IRL drives a street car on the track with only 22psi in the tires)
You also wouldn't have to try to model super low tire pressures in the system completely because you either have a reasonable tire pressure, or the tire is flat.
Maybe just tweaking the temperature and sidewall behavior would be enough, but limiting the tire pressure range would be effective too.
There are many systems in the world that depending on external conditions will change their behavior dramatically. A simple example is water. It is a liquid. Make it cold enough, it changes from a liquid to a solid. If you water simulator does not take that change into account, you will get some odd results.
I think that LFS models tires pretty darned well, but in certain cases, the model breaks down. I doubt there is much in the system about deformation due to low pressures, material flex, bead adhesion, etc. Plus, tires change how they react dramatically with pressure. It would be hard to completely model all of that realistically.
My suggestion for LFS is to limit the usable tire pressure range for each tire type. Then work on the heating algorithms a bit to tweak them in a bit better. That way, you wouldn't be able to use an unrealistic tire pressure to gain advantage and it would be the same for everybody. (Nobody IRL drives a street car on the track with only 22psi in the tires)
You also wouldn't have to try to model super low tire pressures in the system completely because you either have a reasonable tire pressure, or the tire is flat.
Maybe just tweaking the temperature and sidewall behavior would be enough, but limiting the tire pressure range would be effective too.
One of his points was that he drives a semi... I am guessing he is a long-haul driver and sleeps in the cab at night at rest stops. There is most likely no way to have an internet connection in that case.
I spend a lot of time with LFS offline. I do some hot lapping, but mostly I am preparing for league races. It would be tough to race in a league if you are gone from home for weeks at a time.
If you are into sports car racing, then LFS is really the best sim out there. It provides challenges on a different level than an arcade game does. Unfortunately in your case, to get the full enjoyment out of it, you really need to race online with other real people. You can spend a lot of time making skins, perfecting setups, working on getting that last 10th out of a particular combination, but the true satisfaction comes from racing other people online.
Just ignore the snide American bashers out there. We will just take the higher ground and assume they were just tongue in cheek comments.
I spend a lot of time with LFS offline. I do some hot lapping, but mostly I am preparing for league races. It would be tough to race in a league if you are gone from home for weeks at a time.
If you are into sports car racing, then LFS is really the best sim out there. It provides challenges on a different level than an arcade game does. Unfortunately in your case, to get the full enjoyment out of it, you really need to race online with other real people. You can spend a lot of time making skins, perfecting setups, working on getting that last 10th out of a particular combination, but the true satisfaction comes from racing other people online.
Just ignore the snide American bashers out there. We will just take the higher ground and assume they were just tongue in cheek comments.
Personally, I like the new sounds better for the most part. I think they are lacking at the top end on most cars, but there is only so much you can do with speakers and sound generation.
I do have one comment, and maybe it was said before, but I just wanted to comment.
I think the biggest difference (other than the basic tones) between what we hear in the game and what we hear in the car is the environment.
The way I look at it, the sounds we hear are as if you were driving down the road and there was nothing there but the engine, or nothing there but the transmission, or the exhaust. You then take all those sounds and pipe them to your ears at the same time. You end up with a decent mix, but you are still hearing individual sounds.
In a real car of any type, the whole car, and especially the cabin on a tin top, act like a resonance chamber. Yes, the different structures within the car will muffle sounds, but they will also transmit vibrations throughout the car and what we end up hearing is different from what was originally produced. We end up hearing different sounds, but we also hear mixed sounds and tones that can't really be traced back to just one source. Just try to isolate a noise in your own car some time. What is generating that sound? It is very hard to tell sometimes, especially when you have a squeak or rattle or clunk. You might be able to tell it is coming from the back of the car, but maybe not. It is like a giant mixing chamber that alters sounds enough as to make it more of a symphony than a group of single instruments.
Put the exact same engine, exhaust, transmission, differential, wheels, tires and the same level of sound proofing into two different cars, lets say a XRG and XFG (in the real world) and the cars will sound different while you are in the car. The engine might sound exactly the same as a single component, but the end result in the car will be different.
I think that the team is on the right track for the sounds. More work will be done in the future. What we hear now is great, it is so much more communicative than other sims. It will get better and better as we move forward.
I do have one comment, and maybe it was said before, but I just wanted to comment.
I think the biggest difference (other than the basic tones) between what we hear in the game and what we hear in the car is the environment.
The way I look at it, the sounds we hear are as if you were driving down the road and there was nothing there but the engine, or nothing there but the transmission, or the exhaust. You then take all those sounds and pipe them to your ears at the same time. You end up with a decent mix, but you are still hearing individual sounds.
In a real car of any type, the whole car, and especially the cabin on a tin top, act like a resonance chamber. Yes, the different structures within the car will muffle sounds, but they will also transmit vibrations throughout the car and what we end up hearing is different from what was originally produced. We end up hearing different sounds, but we also hear mixed sounds and tones that can't really be traced back to just one source. Just try to isolate a noise in your own car some time. What is generating that sound? It is very hard to tell sometimes, especially when you have a squeak or rattle or clunk. You might be able to tell it is coming from the back of the car, but maybe not. It is like a giant mixing chamber that alters sounds enough as to make it more of a symphony than a group of single instruments.
Put the exact same engine, exhaust, transmission, differential, wheels, tires and the same level of sound proofing into two different cars, lets say a XRG and XFG (in the real world) and the cars will sound different while you are in the car. The engine might sound exactly the same as a single component, but the end result in the car will be different.
I think that the team is on the right track for the sounds. More work will be done in the future. What we hear now is great, it is so much more communicative than other sims. It will get better and better as we move forward.
My observations on the sounds:
1)The sound is more clear with headphones, but lacks punch. With my speakers, the sound has more rasp to it. I can feel it vibrate my chest at certain throttle positions. This might be harmonics kicking in giving you that pulsing feeling. I have cheap speakers, so the rasp might just be distortion even though the volume is not that loud.
2) Road going cars definitely do have gear noise. It does get louder as you go faster and the pitch does go up. However, much of the time it is drowned out by the engine, road and wind noises combined. So the gear noise should not necessarily be lessened in the cars, but the engine note and road noise should mostly overwhelm it, but it should still be there as a component of the overall sound.
3) I think the transition from low RPM to high RPM should have a steeper volume increase. I just don't think the volume of the engine gets loud enough at higher RPM. This seems to particularly be a problem with the BF1. The engine sounds about the same as before, it is just drowned out by the gear and traction control noises.
4) For any competitive driving that I have ever seen, to include club racing, as a minimum, the driver's window must be down even in road cars for safety. The only time I have seen windows up is for track days and fun drives. This would allow a lot more tire, road, and wind noise.
5) This is a sim, not a real car. I think the tire noise must be adjustable in a wider range so we can hear it over the other noises. It might be a bit of a crutch, but I think it is needed because we can't feel the g's, so to speak.
6) For those that think the cars don't sound good, try driving them like you would a normal car on the street (because that is what you are really used to hearing). Don't shift when the red light tells you to; shift into 5th like you were cruising at 70 mph down the freeway. Most of the cars sounds right. Most of us have only heard race cars from outside, or from in-car videos. Every car is going to sound different, and depending on the microphone type and location, you will get vastly different sounds every time. Don't try to judge LFS sounds by those recordings. Take elements of them, yes, but don't try to make LFS sound like those recordings. For example, the gear noise in some recordings are totally intense. I suspect some of this is from the microphone location and is not representative of how the car would sound from the driver's seat.
1)The sound is more clear with headphones, but lacks punch. With my speakers, the sound has more rasp to it. I can feel it vibrate my chest at certain throttle positions. This might be harmonics kicking in giving you that pulsing feeling. I have cheap speakers, so the rasp might just be distortion even though the volume is not that loud.
2) Road going cars definitely do have gear noise. It does get louder as you go faster and the pitch does go up. However, much of the time it is drowned out by the engine, road and wind noises combined. So the gear noise should not necessarily be lessened in the cars, but the engine note and road noise should mostly overwhelm it, but it should still be there as a component of the overall sound.
3) I think the transition from low RPM to high RPM should have a steeper volume increase. I just don't think the volume of the engine gets loud enough at higher RPM. This seems to particularly be a problem with the BF1. The engine sounds about the same as before, it is just drowned out by the gear and traction control noises.
4) For any competitive driving that I have ever seen, to include club racing, as a minimum, the driver's window must be down even in road cars for safety. The only time I have seen windows up is for track days and fun drives. This would allow a lot more tire, road, and wind noise.
5) This is a sim, not a real car. I think the tire noise must be adjustable in a wider range so we can hear it over the other noises. It might be a bit of a crutch, but I think it is needed because we can't feel the g's, so to speak.
6) For those that think the cars don't sound good, try driving them like you would a normal car on the street (because that is what you are really used to hearing). Don't shift when the red light tells you to; shift into 5th like you were cruising at 70 mph down the freeway. Most of the cars sounds right. Most of us have only heard race cars from outside, or from in-car videos. Every car is going to sound different, and depending on the microphone type and location, you will get vastly different sounds every time. Don't try to judge LFS sounds by those recordings. Take elements of them, yes, but don't try to make LFS sound like those recordings.
For example, the gear noise in some recordings are totally intense. I suspect some of this is from the microphone location and is not representative of how the car would sound from the driver's seat.If you are a BMW guy, Last months issue of Roundel Magazine (the BMW Car Club of America magazine) has a section on the Dragon while driving a new BMW Z4 Coupe. Nice road, and nice car.
The only problem with using it in LFS, is it does not loop back on itself. You could only do a one lap race, or timed runs.
I grew up driving on roads similar to this. None of them as well maintained or quite as intense as the Dragon seems to be, but amazing stuff all the same. To us, it was just the normal thing. It was also the normal thing to lose a friend or two each year to those roads (and stupid driving). But, every time you are on a section like that, it is still fun to drive and you wonder what it would be like to drive it in LFS
The only problem with using it in LFS, is it does not loop back on itself. You could only do a one lap race, or timed runs.
I grew up driving on roads similar to this. None of them as well maintained or quite as intense as the Dragon seems to be, but amazing stuff all the same. To us, it was just the normal thing. It was also the normal thing to lose a friend or two each year to those roads (and stupid driving). But, every time you are on a section like that, it is still fun to drive and you wonder what it would be like to drive it in LFS
Cause and effect...
Don't let it worry you too much, just choose another server. There are lots out there.
I have little patients for drivers who don't pay attention. It is one of my faults I guess. I voted to kick a guy last night because he did not honor the blue flag, tried to race me, then blocked me into a corner. I did punt him, but not intentionally. I voted to kick him just to get his attention. I knew the rest of the guys on the server would not vote with me, they much prefer to teach and guide rather than punish.
If you wreck a lot and rejoin from the pits, are very much slower than everybody else on a server, or you become a moving chicane, even if you do try to observe the blue flags most of the time, you will still get booted or banned from some servers.
Pick another car or another server where the competition level is more suited for you. Or, if you are experienced, and it is just a new track/car combo for you, practice offline for a bit until you get up to speed.
I think that most people agree, as do I, that spamming Blue flag binds at cars that are way out of range is annoying, but is nothing worth worrying about too much. Just do your best, and if people are still being stupid about it, just pick a different server.
Who are you fighting for position with? A guy in front of you on the same lap? If so, you are right, you are entitled to fight for you position.
But at the same time, you are not allowed to hold up the lapping driver behind you. If you think that you can fight with the car lapping you, then you really do need to understand the blue flag "rules" better. It is a bit like golf though, everybody has a slightly different interpretation of the rules and it is on the honor system mostly.
These are realistic situations that happen in real races. You can use it to your advantage. The guy you are fighting with has the same requirement you do. Get behind the lapping car once you let them by. Draft him and use him as a pick to get inside your competitor and take the position.
Of course this is assuming that have not joined mid-race or something like that.
I guess I keyed in on this statement. In a way, I think I can see what you are saying, but that is like saying that aerodynamic drag by itself does not increase fuel consumption. If you have wind blowing over a car that is not moving, then no, drag does not increase fuel consumption. But, like tire pressure, it is part of the overall system and does affect fuel mileage in the racing environment.
Yeah, you did... in that other thread. I did not know about that and the way you worded things here, did not make it nearly as clear as to what you were saying.
I just get bugged when people say "prove me wrong". Like the believer saying that UFO's exist because nobody can prove they don't exist. Proving the negative is usually harder than the positive. Also, I believe the responsibility lies on yourself to make yourself clear and to prove your point, which obviously you did in that other thread.
The math would not have helped me much anyway, it has been too many years since I did calculus. :dunce:
At WOT, you will have the same fuel flow and therefore the same fuel burn rate with low pressure tires compared to high pressure tires, this is true. You will get to a higher top speed with higher pressure tires because of less rolling resistance.
However, MPG is Miles per gallon, not time per gallon. You will go more miles in a given time frame with higher pressure tires because you are going faster and therefore you will have better MPG.
Oh, and it is your responsibility to prove yourself right. It is not my responsibility to prove you wrong. Take some personal initiative and either do the thinking or do the work. For example, I could say "The universe is not infinite; prove me wrong". Kind of silly, don't you think
I think tire pressures in LFS used to get your optimum lap times are too low at the moment. You have to put the pressure low to get the tire temps up on the road tires. The race slicks might be close to the right zone. I think the cars feel better with higher pressure, but you lose a lot of grip.
If the official car name has a space in it, I have been seeing that space replaced with an "_". If that is the case, the game won't recognize the set as a valid set.
For example "Formula V8_BL1_Set.set" will download as "Formula_V8_BL1_Set.set" if you use the Open option in the download dialog box.
I do not know if this is an issue with the site you are downloading from, or if it is an LFS issue. I have seen it happen multiple times when using the Team Inferno setup field.
I take it he has never driven a powerful car near the limit... well neither have I, but I have taken the time to study the physics of racing from tires to suspensions. I am no expert and I can't do the math, but I understand how the car should behave.
I think the only way to convince him is to buy a seat for him in a performance driving school. Then he will learn about the circle of grip, steering with the throttle, power oversteer vs grip/slip angle oversteer, weight transfer etc.
Seeing as that is probably prohibitively expensive, try to demonstrate steering with the throttle. I am sure he has heard announcers talk about it while watching racing on TV. Try to get it to work in GT4... I doubt it will.
Also show him what a difference suspension and tire pressure settings make in LFS. I doubt GT4 setting cause anywhere near as much difference.
But, you probably won't convince him; possibly he just does it to piss you off anyway. Just smile and wave
and tell him to go back to playing his game.
I think the only way to convince him is to buy a seat for him in a performance driving school. Then he will learn about the circle of grip, steering with the throttle, power oversteer vs grip/slip angle oversteer, weight transfer etc.
Seeing as that is probably prohibitively expensive, try to demonstrate steering with the throttle. I am sure he has heard announcers talk about it while watching racing on TV. Try to get it to work in GT4... I doubt it will.
Also show him what a difference suspension and tire pressure settings make in LFS. I doubt GT4 setting cause anywhere near as much difference.
But, you probably won't convince him; possibly he just does it to piss you off anyway. Just smile and wave
and tell him to go back to playing his game.The noise is not that bad. If you wear a headset while racing, you can't really hear it at all anyway. If you use speakers, the speakers are much louder than the wheel. The only time it is a problem for me is when I have my microphone next to the wheel and I am using VoIP.
The DFP can't be beat for the money you pay for it.
The DFP can't be beat for the money you pay for it.
Just to keep this ancient thread alive...
I think LFS mods will be possible in the future, but one of the things that might make it a lot better than rF, is that you won't be tweaking the "physics".
You build the car using real life data: suspension type, mounting points, weight, weight distribution, engine type/size, coefficient of drag, etc. Then put it in the game. No physics changes, all you need is to download the car, which could possibly be automated to some degree.
Tracks would be close to the same. It could even be that Eric could provide a series of texture "pallets" that could be used for different tracks. As long as the traction settings for all of the textures are consistent, I don't see why it would be as much of a problem to support tracks than it is in rF.
But, anyway, that is years off for LFS. I am happy with the direction things are going now. I trust the devs to come up with a great system when and if they do get around to supporting mods.
I think LFS mods will be possible in the future, but one of the things that might make it a lot better than rF, is that you won't be tweaking the "physics".
You build the car using real life data: suspension type, mounting points, weight, weight distribution, engine type/size, coefficient of drag, etc. Then put it in the game. No physics changes, all you need is to download the car, which could possibly be automated to some degree.
Tracks would be close to the same. It could even be that Eric could provide a series of texture "pallets" that could be used for different tracks. As long as the traction settings for all of the textures are consistent, I don't see why it would be as much of a problem to support tracks than it is in rF.
But, anyway, that is years off for LFS. I am happy with the direction things are going now. I trust the devs to come up with a great system when and if they do get around to supporting mods.
Well, I may have spoken too soon. I went back to U23, and I am still having the problem. When I try to downshift too quickly, some shifts get missed. I did not have this problem before U25, but it looks like now it might be my controller (DFP) and not U25 that is causing it.
(tests for a minute) Nope, not my controller. I just tried it with my keyboard using the S key to downshift. I go at it quickly. I hit the key 3 times in succession. Sometimes I get three downshifts. But most of the time, I only get two. I am trying to make sure my finger completely clears the top of the key before pressing down again. Maybe it is some strange USB key repeat setting or something
I was one of the people who requested this feature.
But...
On fast down shifts in the FV8, it will skip some of my downshifts now. This is definitely new for U23, I have not tried 25 yet. I find it hard to beleive I am down shifting faster than 50ms. Is there any way to fine tune this because it should be a good feature.
Thanks again for all your work
Dude!
:headbang: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :ices_roflAlso, I find that Saturday and Sunday mornings can be quite nice. You catch the evening croud in Europe. The pings might be a bit high, but usually not bad enough to have an effect.
Evenings in the US are slower because a good portrion of the LFS racers are snoozing away in bed.
Happy devs are productive and creative devs
Thanks for the update.
Being involved in corporate software development, I really appreciate your method of development. Quality over quantity, exploring your own interests, and not working to a schedule. Just because no schedule exists, does NOT mean you are not being productive. Developing to a schedule inevitably leads to compromises and chopped features.
You will never see me complain about not seeing a release from you. I may want to see one desperately, but I won't complain about it.
Thanks for the update.
Being involved in corporate software development, I really appreciate your method of development. Quality over quantity, exploring your own interests, and not working to a schedule. Just because no schedule exists, does NOT mean you are not being productive. Developing to a schedule inevitably leads to compromises and chopped features.
You will never see me complain about not seeing a release from you. I may want to see one desperately, but I won't complain about it.
Interesting stuff. I bet we will see them in about 5 years on street cars. It is possible that we will see them in racing too.
I also wouldn't doubt that they will come up with a mechanical "pressure" adjustment as well. A band that expanded or contracted to allow for more or less give in the spring section.
I am not so sure about needing sidewalls. If your regular tire rolls over that far and it does touch, I don't think the sidewall is providing you any grip anyway. The grip still comes from the tread.
I also wouldn't doubt that they will come up with a mechanical "pressure" adjustment as well. A band that expanded or contracted to allow for more or less give in the spring section.
I am not so sure about needing sidewalls. If your regular tire rolls over that far and it does touch, I don't think the sidewall is providing you any grip anyway. The grip still comes from the tread.
Good job Renku, and all the rest of pool 2.
Turn one was a bit ugly for me. I was on the outside and chose to stay there as it looked like a mess on the inside. Unfortunately, I went a bit wide, and then had to avoid the car that had spun off in front. I hit the stupid sign there and that spun the car... those signes are supposed to be plastic... not concrete
illepall
I tried to catch Renku, but either he was too steady, or I was too erratic; probably the latter.
I made a lot of mistakes, but managed to keep the car off the wall. It was a long hard race, well fought, and generally clean.
Thanks guys.
And thanks again to the OLFSL staff. Another great race and another great season. Keep up the good work.
Turn one was a bit ugly for me. I was on the outside and chose to stay there as it looked like a mess on the inside. Unfortunately, I went a bit wide, and then had to avoid the car that had spun off in front. I hit the stupid sign there and that spun the car... those signes are supposed to be plastic... not concrete
illepall I tried to catch Renku, but either he was too steady, or I was too erratic; probably the latter.
I made a lot of mistakes, but managed to keep the car off the wall. It was a long hard race, well fought, and generally clean.
Thanks guys.
And thanks again to the OLFSL staff. Another great race and another great season. Keep up the good work.
I have flown some very sophisticated military simulators in my time... and I have seen them all do things like this. It is what happens when you use physics to model a specific environment. You obviously can't model all the physics of the real world, so you are left with quirks like this.
I think it is actually quite a good thing that LFS displays this type of stuff from time to time. It shows some really good stuff as far as how the car spins. It is just the level of energy that gets put into the spin and how long it lasts that are a tad out of whack. That probably has more to do with they physics calculating cycles than anything else.
The video is great! The car almost moves in sync with the song.
But, you could be a little less apologetic. Take the negative and turn it into a positive
I think it is actually quite a good thing that LFS displays this type of stuff from time to time. It shows some really good stuff as far as how the car spins. It is just the level of energy that gets put into the spin and how long it lasts that are a tad out of whack. That probably has more to do with they physics calculating cycles than anything else.
The video is great! The car almost moves in sync with the song.
But, you could be a little less apologetic. Take the negative and turn it into a positive
I think the ASS article proves something; you can't really evaluate a sim completely with just a quick review and by comparing a couple of parameters.
For all of you who only spent a few minutes with rF and declared it crap, well you just diminished all of us by doing that. I am not saying that you opinion is not valid, but it comes across as a blinders on fan boy kind of thing to do.
LFS suites me much, much better than rF. I have spent quite a bit of time in rF and I have found a bunch of things that greatly detract from its appeal for me. My initial impression of rF was not good. But that is not exacly fair so I spent some time with it and I would need to spend a lot more time with it to get it closer to good. However, that does point out one of LFS' strong points. It is much, much easier to cofigure the environment than rF is. Still, there are tricks you need to know about in LFS to get all that you can out of it. rF is the same way, but nothing is explained well, and you have to find settings in goofy ini files to make things closer to real.
The article points out a few things that rF has that LFS does not, damper settings, diff settings, etc. It may have settings for these things, but from playing around with the more limited settings available on other cars, they don't behave predictably and accurately like settings in LFS generally do.
I guess my point is, these type of article rarely address the meat of the issue and they also generally pick comparison points that generally don't mean a lot. I don't really care if rF has more damper settings, I care if those damper setting correspond to a reaction in the car like a real car would. That question is completely unanswered in the article.
rF is definitely over-grippy. I know it varies from car to car and mod to mod, but because the grip can be altered like that, it proves that grip curves try to map a result instead of the physics dictating a reaction.
For example, I tried the BMW M3 mod and I was easily able to lap Road America at the same times as an ALMS P1 prototype. The top speeds are way different. The difference was I was able to charge through the corners at a very unrealistically high speed with the M3. That does not build a lot of confidence in rF physics.
As far as the screenshots go... just read my second quote below. Nuff said.
For all of you who only spent a few minutes with rF and declared it crap, well you just diminished all of us by doing that. I am not saying that you opinion is not valid, but it comes across as a blinders on fan boy kind of thing to do.
LFS suites me much, much better than rF. I have spent quite a bit of time in rF and I have found a bunch of things that greatly detract from its appeal for me. My initial impression of rF was not good. But that is not exacly fair so I spent some time with it and I would need to spend a lot more time with it to get it closer to good. However, that does point out one of LFS' strong points. It is much, much easier to cofigure the environment than rF is. Still, there are tricks you need to know about in LFS to get all that you can out of it. rF is the same way, but nothing is explained well, and you have to find settings in goofy ini files to make things closer to real.
The article points out a few things that rF has that LFS does not, damper settings, diff settings, etc. It may have settings for these things, but from playing around with the more limited settings available on other cars, they don't behave predictably and accurately like settings in LFS generally do.
I guess my point is, these type of article rarely address the meat of the issue and they also generally pick comparison points that generally don't mean a lot. I don't really care if rF has more damper settings, I care if those damper setting correspond to a reaction in the car like a real car would. That question is completely unanswered in the article.
rF is definitely over-grippy. I know it varies from car to car and mod to mod, but because the grip can be altered like that, it proves that grip curves try to map a result instead of the physics dictating a reaction.
For example, I tried the BMW M3 mod and I was easily able to lap Road America at the same times as an ALMS P1 prototype. The top speeds are way different. The difference was I was able to charge through the corners at a very unrealistically high speed with the M3. That does not build a lot of confidence in rF physics.
As far as the screenshots go... just read my second quote below. Nuff said.
FGED GREDG RDFGDR GSFDG